Ogg Vorbis OR MP3?

Necrosis · Aug 11, 2002, 09:14 AM

Which do you prefer? If you vote "other" please specify with a reply.

~~Sourcer_2002~~ · Aug 11, 2002, 09:39 AM

MP3

radTube · Aug 11, 2002, 10:02 AM

Ogg Vorbis of course... You've got to be deaf not to hear the difference.

e-Seeker · Aug 11, 2002, 11:06 AM

Haven't voted, since I can't really make up my mind

Would have to agree to the difference in audio quality between Ogg V. and MP3, but since MP3's in my blood for several years, well... you get the picture...

Necrosis · Aug 11, 2002, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dEykeÃ©
Haven't voted, since I can't really make up my mind

Would have to agree to the difference in audio quality between Ogg V. and MP3, but since MP3's in my blood for several years, well... you get the picture...

You'll get over it.

e-Seeker · Aug 12, 2002, 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Necrosis
You'll get over it.

Yeah, I know

; Can't wait 'til I do, I like to embrace new things...

Starscream · Aug 12, 2002, 05:03 AM

Mp3. Why? All of my music is already in that format. There's no point in taking the time converting my mp3's to ogg, the vast majority are 256 and 320 kbps and I'm not going to gain any quality converting from one compressed format to another.

If I'm ripping a cd I might try out high quality ogg encoding. I'm pretty happy with 320kbps mp3's though.

Malus · Aug 12, 2002, 06:36 AM

I'm one of those weirdos who just listens to CDs. Why waste my time with any sort of file format when WMP 9 play my vast collection of CDs quite nicely?

e-Seeker · Aug 12, 2002, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Starscream
Mp3. Why? All of my music is already in that format. There's no point in taking the time converting my mp3's to ogg, the vast majority are 256 and 320 kbps and I'm not going to gain any quality converting from one compressed format to another.

If I'm ripping a cd I might try out high quality ogg encoding. I'm pretty happy with 320kbps mp3's though.

Yeah, I know what you mean; 320kbps by me, too...

Which pulls up another question; what do you guys think of WMA? I dunno, haven't really noticed any difference between an 128kbps MP3 and a 64kbps WMA...

radTube · Aug 12, 2002, 08:29 AM

You can find great articles on the internet on how the different formats compare. I've got the impression that ogg and maybe mp3pro are the overall winners. Sorry, can't be bothered to find a link just now as I'm working on a web page that should already be finished... Most of my music is still in mp3 format, but everything I've ripped lately is Ogg.

Zardon · Aug 12, 2002, 10:35 AM

well im into audio in a big way, and after talking to necrosis today, I decided to give ogg a real try out. I have something like 60 gig of Mp3s on my raid.

After ripping several test files from various high quality CDs ranging from Vangelis, a little classical to some well recorded Mike oldfield, Jazz and some mainstream pop music along with a little light Jazz in the way of Diana Krall.

Ogg can most certainly handle complex passages extremely well, with great control over bass and strings, sounding much less trapped, and more open than you can get with an equivalently ripped MP3, at 128kps or 160-190kps. incidentally i have never been a fan of WMA files.

Using variable bitrate on MP3 at a high setting, brings things much closer between the formats, but I have to say, there is something special about this ogg format, an openness ive yet to hear from a compressed music format (mp3 pro is close), whether of course your ears or audio system are up to the task is another matter but wiring it through my high end marantz seperates system you can most certainly hear the difference, its also less harsh.

Also there is the small matter of compatibility with portable systems etc. I dont think my compaq IPAQ can handle OGG (ill have to try it later).

My verdict is, for quality use ogg at a high bitrate, with a program like Easy CD-DA Extractor V5 handling the ripping and conversion with track titles etc and playing back through winamp, sonique and Zinf also handle playback very well (although I prefer winamp playback for Ogg)

The problem is MP3 has such a foothold in the market I doubt anything will challenge its market dominance, but I think Ogg will get a strong cult following from the audio geeks.

Well worth a look, thanks necrosis for the heads up today

http://www.vorbis.com/

Necrosis · Aug 12, 2002, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Starscream
Mp3. Why? All of my music is already in that format. There's no point in taking the time converting my mp3's to ogg, the vast majority are 256 and 320 kbps and I'm not going to gain any quality converting from one compressed format to another.

If I'm ripping a cd I might try out high quality ogg encoding. I'm pretty happy with 320kbps mp3's though.

Most of my music is in that format as well. Am I going to transcode everything over? Nope! I would suggest you give it a chance; can't hurt to try.

