Senor_Mota

I personally think the work they're doing is what the world has needed for a long time - a big, fat dose of TRUTH to crumble the golden front facade.

What are your thoughts?

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Mousey

I Think the US Government attempting to arrest the founder is a perfect display of "NO DON'T LOOK YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO KNOW THIS!", If they would have kept it all quiet and not had this exploding all over the news they wouldn't have to worry because WikiLeaks is a seriously underground site, And anybody at one time collecting information from there would have been seen as a conspiracy nutter just trying to stir shit up.

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brainless_beginner

Well, quite a reason to be honest if u're a big chairman.

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Senor_Mota

Very true. It seems that an accreditation is only given when some wankers like us post it over and over again online... It's funny that something that was overlooked for so long as a serious medium for information (The Internet) has become the pseudo-backbone of the modern world!

The downside is that now EVERYONE thinks they're "internet savvy" or a "freedom fighter" or something more trite, just because they own a computer, use fakebook 5 days a week and looked at Encyclopedia Dramatica once.

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Senor_Mota

Did anyone get to see the new release of info? I can't access the main WikiLeaks page anymore since the update...

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Tyrsonswood

They must have their "eyes" on you.... I got right in.

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Senor_Mota

I was actually trying to read some at work. I talked to the IT guys here and they said it has been BLOCKED.

Thank God for proxy!

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Liqourice

It's about time people find out what international diplomacy is and always has been all about.

If they are afraid these documents can cause international conflicts perhaps they should have watched their words.

No, it's time that we the people actually starts using the power we have instead of letting corporate executives and career politicians that haven't done a days hard work in their life have it.

Earthmonger

When the US is effectively shut out of 'foreign' politics, the world will be a better place, including the US. They've had their hands in too many other people's pies for far too long.

OldBuzzard

Yep, it's a good thing...releasing information that will put a number of people's (agents/informers/etc.) lives at risk.

I sure hope you guys cheer as loud when the first person gets killed because of these leaks.

I would have voted NO, except for the bullshit "They are a terrorist organization!" tacked on at the end.

They aren't terrorists, but they ARE criminals, and low life, scum sucking weasels

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

temeteus82

Have to agree with OB in this case. What would you say if they would be putting your personal mail/e-mail's on the site?

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Mousey

The old moral of the internet stands true, If you don't want it found out, Don't post it.

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OldBuzzard

It's not that benign.

It's more like someone sending an email to your worst enemy, telling him that you are butt fucking his mother, sister, wife, daughter and dog.



Except that THIS info WASN'T originally on the internet. It was stolen by a traitorous bastard that, if justice is served, will be court-martialed, convicted, and executed.

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

OmegaRED

I support the idea of Wikileaks which I understood to be a place to expose corporate crimes but I'm getting a little uncomfortable with it solely targeting the United States. Now it seems like Wikileaks is little more than a spy that makes everything public. That's dangerous territory. However, I do appreciate getting some true insight into the shady dealings going on within the American Government, it's the only way we'll know what lies the public has been fed.

Basically, I want to see more leaks but I'd hope they serve to embarrass and keep politicians honest rather than create chaos between nations and put lives in danger. So far there have been no stories about lives lost due to the leaks.

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Judas

They aren't criminals... they are for all intents and purposes, upholding the constitutional rights and actually sticking the promise that previous presidents and primeministers have made in the past, including obama.

Frankly anyone that is likely to be killed over such things will be due to their own stupidity or it'll be mostly coincidence.

Majority of the articles and documents aren't essentially anything extremely top secret, they are for the better part of it, mostly all just the goings on from around the world. They haven't even dived into the meaty stuff. Wikileaks have taken the time to under specific circumstances, remove or not release anything that would pose a direct threat to someones life.

If you would bother looking into the matter you'd know that.

But instead you'd feel better about it if Treason continued on and people remained oblivious to the facts of what is actually occuring. Specially in the name of the peoples representative.

Pretty sad if all that is released thus far, you accept even personally as "acceptable" behavour on all fronts.


All the people of the world have a fundlemental right to know exactly how and why and what, where, who, and when with their countries finger prints on it.

Instead they don't want this, why would they? If the american or any countries people knew exactly how they have been handling things, the current political setup would not excist. Frankly with all the total bullshit that has been happening for so long, it's refreshing to see it.

But it's still oddly halarious that the FIRST thing the media has been saying over the release of this information is how it's going to put everyone at risk and blah blah blah. Total rubbish.. they said that over the previous dozen releases wikileaks has made.

In the realm of the information wars, Wikileaks itself is among the heros.

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OldBuzzard

Just because you don't WANT it to be a crime doesn't mean it isn't

You ever heard of The Espionage act?

