PatK

There are some definite GSIF bugs inside the new 3533 driver, but I thought I'd also ask about 2 other possible issues before I mention those. These appear to be bugs too, unless I'm just getting something wrong somewhere? Config information..

Current skin: Aqua Skin
----Hardware / Software configuration---------------
Driver Name:kX Audio Driver (Debug)
Driver Date: May 28 2003 00:28:30
Driver Version: 5.10.00.3533 - debug
DB Name:none
CT4760 10k1 [d400]
PCI Information:
Device: 21102 Subsys: 80401102 ChipRev: 8
Card has MPU device
Card HAS AC97 codec
Codec name: SigmaTel STAC9721/23
3D Extension: SigmaTel 3D Enhancement
Codec is 2.0 compliant
Capabilities[6940] :
DAC resolutions : -16-bit- -18-bit-
ADC resolutions : -16-bit- -18-bit-
Ext Capabilities [200]: -slot/DAC mappings-
Port: d400 Irq: 16
Playback buffer: 20a0
Record buffer: 4000
Number of AC3 buffers: 4
Tank memory: 256 kb
GSIF buffer: 512 samples
OS version: [2 5 1 ; 2 5 1 ; 156 148]

Firstly, just as an example, say you are playing back a sequence in Cubase SX. You then wish to record the output to a wave file using an external application using StereoMix on the Mixer to capture the audio output, instead of rendering to wav inside Cubase (which works fine.) When you record in the external application, even though the signal is not clipping inside SX, it will clip in the recording application. At first I thought this was some sort of Steinberg issue, as I was attempting to capture Cubase SX's audio output inside Wavelab. So I attempted to record the output from Cubase SX on MS Sound Recorder instead. But the signal still clipped at 0dB using stereomix, even when WELL below 0dB inside SX.

I found that this is related to the AC97 recording level, and that the AC97 recording level must be turned down quite far on the recording mixer panel to avoid clipping. And, even when you do turn it down to avoid clipping, it still has some sort of distorted quality to the audio, like either somethings wrong inside the DSP routing panel, or that there's some sort of routing issues with these 3533 drivers? Shouldn't I be able to route between stuff without clipping, unless I actually introduce something that will cause a signal gain in the path? Note that no FX like reverb etc were used either to make the gain go above 0dB somehow, so I just don't understand why I'm getting clipping with stereomix, and I'm not aware of any routing inside the KX DSP panel which would account for it.

As a question related to this.. Is it possible we could also get an option to select "Wave" as an AC97 recording source, as most often people just want to capture wave output and not everything else with StereoMix too? I'm just used to doing it that way with the APS Live drivers.

Secondly, I noticed that the microphone remains active even when there are no attachments between the ProLog and Epilog panels (and with the xrouting RecL/RecR disconnected too.) Is this change deliberate? I know before 3533 that EG to record using the microphone, normally I'd expect to have to hook the AC97 in0/1 on Prolog to the REC L/R on the epilog panel at least? So I know this is a definite change since the 3532 drivers, and I'm wondering if this was deliberate or is a bug of some sort?

There's also another issue related to NetMeeting you may be unaware of, which is if you do not detach the links between RecL and RecR on the Xrouting panel, and RecL/RecR on the Epilog, the REMOTE end (ie the person you call) on a Netmeeting call will experience feedback (they will hear themselves echo.) As soon as you detach the link between RecL/R on xrouting and RecL/R on Epilog, the feedback issue is solved. Again, I'm not sure if this is as should be expected, but I know this is NOT the default behaviour on both the APS Live and Creative Labs drivers. It's not a big issue, as it's easy to solve doing the above, but it would be a big issue for anyone using NetMeeting who doesn't know to change these settings in the KX DSP panel, and it makes the KX drivers horrible to use Vs the Creative ones for telephony applications unless someone is aware of how to solve it.

Now to some GSIF bugs..

GIGA ISSUE 1
If you start NetMeeting first, Gigastudio (2.54.00) will not work. (It will load, but gives no audio output.) You must either reboot or select the Reset button in GigaStudio and check the "hardware" option, then reset the hardware.

If you do it the other way around, and start GigaStudio first, then start NetMeeting, both will work without performing any reset in Giga. But it still suffers from the same distorted output that sounds the same as the known bug issue with Cubase SX etc. Perhaps the current GSIF support just doesn't like sharing? But I thought I'd mention the fact that Netmeeting can stop it working without a hardware reset inside Giga.

GIGA ISSUE 2
Randomly when you boot (seems to be about 50% of the time, but may be less or more) GSIF just won't initialize properly. Giga will load, but there will be no output, and even midi input doesn't seem to be accepted. When this happens the only solution appears to be rebooting and trying again until it works.I ran the diagnosis test inside giga when this happened and can supply what it said if you thought that'd be helpful in any way?