Necrosis · Aug 12, 2002, 12:18 PM

Malus wrote:

Quote:

I'm one of those weirdos who just listens to CDs. Why waste my time with any sort of file format when WMP 9 play my vast collection of CDs quite nicely?

I'm also one of those weirdos that listens to CD's too. At work, in my truck and even at home on my stereo. I even listen to them on my computer too. However, it is very convenient to ripp those CD's on my computer and not have to worry abouting changing CD's. You can also protect your investment that way was as well. What is the worst thing to happen to a CD? Scratches! How does that happen? Letting people borrow them; being transported around. Ripping your CD's give you so many new options. We all like having more options, don't we?

dEykeÃ© wrote:

Quote:

Which pulls up another question; what do you guys think of WMA? I dunno, haven't really noticed any difference between an 128kbps MP3 and a 64kbps WMA...

WMA? I have seven files in my collection in this format. I can't believe you can't hear the difference in bitrates, I surely can. Many portable players will also support this format though; WMA has always sounded very flat to me, lifeless and too digital.

Ogg Vorbis to me gives the music a warmer analog sound; reminds me of a hight quality reel - reel recording.

Zardon · Aug 12, 2002, 12:22 PM

yes I agree necrosis, I havent heard a better compressed music format yet that ogg. especially if you play it through some high end equipment.

e-Seeker · Aug 12, 2002, 02:40 PM

Well, I've decided to stick with Ogg; I've ripped/encoded some A-CD's into Ogg and compared it with the same songs which were in MP3, and am def. continuing to use Ogg as my default...
Ah, my head hurts from constant listening, should give it a rest for some time...

Yeti · Aug 12, 2002, 02:58 PM

CD (or Wave) is much better than any compressed format. So there.

Necrosis · Aug 12, 2002, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Yeti
CD (or Wave) is much better than any compressed format. So there.

You must like buying hard drives. DVD Audio is better than both of those so THERE!!

e-Seeker · Aug 12, 2002, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Necrosis
You must like buying hard drives. DVD Audio is better than both of those so THERE!!

ROTFLMAO!

DTS, of course!

Yeti · Aug 12, 2002, 04:40 PM

Quote:

You must like buying hard drives. DVD Audio is better than both of those so THERE!! wink

No, that simply means i choose to listen to CD's. And i'm not talking about my computer... i'm talking about a HiFi... You realize that a typical sound-card (16x48) is only capable of delivering ~768kbps output... whereas a CD audio is 1440 kbps.

Necrosis · Aug 12, 2002, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Yeti

Quote:

You must like buying hard drives. DVD Audio is better than both of those so THERE!! wink

No, that simply means i choose to listen to CD's. And i'm not talking about my computer... i'm talking about a HiFi... You realize that a typical sound-card (16x48) is only capable of delivering ~768kbps output... whereas a CD audio is 1440 kbps.

Can you hear that? When you start using words like "typical" you run into the problem of what a person's average viewpoint is. I could have a Delta sitting in my rig right now; I could think that is typical. CD's are still only 16 bit playback as well. In Professional audio their dealing with 24 bit often. We could get very specific, and also talk about what the CD is made out of too. Gold CD's a superior to aluminum for playback quality. It can go on, and on. Truly it is like comparing a 1.3GHz Athlon to a 1.33 GHz. Everyone that has heard my setup (including myself) has been quite impressed with it's sonic signature and sound reproduction. I can hear the difference in a 128k mp3 vs a 160k mp3 file. It also depends on the DAC's on the sound card too. I know some cards even have better DACs than what you will find on most CD players.

Vampyromaniac · Aug 12, 2002, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Yeti

No, that simply means i choose to listen to CD's. And i'm not talking about my computer... i'm talking about a HiFi... You realize that a typical sound-card (16x48) is only capable of delivering ~768kbps output... whereas a CD audio is 1440 kbps.

Eh, you forgot to multiply by 2 for STEREO sound, haha. 44100x16x2 = 1411200 (1411kbps)

Quote:

Originally posted by Zardon

I havent heard a better compressed music format yet that ogg.

This one's for Necrosis . . . .
How about AC-3? You know, the Dolby Digital format on DVD's? Well, don't scoff just yet! A single 6-channel AC3 stream runs at 384kbps. So a 2-channel (that's stereo, Yeti

) stream would be 128kbps of full DVD-quality audio. Surely that would sound better than OGG. See, you were on to something, Necrosis!

Now, I just need to find a way to encode a .WAV into a 2-channel .AC3 . . . and, of course a player, lol.