United States Code: Title 18,794. Gathering or delivering defense information to aid foreign government | LII / Legal Information Institute

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 37 > § 794

(a) Whoever, with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign nation, communicates, delivers, or transmits, or attempts to communicate, deliver, or transmit, to any foreign government, or to any faction or party or military or naval force within a foreign country, whether recognized or unrecognized by the United States, or to any representative, officer, agent, employee, subject, or citizen thereof, either directly or indirectly, any document, writing, code book, signal book, sketch, photograph, photographic negative, blueprint, plan, map, model, note, instrument, appliance, or information relating to the national defense, shall be punished by death or by imprisonment for any term of years or for life, . . .

Plus, the little weasel is also subject to prosecution under 18 USC 793, 18 USC 798, and since he's a member of the US military, Article 106a of the UCMJ


But you dom't care about that...right?

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

Judas

Few more details on exactly what is relating to the national defense that is in question?

There are other protective articles as well...

Actually there are currently some situations in the books or acts and articles already excisting.... Some based on the consituational laws including the continuation of essentially keeping your own governments in check so they do not run of doing the things they are doing in a treasonist way.

Actually there are if you do a little research, several acts in which similare documentation can be made public in one way or another. It would take a legal court and jury to determine what protections legally, and what laws were broken.

But perhaps you don't really care about that right?


By the way, you cannot nail someone without a trial, grand jury... The specifics of the claims for his arrest.

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Senor_Mota

Uh, I think the reason why people have even said anything to begin with is because they DO care. Not to be condescending, but the "old way" of doing things doesn't work anymore. You can review a document meant for the British S.A.S. that includes how to maintain security measures on the internet, ON THE INTERNET, for everyone to see. Also, in most of the cables I've read, the agents and other parties involved (except those of high stature) were listed under pseudonyms and/or false identities, because they take that initial security measure anyways.

Your "knowledge of the law" is meaningless in this case. You can't place the blame on one individual for these actions, because they use an anonymous electronic drop-box for all their submissions; nor try a group for these actions, because you'll never be able to pin it on all of them. Shit, for all you know, President Obama himself could have leaked the documents just to see what he could stir up, or to wane social disinterest. You seem to think that one man is behind the whole thing, when it is obviously a large group of individuals working together to make their cause happen.

Lastly, if you feel so passionate about the "law", then we probably need to prosecute YOU, because you probably described the cockpit of an SR-71 to a Pakistani back in 1982, and you just don't remember. Or because that one time, you thought about stroking Osama Bin Laden's beard, because you like facial hair. You FUCKING TRAITOR.

Fucking old people...

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Liqourice

Educated and enlightened people are a big threat to those established in power, THAT'S why they don't want these things to come out.

There's no wonder why the educational systems all over the world gets worse and worse. Un-educated people doesn't complain. If they know nothing they can't demand anything. Teaching the masses about what's really going on are the biggest thread to those people than anything else. They're afraid for themselves, that they will lose their positions. That's what it's all about.

The world will become a better place if everything comes out in the open, if everyone becomes aware of everything that's happening. This way people will be able to have control over their lives. That's true democracy, not this sick joke that they're trying to defend.

OldBuzzard

Yeah, I'm a "fucking old people". I've been there, done that, got the T-Shirt, and wore it out.

I was also in the USAF, and held a TS Crypto clearance. I don't need people that are ignorant of military security to lecture ME on security matters.

It appears that you fucking CHILDREN have no clue as to what happens in the REAL world.

@JUDAS

The 'whistle blower' provision has absolutely nothing to do with this. That's about CIVILIAN stuff.

The guy that STOLE those SECRET documents was a member of the US Army. NONE of that information was public. And as for:
Again, he is MILITARY, and he doesn't have that protection. He's subject to the UCMJ. I know it may be hard for you to understand. But those that SERVE and protect YOUR 'freedoms', give up many of those freedoms while doing so.

Next time, don't try to debate from a position of ignorance.

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

Liqourice

Freedom this, freedom that. There is no freedom, haven't you understood that yet?

That's where things like wikileaks come in, they fight FOR freedom. The way the world has developed the last few decades it's well needed because what you call freedom is slowly and surely dismounted in so many ways, and you don't even notice it. If it weren't people like those that expose the governments for what they are you wouldn't know anything about how your freedom has been revoked.

Judas

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldBuzzard Next time, don't try to debate from a position of ignorance.

I don't exactly debate from the position of ignorance, Frankly i don't care what your credential you may or may not have may be...

