a problem with locked samplerate

neunen · Mar 13, 2004, 03:19 AM

if eugene happens to read this i would first like to say thank you very much and i apologize if the following post resembles rambling...any help would be greatly appreciated

so the problem i am having is this...
with my sample rate set to 48khz certain vstis (ie lounge lizard) running in cubase play at 1 semitone and 43 cents to high
while others are still in tune
i when i first notived this problem i tried running a number of my synths / samplers through a vst tuner (c_tuner)
which at the time informed me that my lounge lizard and evp73 etc. were in tune but everything else was slightly too low.
however another tuner (tunerex by nuton) informed me that my lounge lizard etc was in fact out of tune (too high) and that everything else was in tune. so what was throwing me for a loop at that point was why would 2 chromatic tuners give me different results? checking the actual waves themselves determined that tunerex was the tuner giving me correct results and that my lounge lizard was indeed playing slightly too high.

running these same vstis and tuners through fruityloops (primary sound driver) (44.1 khz) my synths/samplers were in tune and both tuners were giving me accurate results.
so i guess my question is; is there anyway i can get around this? can i have the recording samplerate set to 48 and the vst playback set to 44.1....wait, i have a feeling that is a stupid question

is there anything i can do?
and any ideas why C_tuner would be affected by samplerate while TunerEx was correct under both samplerates?
or why certain vstis would be affected by samplerate while others are not?
should i streamline and clarify this post?
am i going crazy?

thanks for your time, and once again thanks for the drivers
neunen

miguel · Mar 13, 2004, 07:00 PM

to me it looks like a problem with either the host program or the vsti. One of them is either not telling or not hearingeach other about the correct sample rate. I wouldn't blame kx on this. Of cours eI may be completely wrong

neunen · Mar 13, 2004, 10:16 PM

i wasnt blaming the problem on kx (i hope it didnt come off that way) but it is definitly due to the certain vsts that are apparently affected by the samplerate (which doesnt make much sense to me, i could see if it were samplers or wavetable synths, but i think the lounge lizard is a modeling synth) and i just figured this would be a good place to ask for help (like, is there anything i can change about the drivers to compensate for this? i understand that the recording samplerate on my sblive is locked to 48khz for the time being but what makes certain vsts change pitch?) ...any ideas? anything? or should i just go try to get answers from the vst manufacturers?....thanks again, neunen

miguel · Mar 14, 2004, 06:28 AM

well i tought the synth might be playing thiking it's to be played at 44100 but then the host grabs the samples and outs them at 48, so it sounds roughly a little more than a semiton4e higher

neunen · Mar 14, 2004, 07:28 AM

good point
if that is the case, i wonder if those vsts in question are incapable of running at 48khz or "locked" into 44.1khz. and the others are just "cool with it"
all the results so far have been the same in all the hosts i have tried. but i havent had a chance to check the standalone mode of lounge lizard. (next on my list)...and then i am going to reluctanly go through all of my synths and make a list of the ones that go out of tune. urg, i wish i was more programming savvy.

i wonder what the "primary sound driver 44.1" that my fruityloops is set to is exactly...because the only options i have in cubase are the kx drivers

anyways, thanks for your thoughts. please let me know if you think of anything else that may be of help to me.

cheers and thanks

neunen ( i need some sleep)

miguel · Mar 14, 2004, 04:26 PM

well, the synth engine could be locked at some samplerate, 44100 or whatever lower number to save computation, but I believe the vst system provides means to inform plugins about the "real" sample rate, and thus the synth should internally resample whatever data it generates. Or maybe it's the host's duty to sample convert, really i'm just making uninformed guesses. Anyway i'd point to the vsti as the guilty one

Toadly_Ossum · Mar 15, 2004, 05:55 PM

Ive had the same problem using Lounge lizard within Cubase and VSTack. Im pretty sure the problem is in Lounge lizard.

When I initialy load Cubase and Lounge Lizard with Asio set to 48Khz Lounge Lizard is definatly out of tune. Setting the Asio 44.1Khz will correct the tune issue, but then as most of us know you cant record any audio when running at 44.1Khz.

Interestingly enough Just changing it from 48 to 44.1 and BACK TO 48Khz seems to fix it!. Then Lounge is in tune and I can record. Any Cubase projects that have both Lounge and Recorded audio I have to do this every time before I start work. Just change from 48 to 44.1 and then BACK to 48 and every thing works fine.

I also use Lounge in my live setup through VSTack. I have to make sure that I set sample rate to 44.1 before using it in my live/stage setup.

Not sure if this work around helps you or not. But at least you know your NOT CRAZY!