GIGA ISSUE 3
If you try to perform a shutdown whilst GigaStudio is open, It will hang the shutdown process. Eventually giga will be closed, and windows will begin to close down (icons will disappear from the desktop etc) but it will then hang for a long period. How long I'm unsure, since I always lost patience after 5-10 mins and performed a hardware power reset to make it reboot when hanged. This could be an issue with Gigastudio (2.54.00) or it could be an issue with the KX drivers. Either way, I thought I'd mention it..

Also, when I initially installed giga it crashed on the first reboot after installing. After a second reboot it worked, but I thought I'd mention this too..

Thanks for all your efforts.

Eugene Gavrilov

1. 'stereomix'

you don't need to use this in order to record your waves
'stereomix' actually means 'analog stereo mix' (that is, a stereo mix of all the ac97 analog sources: line-in, mic-in, cd-in, pcm)
you should tweak 'wav level' instead

2. mic etc...

on the 'ac97' page click 'reset ac97 settings'
do not select 'stereomix' unless you are in 'digital output only' mode (or if you are using audigy board)

3. netmeeting feedback

the mentioned above 'wave level' is set to maximum by default
turn it off to avoid feedbacks

4. "Perhaps the current GSIF support just doesn't like sharing"

definitely

5. gsif initialization

make sure you wait before starting Giga for at least 3-4 minutes right after booting
(this is a GSIF issue)

6. shutdown

GigaSample/Studio don't close the GSIF driver correctly
this seems to be a Giga issue

/Eugene

Guenni

I found at least one more bug in 3533b:

the automation does not seem to work any more. I used a combination of Girder and a sendmidi comand line tool to remotely control the Surrounder settings (and more). No commands have any effect now. It was working fine in 3532.

It is also very annoying that it is still not possible to load old settings. First I get a message like "wrong version" number and when I change the version number in the settings file I can load the old setting but get other error warnings and not all parts of the old setting are really used. Automation settings are lost, for example.

BUT 24 bit playback from MAD MP3 plugins is finally working now!!!

Guenni

Audigy 1, W2K - tell me if you need more details.

Eugene Gavrilov

>> and not all parts of the old setting are really used. Automation settings are lost, for example

kx automation setings are saved/restored since 3533 release
previous settings aren't 100% compatible -- don't use them

/E

PatK

Thankyou for the help Eugene, I'd totally overlooked the relevance of the recording panel being related to what comes out of Xrouting RecL/R. Doh! Now I understand this, everything (including the Netmeeting feedback) is explained

Perhaps (if it's not already in there) a small note in the help file telling people they should set the wave recording level to zero in the Recording panel to avoid feedback in Telephony applications would be wise though?

perolepe

Dear Eugene,

First of all, thanks for developing such a driver!!!
I get to the point: I have a similar problem to the one posted by PatK on 05-31-2003 02:04 PM - "List of possible bugs, Netmeeting, and GSIF issues with 3533", but I couldn't solve it:

I am using Audigy Player + XP + Gigastudio: I want to play on the keyboard and record my live performance to wav.
When I load any instrument into Gigastudio and play only, there is no problem; the problem appears WHEN PLAYING AND RECORDING AT THE SAME TIME (with ANY external application: Cooledit Pro, Wavelab, MS Sound Recorder , etc.): a periodic clipping/cracking NOISE ruins everything.
What can I do? Please help!
Thanks alot.

----------------------------------------------------
Current skin: Aqua Skin
Skin Author: Eugene Gavrilov
----Hardware / Software configuration---------------
Driver Name:kX Audio Driver (Debug)
Driver Date: May 28 2003 00:28:30
Driver Version: 5.10.00.3533 - debug
DB Name:LiveBay1
SB0090 10k2 [c400]
PCI Information:
Device: 41102 Subsys: 511102 ChipRev: 3
Card is '10k2'
Card has MPU device
Card model is '5.1'
Card HAS AC97 codec
Codec name: TriTech TR A5/CT1297 TAT
3D Extension: No 3D Stereo Enhancement
Codec is 1.0 compliant
Capabilities[0] :
DAC resolutions : -16-bit-
ADC resolutions : -16-bit-
Ext Capabilities [0]:
Port: c400 Irq: 16
Playback buffer: 20a0
Record buffer: 4000
Number of AC3 buffers: 4
Tank memory: 256 kb
GSIF buffer: 512 samples
OS version: [2 5 1 ; 2 5 1 ; 156 148]
----------------------------------------------------