But you've already pinned something on someone within the military..

unfortunately just because someone that may have leaked a little information thus far, may have been military, that's not to say all of it was. And frankly i could care less what legal standing it has, Civilian or military, we all have rights and when it comes to the truth and accurate information, wikileaks is actually provided a decent medium which without doubt will oventually be taken advantage of for more bullshit down the road..


If you wanted to wade through all the legal crap, in the end it's all a joke anyways....

No admendment or governing body under any instatution and overturn the constitution and general rights of each "free soul".... It is not treason to expose current governments and instatutions such as the military and current US or any world government for that matter, in what they have been doing behind closed doors and even against the will or wishes of the majority of the people. Reguardless, fact, it's treason for obama to reside as a UN board member..... yet what's being done?

Do double standards count, course if you want to single out someone specifically or a group and excute/imprison them for life against the majorities educated and well reasoned opinion... might be interesting.

I don't debate or discuss from a totally ignorant or idiotic standpoint... I understand and comprehend some of the rules, and frankly anyone that actually uses a little common sense with a little bit of heart so to say mixed with some decent logic will oventually come to the conclusion that some of the rules and laws are royally fucked up and demand changing....

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OldBuzzard

oh really?

Info oposted on another forum I frequent:

Are you happy now?

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

Earthmonger

Once in a while I'll stop the car on a dead end road, out in the middle of nowhere, in the dark, early hours of morning. I'll have a smoke, look around, and think, "I'm a long way from home. Damn I miss the States." Then I get home, see the news, and facepalm. What the fuck was I thinking a few hours ago? Miss the US? Are you nuts? I'd rather live in a land of freedom.

I was born in Peoria, Illinois. Up until my late twenties I was a resident of America. These days I hesitate to even call myself American. It seems the further I disassociate myself from that morass of bullshit, the happier I am. I spent some time in England before ending up in Norway, with wife and kid. Now every time I read the news I'm grateful for the change.

The civilians of the US are innocent. Because, after five or six generations of brainwashing, they no longer able to see brainwashing. Republican, democrat, liberal; doesn't matter. Party is irrelevant. When the system you serve has been corrupted for so long and so deeply, you yourself can serve only corruption. Doesn't matter what happens in your term. Nothing you accomplish can unravel the knots. My opinion is that the US government must be destroyed. It can't be fixed. It needs to be rolled back 100 years. It needs to be of the people, by the people, and for the people again.

Who's interests are you really serving? Who's giving the orders to the ones giving you the orders? Carrying the badge "military" might as well be labeling yourself, "mindless sheep". I think it would be best for the US to go on defense, while sorting itself out, instead of making its problems worse with offenses in the rest of the world. As the US polices the world, who polices the US? Its citizens? Its 'elected officials'? Ha. Yet if a party stands up to the US, it's suddenly labeled a gang of terrorists.

Judas

sure am... considering some of those links are directly related to that of the taliban representives that were essentially fake or placed....

rabbit hole..... it's quite deep

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Senor_Mota

LOL, they are all broken links, 404 Errors. I guess the "proof" was in the pudding...

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OldBuzzard

ODD, they worked when I tested them.

Oh well, try these:

Taliban in Afghanistan says they will target informants outed by WikiLeaks for working with U.S.

Taliban seeks vengeance on Afghans named in WikiLeaks documents - NYPOST.com

Taliban Study WikiLeaks to Hunt Informants - NYTimes.com

Wikileaks Afghanistan: Taliban 'hunting down informants' - Telegraph

Is that enough 'pudding' for you?

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When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY

procupine14

Works for me. To be honest we should have backed out of that sandbox years ago and started worrying about real problems that directly impact us. Not some "terrorist" organization that we use to scare people into signing things like the Patriot Act. Having informants there isn't helping end the war and, quite frankly, I don't know even how helpful they are considering that we are still getting blown up by the same group of people we are supposedly spying on. RANT off....

WikiLeaks is fine and dandy with me. Gives me something I can make popcorn for and read

Honestly, I think people just get way to caught up in their own tangled web of beliefs to really think about what is good for people as a whole but that is just me.

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Judas

exactly precisely that..

It was ilegal for us to even enter said countries in the first place... reguardless of what reasons were given.... false as they've been proven...... we should be held accountable...

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Liqourice

I really don't get it.. how people can without critisism hands off believe anything their government officials spews out. Governments ALWAYS have to be under the looking glass from it's people and wikileaks are providing some of the ways to do that.

The people in charge cheers for people that swallows everything they say because those gullible ones ensure that the ones in charge can stay in their positions. On the other hand they truly fear those that challenge them and presents evidence of their deeds. Of course they don't want to give those people fair trials because then even more truth could come out.

I'm not pointing fingers here, this is happening in all nations.. just more in some than others.