Toadly
AKA Schel Sullivan

Mar 13, 2004, 03:19 AM	#1
neunen DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 3 Rep Power: 0	a problem with 48khz sample rate if eugene happens to read this i would first like to say thank you very much and i apologize if the following post resembles rambling...any help would be greatly appreciated so the problem i am having is this... with my sample rate set to 48khz certain vstis (ie lounge lizard) running in cubase play at 1 semitone and 43 cents to high while others are still in tune i when i first notived this problem i tried running a number of my synths / samplers through a vst tuner (c_tuner) which at the time informed me that my lounge lizard and evp73 etc. were in tune but everything else was slightly too low. however another tuner (tunerex by nuton) informed me that my lounge lizard etc was in fact out of tune (too high) and that everything else was in tune. so what was throwing me for a loop at that point was why would 2 chromatic tuners give me different results? checking the actual waves themselves determined that tunerex was the tuner giving me correct results and that my lounge lizard was indeed playing slightly too high. running these same vstis and tuners through fruityloops (primary sound driver) (44.1 khz) my synths/samplers were in tune and both tuners were giving me accurate results. so i guess my question is; is there anyway i can get around this? can i have the recording samplerate set to 48 and the vst playback set to 44.1....wait, i have a feeling that is a stupid question is there anything i can do? and any ideas why C_tuner would be affected by samplerate while TunerEx was correct under both samplerates? or why certain vstis would be affected by samplerate while others are not? should i streamline and clarify this post? am i going crazy? thanks for your time, and once again thanks for the drivers neunen Last edited by neunen; Mar 13, 2004 at 05:32 AM.

Mar 13, 2004, 07:00 PM	#2
miguel DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 209 Rep Power: 0	to me it looks like a problem with either the host program or the vsti. One of them is either not telling or not hearingeach other about the correct sample rate. I wouldn't blame kx on this. Of cours eI may be completely wrong

Mar 13, 2004, 10:16 PM	Thread Starter #3
neunen DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 3 Rep Power: 0	i wasnt blaming the problem on kx (i hope it didnt come off that way) but it is definitly due to the certain vsts that are apparently affected by the samplerate (which doesnt make much sense to me, i could see if it were samplers or wavetable synths, but i think the lounge lizard is a modeling synth) and i just figured this would be a good place to ask for help (like, is there anything i can change about the drivers to compensate for this? i understand that the recording samplerate on my sblive is locked to 48khz for the time being but what makes certain vsts change pitch?) ...any ideas? anything? or should i just go try to get answers from the vst manufacturers?....thanks again, neunen

Mar 14, 2004, 06:28 AM	#4
miguel DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 209 Rep Power: 0	well i tought the synth might be playing thiking it's to be played at 44100 but then the host grabs the samples and outs them at 48, so it sounds roughly a little more than a semiton4e higher

Mar 14, 2004, 07:28 AM	Thread Starter #5
neunen DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 3 Rep Power: 0	good point if that is the case, i wonder if those vsts in question are incapable of running at 48khz or "locked" into 44.1khz. and the others are just "cool with it" all the results so far have been the same in all the hosts i have tried. but i havent had a chance to check the standalone mode of lounge lizard. (next on my list)...and then i am going to reluctanly go through all of my synths and make a list of the ones that go out of tune. urg, i wish i was more programming savvy. i wonder what the "primary sound driver 44.1" that my fruityloops is set to is exactly...because the only options i have in cubase are the kx drivers anyways, thanks for your thoughts. please let me know if you think of anything else that may be of help to me. cheers and thanks neunen ( i need some sleep)

Mar 14, 2004, 04:26 PM	#6
miguel DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 209 Rep Power: 0	well, the synth engine could be locked at some samplerate, 44100 or whatever lower number to save computation, but I believe the vst system provides means to inform plugins about the "real" sample rate, and thus the synth should internally resample whatever data it generates. Or maybe it's the host's duty to sample convert, really i'm just making uninformed guesses. Anyway i'd point to the vsti as the guilty one

Mar 15, 2004, 05:55 PM	#7
Toadly_Ossum DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 228 Rep Power: 0	Ive had the same problem using Lounge lizard within Cubase and VSTack. Im pretty sure the problem is in Lounge lizard. When I initialy load Cubase and Lounge Lizard with Asio set to 48Khz Lounge Lizard is definatly out of tune. Setting the Asio 44.1Khz will correct the tune issue, but then as most of us know you cant record any audio when running at 44.1Khz. Interestingly enough Just changing it from 48 to 44.1 and BACK TO 48Khz seems to fix it!. Then Lounge is in tune and I can record. Any Cubase projects that have both Lounge and Recorded audio I have to do this every time before I start work. Just change from 48 to 44.1 and then BACK to 48 and every thing works fine. I also use Lounge in my live setup through VSTack. I have to make sure that I set sample rate to 44.1 before using it in my live/stage setup. Not sure if this work around helps you or not. But at least you know your NOT CRAZY! Toadly AKA Schel Sullivan