FuNsTeR

i will adhere to it at tomorrow nites game .... only for those who died in the WTC ... the Pentagon thats another story .... lets get to some facts ... America installed the shah as leader of Iran in the 60's so that they could control Iranian oil .... the shah was a Murderin evil dictator ... and he was replaced by the Ayttollah homenei or something ... we all know what happened next .... Saddam was America's counter balance to Iran ... they supplied and trained his troops equiped his armies with chemicals weapons and advised other Euro/nato countries to do like wise ... we all know what happened their ... supported terrorists/guerillas (contras) against Nicuraguan
goverment because they we're communist .... Noriega help fund arms shipments too said group via the drugs trade so that arms would not show up in their budget ...
we all know what happened next ... Afghanistan trained and equiped a one Osama Bin laden and his mudjahedeen followers against the russians fund billions into fanatical religous schools called Madrasas in pakistan and when the war ended left the Afghans too fend
for themselves ... we ALL what happened next ..... back to Iraq after gulf war Bush senior told the shi-ites and Kurds to uprise against Saddams regime .... then stood by
as they were annihilated by his republican guard and with chemical weapons .... oh and the USA openly allowed Noraid help fund the IRA for their terrorists attacks on the uk .... bush openly supports a Dictator Mushareef of Pakistan against Democratic India even though its Pak*stanis doing all the terrorist attacks on India .... and lastly to decrie Saddam for using chemical weapons is two faced what did America do when faced with defeat in Vietnam .... yes they used CHEMICAL weapons "AGENT ORANGE" the most dangerous chemical weapon ever made by man and "DDT" and other nasty agents ... a bit like the Pot calling the Kettle Black .... to summise America has supported more Dictarships and Terrorist organisations than any other nation ... (though the Suadis are catching up slowly) and have used chemical weapons in the past .... the question their fore is if America faces losing another war will it use Chemical weapons again ?? or worse ?? thousands die every year through America's + chemical war fare in Vietnam ..... unlike the ww2 Nazis were tried for their crimes American troops haven't for commiting just as barbaric crimes .... their excuse "we we're only obeying orders" .... sounds familar ..... thats why i will never trust the yanks and why we should not support them in their so called war on terror .... they should attack themselves ... as their is no bigger terrorist nation .... they helped kill thousands of UK citizens in England and Northern Ireland ..... rant over

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Smoothdrive

Some heavy reading there dude..I knew some of the things you mention, not all..question remains..what shoudl be done to stop Saddam if we don't go for a U.S./European attack ??
Sometimes you haver to choose the best out of two bad solutions

I'ld rather have an agressor with western values than to be forced to become a muslim and live by barbaric values in the next 20 years

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skastel

I totally agree. However the biggest problem isn't what we've done it's that we're going to keep doing it.

IF the US could suppress it's greed for OIL and cash we would leave the Mid east.
IF the US thought through it's Afghanistan attack we wouldn't have killed more Afghan civilians than terrorists did on 9/11
IF the US stopped imperialist practices the world would probably hate us less.

The problem here is that US is in too deep. There is simply no way for a country as deeply commited to policing the world to just stop. Also the US hasn't and will never enter into an unwinable/unprofitable war. The US gov't is too self perpetuating to simply NOT do what it has been doing ever since WW2. Unfortunately we will continue to outfit pupet regimes to do our bidding. The only way we<citizens> can stop this sh*t is by refusing to support the gov't when it needlessly attacks soveirgn nations. Remeber people just because Bush says they're EVIL <ohhh spooky!> doesn't mean they are.

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GREEKRAGE

MAY GOD REST THEIR SOULS AND GIVE STRENGTH TO THE LOVED ONES LEFT BEHIND !!

...

JavaFox

This thread is so full of contemptable ignorance that it was physically painful for me to read it. You tired, anti-American shallow intellectuals need to learn some facts, and stop beating the same drum.

Dinesh D'Souza, a popular political speaker as well as senior political anaylst under the Reagan administration, has said that American foreign policy can be simplified as one core concept: supporting the better of the two evils. Life isn't always about chosing between a good guy and a bad guy; sometimes you need to support a leader that is LESS evil than his opponent.

Keep this in mind as I go on.

The Shah of Iran was a dictator. This is fact. But, similarly, it is a fact that Mohammed Mossadegh --the leader the US was against-- was a communist who would have given the oil resources of Iran to Stalin. Stalin was worse than the Shah. The United States supported the lesser of the two evils; what's wrong with that? The was a Cold War going on, and THAT, not the thirst for oil, is what colored our actions. As far as the Ayatollah Khomeini is concerned, remember that he was in OPPOSITION of the Shah, overthrew the Shah, and then took Americans hostage. He adopted, as Time magazine has said, "terrorism as government policy." Khomeni helped form Hezzbollah and on numerous occasions terrorized US citizens. The Shah did not LEAD to the Ayatollah -- the Ayatollah was AGAINST the Shah. We supported the opposite of the Ayatollah.