Maybe Jesus will bring me a freeware AC3 encoder and an AC3 plug-in for WinAmp this coming Chanukkah.

FuNsTeR · Aug 12, 2002, 11:17 PM

With over 2,100 cds yes original ones and 700 cd singles and 800 cassetes and 700 7" vinyl and 150 lps and roughly 200 limited edition vinyls ie picture discs etc i feel im entitled to download mp3s for the formats that i can't put on my pc i only have Mp3s of the music i own i use audiocatlyst 2.1 that program is da biz best mp3 ripper their is so basically the music biz can't bitch t me i hafta say i did d/l some puddle of mudd stuff and some pod and ended up buying the albums

Necrosis · Aug 12, 2002, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FuNsTeR1970
With over 2,100 cds yes original ones and 700 cd singles and 800 cassetes and 700 7" vinyl and 150 lps and roughly 200 limited edition vinyls ie picture discs etc i feel im entitled to download mp3s for the formats that i can't put on my pc i only have Mp3s of the music i own i use audiocatlyst 2.1 that program is da biz best mp3 ripper their is so basically the music biz can't bitch t me i hafta say i did d/l some puddle of mudd stuff and some pod and ended up buying the albums

Sheesh!

What you are trying to do open up your own radio station or something??

Necrosis · Aug 12, 2002, 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Vampyromaniac
Eh, you forgot to multiply by 2 for STEREO sound, haha. 44100x16x2 = 1411200 (1411kbps)

This one's for Necrosis . . . .
How about AC-3? You know, the Dolby Digital format on DVD's? Well, don't scoff just yet! A single 6-channel AC3 stream runs at 384kbps. So a 2-channel (that's stereo, Yeti ) stream would be 128kbps of full DVD-quality audio. Surely that would sound better than OGG. See, you were on to something, Necrosis!

Now, I just need to find a way to encode a .WAV into a 2-channel .AC3 . . . and, of course a player, lol.

Maybe Jesus will bring me a freeware AC3 encoder and an AC3 plug-in for WinAmp this coming Chanukkah.

Oh yes AC-3. How silly of me!

How about DirectDVD for a player & ripper? I know it can do something of this nature but haven't experimented with it too much. DirectDVD isn't well known to most people who use ATI cards, WinDVD, or PowerDVD. It's a wee bit more tweakable too, for the hardcore types.

FuNsTeR · Aug 12, 2002, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Necrosis
Sheesh!

What you are trying to do open up your own radio station or something??

lol no i just love my music i have all 23 Queen albums in multi formats ie cds vinyl picture disc cassettes etc my pal has over 12,000 cds he buys 10 a week

Ryo-Ohki · Aug 13, 2002, 04:12 AM

OGG is my way to go from now on (the ratio quality/size is unbeatable). I've got a vast archive of MP3s on my hard drive also, but since Winamp plays both seamlessly...

And yes, I too buy my CDs, and even occasionnaly listen to them. However I DO prefer carrying a dozen CD-Rs loaded with encoded music than my whole audio CD collection, go figure

And since my regular audio system probably can't rival with my PC...

params · Aug 13, 2002, 05:41 AM

I make music (although haven't done anything for a while) and so am stuck with the dilemma of users!

Although it would be nice to switch to Ogg Vorbis or WMA or any other format, but MP3 is what the public knows. It's what the music hosting sites know.

Unless you set up your own site (which then runs in to the problems of publicity etc) the outlet just simply isn't there for non-MP3 codecs.

Maybe this poll should be delayed for a year and see if the position changes.

P.

WyreTheWolf · Aug 13, 2002, 06:52 AM

Live music is the only way to fly

Zardon · Aug 13, 2002, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by params
I make music (although haven't done anything for a while) and so am stuck with the dilemma of users!

Although it would be nice to switch to Ogg Vorbis or WMA or any other format, but MP3 is what the public knows. It's what the music hosting sites know.

Unless you set up your own site (which then runs in to the problems of publicity etc) the outlet just simply isn't there for non-MP3 codecs.

Maybe this poll should be delayed for a year and see if the position changes.

P.

I agree, but in saying all that, personally im going to be ripping all my future CDs to OGG at highest bitrate to my hard drives, then if I need to share them or play them on my portable as MP3 ill use a convertor such as the new excellent Easy CD-DA convertor V5.

MP3 owns the market but thats not to say its the best, and when ive a choice ill be using OGG.

