Upgrading questions

OldBuzzard

OK folks, I'm looking at a pair of 4870s that I just bought, which are going to be replacing my trusty old 3870 X2.

One is an ATI branded one with the 'dust buster' HSF which exhausts to the outside of the case, and the other is a Sapphire with the 'open' HSF that will be exhausting some hot air into the case.

I'm thinking that for better 'heat management', that I would want to put the Sapphire in the top slot and the ATI in the bottom so that the ATI won't be drawing hot air coming from the Sapphire. Your thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Now another question arises as well. I'm going to be crossfiring them, and would like to do it with the least amount of hassle. However, I have 9 OSs to consider.

Would it be best to:

1. Install ONE, and then update the drivers in each OS, then shutdown and install the 2nd in crossfire?

2. Install both in NON Crossfire mode, install drivers, and then put on the ribbon and enable crossfire?

3. Install both in Crossfire. I think that I've read that trying to do directly to Crossfire can cause issues, so I'm looking for answers.

Finally, I'm also running two monitors. Once in Crossfire, do I run both monitors from the first card, or one monitor from each?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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BlueMak

For the heat, I would put the Sapphire where it would have the most "open" air available so that hot air doesn't flow immediately towards any other electronics.

As for the 3 questions, I would go with the first one. Seems safer to me.


About the monitors, I don't know, but my guess is both from the same card.

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The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis
This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm Sic semper tyrannis.

OldBuzzard

AAAAARRRGGGGGG....Ah HATES computers!!!!

Was getting ready to install the Sapphire Card, which meant that I had to re-do my WC loop since the 3870 X2 is water cooled. Was moving the EXOS and noticed WET

Turns out that I have a small leak in the reservoir. SO....until I can get a replacement from Koolance....I'm stuck using this poor little eee900, and pretty much limited to surfing and email

Probably be a week or better getting it, since Koolance isn't the fastest in the world for shipping

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

Optix

Ouch. That sucks.

I would say that you want your Sapphire on the bottom slot because your PCI-E slots are pretty close together on your motherboard model. The first option is definitly the way to go. Eliminate the possibility of anything going wrong by keeping it simple, get your OS's to where they need to be and then slap the bridge on.

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Mourgolikos

Put Sapphire on the lower slot because of the open space as BlueMak and Optix said. Don't worry about the second (ATI branded) taking Sapphires hot air, as that hot air will be spread to this open space beneath the card. The best would be to have a big side fan bringing cool air to both cards or use a Koolance waterblock again on Sapphire (or on both cards).

The most safe solution about installing the cards (in my opinion) is the first one, because installing both (doesn't matter if are in cf) without the driver pre-installed you will face many problems (such as wrong recognition and crashes). Make your system stable with one and then go with the second

As for the monitors you have to plug both of them in the first card. Second card will have no signal if you run them in crossfire. (Unless ATI has changed it very recently)


And really what are you doing with 9 OSs lol?

Hmm.. and why don't you sell both 4870 (maybe and the 3870x2) and buy one 5850? A bit better than 2x4870, with DX11 and total lower power consumption and temperatures.

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BlueMak

Since when is 5850 better than 2 4870s?

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The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis
This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm Sic semper tyrannis.

OldBuzzard

Indeed. With a 5850 I'd LOSE performance. The only thing I would gain would be DX11 support.

I'm still thinking that with the ATI on the bottom, drawing cool air, and exhausting the hot air to the outside of the case, would be best. As that would still leave cool air for the Sapphire to draw in, and the hot air that it's exhausting inside the case wouldn't be used by the ATI.

If the ATI was on top, it would be pulling in the hot air from the Sapphire.

Why 9 OSs? I use different OSs that are dedicated for certain applications. It keeps the OS 'lean & mean'. I have Vista and Win 7 partitions that do the same thing, as I'm migrating from Vista to 7. It allows me to use a 'mature' OS while I'm building the new one. Also, I have an XP partition for the wife so she can use an really old geneology program that won't run in Vista.

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

BlueMak

btw, I never said to put the sapphire on the bottom.

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The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis
This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm Sic semper tyrannis.

Mourgolikos

Ok two 4870 would be faster but don't forget that DX11 (without tessellation) can improve frame-rates a bit compared to DX10.1. Also many games (not the famous benchmark-games) show problems with crossfire (such as stuttering, or insignificant increase comparing to only one card).

About placing the cards you have to consider that Sapphire needs better airflow so it's memory chips can me cooled better, using that heatsinks. I have seen many cards with artifacts or low overclockability because of bad memory cooling. Also have in mind that the back side of the cards (core engine chip area) produce much heat too, so even the ATI with the "dust buster" will "throw" some heat to the upper card (Sapphire).
On the other hand the best bet is to try each way for a week (for example) measuring the temperatures It will not be so hard to rearrange the cards.


I just wanted to give my two cents and not to argue with you guys
Just my opinion

(I understand the use of different OSs, but it's my first time i see someone with more than four, so that was a big five-times-surprise for me. You will have to do many reboots :P)

In any case i wish you good luck

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BlueMak

I have hundrend+ games installed over the last year, no yet apart from the demo of NFS Shift...

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The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis
This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm Sic semper tyrannis.

OldBuzzard

BlueMak, I know you didn't say that. That was aimed at those that did.



Mourgolikos, I have the Cooler Master RC 690 Case with one fan on the side, and the option to put a 2nd one there as well if I wish, so getting cool air TO the cards isn't a problem. I could also put a fan or two on the top of the case as well. With the water block on the CPU there isn't a big HSF to impede airflow going UP, so I may do that as well.

The IDEAL thing would be to watercool both vid cards, but getting Koolance WBs for the 4870s would add $$ and they are getting hard to find as they are discontinued now.

I would have preferred a 4870 X2, but for just $200.00 total, these 2 single cards was just too good a deal to pass up

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

Optix

The reason I said the Sapphire should be on the bottom is because all of that heat will get shot straight back at the back side of your standard ATI card before it starts to radiate upwards. I checked out your motherboard and those PCI-E slots are pretty close together so I can see that heat getting trapped for a bit.

Judging by your case I'm sure it won't make that much difference but if you overclock like I do every degree counts.

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SeraphicSorcerer

I agree with Optix on placement, I have not noticed any issues regarding problems with Crossfire for systems I've built.

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OldBuzzard

Another thought comes to mind as well.

I'm going to have 3870 X2 with no 'home'.

Now, #1 son has a Koolance case, and he's running my old 4800+ X2 with an HD 4850 for a vid card.

Assuming, the 3870 X2 would even fit into his case, which would be the better card, the 4850 or 3870 X2?

I'm thinking that the X2 outperforms the 4850.

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

BlueMak

I have a suspicion that the 3870X2 will be at least very similar to the 4850. Depending on the games he plays, the 4850 might be a better choise since it won't have to use crossfire for its performance.

__________________

The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis
This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm Sic semper tyrannis.

blibbax

The 3870X2 carries all the disadvantages of being dual GPU, while being little if at all faster than the 4850 at the best of times.

Remember that the single GPU 3870 was a 9600GT rival while the 4850 is a GTS250 rival - so, for an easier comparison between more similar architectures, the GTS250 which essentially contains twice as many processing units at a higher clock than the 9600GT is obviously going to be faster than 9600GT SLI.

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