DD51 · Aug 13, 2002, 10:38 AM

I just downloaded and tried OGG VORBIS and I must say that I'm
Totally impressed for such a low bitrate (AVG. 114KB)

What pisses me off is that my MP3 Car Stereo does not recognize it.
I have about 4000 songs ripped with EAC w/alt preset standard and would switch
"in a blink of an eye" if my Car Stereo would read the dam thing!!!!

It's an awesome program and wins hands down vs. MP3 but the downside that it doesn't work in my Car Stereo is the shitz!!

(Don't mean to brag but I have an awesome Car Stereo system)

Aug 11, 2002, 09:14 AM	#1
Necrosis HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,838 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	Ogg Vorbis OR MP3? Which do you prefer? If you vote "other" please specify with a reply.

Aug 11, 2002, 10:02 AM	#3
radTube just keepin' it cool Join Date: May 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 228 Rep Power: 0	Ogg Vorbis of course... You've got to be deaf not to hear the difference. __________________ [color=orange] [/color]

Aug 11, 2002, 11:06 AM	#4
e-Seeker AKA e-Seeker Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Croatia, Zagreb Posts: 943 Rep Power: 0	... Haven't voted, since I can't really make up my mind Would have to agree to the difference in audio quality between Ogg V. and MP3, but since MP3's in my blood for several years, well... you get the picture... __________________

Aug 12, 2002, 05:03 AM	#7
Starscream King of the Decepticons! Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Cybertron Posts: 117 Rep Power: 0	Mp3. Why? All of my music is already in that format. There's no point in taking the time converting my mp3's to ogg, the vast majority are 256 and 320 kbps and I'm not going to gain any quality converting from one compressed format to another. If I'm ripping a cd I might try out high quality ogg encoding. I'm pretty happy with 320kbps mp3's though. __________________ Over and outie...

Aug 12, 2002, 06:36 AM	#8
Malus BSD SMASH! Join Date: May 2002 Location: A rabbit hole. . . Posts: 1,170 Rep Power: 0	I'm one of those weirdos who just listens to CDs. Why waste my time with any sort of file format when WMP 9 play my vast collection of CDs quite nicely? __________________ quad (FreeBSD/amd64 8-CURRENT): Intel Q6600 - Asus P5E-VM HDMI - 2x2 GB Kingston PC6400 DDR2 Ram - Seagate 320GB 7200RPM HD - 2xSeagate 1TB 7200RPM HD in RAID 1 via ZFS - Lite-On 20x DVD Multi Recorder - Coolermaster Centurion 5 router (FreeBSD/amd64 8-CURRENT): Intel E4500 - Intel D945GCNL - 2 GB PC6400 Mushkin Ram - Lite-On 48x24x48x16 - Seagate 320GB 7200RPM HD - Silverstone SST-SG02-F wanderer (FreeBSD/i386 7-CURRENT): Lenovo Thinkpad T61p mini (OS X 10.5): Intel Core 2 Duo @ 1.8Ghz, 4 GB Mushkin PC5400 Ram - Headroom MicroDAC Portable sound: Rockboxed iPod Video -> Westone UM2's Not-So-Portable Sound: Headroon MicroDAC -> Singlepower PPX3-SLAM -> Grado RS-1's or Beyerdynamic DT-880's Very-Not-Portable-Sound: Squeezebox v3 -> Denon AVR-1507 -> B&W 683's & Sunfire HRS-10

Aug 11, 2002, 09:39 AM	#2
~~Sourcer_2002~~ BANNED Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Indiana , USA Posts: 2,677 Rep Power: 0	MP3

Aug 12, 2002, 08:29 AM	#10
radTube just keepin' it cool Join Date: May 2002 Location: Finland Posts: 228 Rep Power: 0	You can find great articles on the internet on how the different formats compare. I've got the impression that ogg and maybe mp3pro are the overall winners. Sorry, can't be bothered to find a link just now as I'm working on a web page that should already be finished... Most of my music is still in mp3 format, but everything I've ripped lately is Ogg. __________________ [color=orange] [/color]

Aug 12, 2002, 10:35 AM	#11
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	im a MP3 diehard but ........ well im into audio in a big way, and after talking to necrosis today, I decided to give ogg a real try out. I have something like 60 gig of Mp3s on my raid. After ripping several test files from various high quality CDs ranging from Vangelis, a little classical to some well recorded Mike oldfield, Jazz and some mainstream pop music along with a little light Jazz in the way of Diana Krall. Ogg can most certainly handle complex passages extremely well, with great control over bass and strings, sounding much less trapped, and more open than you can get with an equivalently ripped MP3, at 128kps or 160-190kps. incidentally i have never been a fan of WMA files. Using variable bitrate on MP3 at a high setting, brings things much closer between the formats, but I have to say, there is something special about this ogg format, an openness ive yet to hear from a compressed music format (mp3 pro is close), whether of course your ears or audio system are up to the task is another matter but wiring it through my high end marantz seperates system you can most certainly hear the difference, its also less harsh. Also there is the small matter of compatibility with portable systems etc. I dont think my compaq IPAQ can handle OGG (ill have to try it later). My verdict is, for quality use ogg at a high bitrate, with a program like Easy CD-DA Extractor V5 handling the ripping and conversion with track titles etc and playing back through winamp, sonique and Zinf also handle playback very well (although I prefer winamp playback for Ogg) The problem is MP3 has such a foothold in the market I doubt anything will challenge its market dominance, but I think Ogg will get a strong cult following from the audio geeks. Well worth a look, thanks necrosis for the heads up today http://www.vorbis.com/

Aug 12, 2002, 12:22 PM	#14
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	yes I agree necrosis, I havent heard a better compressed music format yet that ogg. especially if you play it through some high end equipment.

Aug 12, 2002, 02:40 PM	#15
e-Seeker AKA e-Seeker Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Croatia, Zagreb Posts: 943 Rep Power: 0	... Well, I've decided to stick with Ogg; I've ripped/encoded some A-CD's into Ogg and compared it with the same songs which were in MP3, and am def. continuing to use Ogg as my default... Ah, my head hurts from constant listening, should give it a rest for some time... __________________

Aug 12, 2002, 02:58 PM	#16
Yeti DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 662 Rep Power: 0	CD (or Wave) is much better than any compressed format. So there. __________________ --Oh lord not again

Aug 12, 2002, 11:17 PM	#22
FuNsTeR Caledonian and Proud Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Darkest Ayrshire Posts: 1,304 Rep Power: 88 System Specs	With over 2,100 cds yes original ones and 700 cd singles and 800 cassetes and 700 7" vinyl and 150 lps and roughly 200 limited edition vinyls ie picture discs etc i feel im entitled to download mp3s for the formats that i can't put on my pc i only have Mp3s of the music i own i use audiocatlyst 2.1 that program is da biz best mp3 ripper their is so basically the music biz can't bitch t me i hafta say i did d/l some puddle of mudd stuff and some pod and ended up buying the albums __________________ "They say when you play a Microsoft CD backwards you can hear satanic messages ..... but that's nothing, if you play it forward it will install Windows"

Aug 13, 2002, 04:12 AM	#26
Ryo-Ohki World Destroyer Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Masaki Shrine Posts: 196 Rep Power: 0	OGG is my way to go from now on (the ratio quality/size is unbeatable). I've got a vast archive of MP3s on my hard drive also, but since Winamp plays both seamlessly... And yes, I too buy my CDs, and even occasionnaly listen to them. However I DO prefer carrying a dozen CD-Rs loaded with encoded music than my whole audio CD collection, go figure And since my regular audio system probably can't rival with my PC... __________________ Join the Hanners cult NOW and save your soul! "Bork Bork Bork!" On Rear of Big Rig, San Fransisco, CA Warning! Do not attempt to drive under, over, or through this truck. If you should choose to ignore this warning, good luck and have fun! Do not pass on right side.

Aug 13, 2002, 05:41 AM	#27
params DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 29 Rep Power: 0	I make music (although haven't done anything for a while) and so am stuck with the dilemma of users! Although it would be nice to switch to Ogg Vorbis or WMA or any other format, but MP3 is what the public knows. It's what the music hosting sites know. Unless you set up your own site (which then runs in to the problems of publicity etc) the outlet just simply isn't there for non-MP3 codecs. Maybe this poll should be delayed for a year and see if the position changes. P.

Aug 13, 2002, 06:52 AM	#28
WyreTheWolf Wolfish Bastard Join Date: May 2002 Location: Cave; Ozark Mountains Posts: 2,110 Rep Power: 0	Live music is the only way to fly

Aug 13, 2002, 10:38 AM	#30
DD51 DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: In My House Posts: 13 Rep Power: 0	WOW!!!! I just downloaded and tried OGG VORBIS and I must say that I'm Totally impressed for such a low bitrate (AVG. 114KB) What pisses me off is that my MP3 Car Stereo does not recognize it. I have about 4000 songs ripped with EAC w/alt preset standard and would switch "in a blink of an eye" if my Car Stereo would read the dam thing!!!! It's an awesome program and wins hands down vs. MP3 but the downside that it doesn't work in my Car Stereo is the shitz!! (Don't mean to brag but I have an awesome Car Stereo system)