Secondly, I strongly disagree with this contention that America is out simply to get oil. That is a stupid, ridiculous idea because it spits in the face of fact. The fact of the matter is, if the US was SO oil-hungry, they would have no diplomatic ties with Israel --whom the oil-controlling Arabs hate-- and would not give Israel the $1,000,000,000 of aid that it does. To say that the USA only wants oil is absurd. Besides, in the 90s, the US only depended on the Persian Gulf for 4% of its oil. So find a new fuckin' arguement already.

The US supplied and trained Saddam's troops? That's not completely true. The fact of the matter is, the US supported Iran --not Iraq-- during the Cold War, and made sure that neither Iran nor Iraq could do much during the Iraq-Iran War. While it is true that the Iraqis received some US intelligence and assistance, the planes and hardware the Iraqis flew and used were SOVIET and FRENCH. Saudi Arabia and Kuwait FUNDED the Iraqis. The US assisted Iraq by stopping Iranian planes from flying into certain areas, but the US did not supply the Iraqis -- the Soviets and French did. The planes the Iranians flew were US made. I'm so tired of half-truths.

We didn't support the Nicaraguan Sandinistas because they supplied military aid to Communist guerrilas in Guatemala and El Salvador. The Sandinistas were also building A SOVIET BASE. The Contras, on the other hand, were the army of democratic revolution trying to overthrow the Sandinistas.

The Mujahedeen were anti-Communist rebels supported by the United States, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, and a few others. The brutal and expansionist Soviet Regime invaded Afghanistan in 1979 and the US was against it. After the Soviets withdrew in 1989, the Afghans fought a civil war that led to the Taliban Regime.

The US tried to protect Afghanistan against Soviet conquerors in the 80s. The US helped liberate Afghanistan from the Tabliban --which came to power following an Afghan civil war. We have spilt our blood, spent our money, and dedicated our time to restabilizing that country more than once, and yet we are brutal? Our Special Forces are risking their lives to protect Afghanistan's government leaders. The US unfucked Afghanistan.

That is crap. The Kurds, firstly, wanted --and still want-- independence from Iraq. It is not the US's fault that Saddam Hussein was a brutal dicator that gassed an ethnic minority. There was a bill being pushed through Congress in 1988 that unexpectedly called for a ceasing of trade between the US and Iraq. Hm? Curious, huh? Could it have something to do with the fact that the IRAQI GOVERNMENT GASSED THE KURDS IN 1988?! And isn't it also interesting how the US helped establish a safe haven for the Kurds in 1991, and still operates a no-fly zone --preventing Iraqi agression towards the Kurds-- even today?

Firstly, the US is still --and has long been-- an ally of India. That is a fact. But you are absolutely right about General Musharraf! Why should we be supporting him, the leader of a BLOODLESS coup, when we COULD be supporting former Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, a convicted hijacker and terrorist! Nawaz Sharif is a hero! He helped destroy the judiciary of the country, and began to weaken the country's defense! YOU DUMBSHIT! Pakistan was on the brink of a civil war because their Prime Minister was oppressive and corrupt, YET the General who has helped bring stability to the country, and who has served as a great ally to the US, AND WHO MANAGED A COUP WITHOUT KILLING ANYONE is a BAD CHOICE?! Who is the alternative?!


Your ignorance is astounding! Firstly, Agent Orange was an defoliant as far as we were concerned -- it wasn't used as a chemical weapon! If it was, then why do so many 'Nam vets suffer from exposure? You honestly think AO is more dangerous than mustard gas, sarin, or VX? In modern history, the US has never used chemical weapons as an attack; Saddam has.

The US has done more good in its meager 230 years of existence than any other major power. We have demolished dictators and oppresive regimes. We have created the most free nation on the planet. Our science and technlogy benefits the entire world. We have rid the world of Communism. We have rebuilt destroyed nations like Germany, Japan, England, and France. In our history, we may have supported some bad guys, but only because the alternative was worse.

The reason you will never trust us is because you will never have an original and intelligent thought in your life.

JavaFox

The US hasn't and never will enter into an unwinable or unprofitable war? How about the men we lost in Mogadishu? How about the fighting we did to rid the Afghans of the Taliban? How about the air war we waged in Kosovo? I DARE you to find where we benefited in those instances.

Zardon

as much as I respect and appreciate free speech and all that it stands for, as a mark of respect to the dead, regardless of anyones opinions or feelings on this heavily debated subject I feel I will close this thread, especially with the anniversary coming up.

I would please ask all members if on the 11th we can just all join together on the board and honour the dead regardless of political beliefs and other world issues.

Then after that date you can all vent your feelings on this.

I hope you all understand my reasons and peace to you all.

JavaFox

Per Zardon's request, this thread has been closed for the past few days. I am reopening it now.

skastel

Kosovo was not simply a US effort, it was a UN venture. Given it was primalrily stocked with our boys, but none the less we weren't going it alone. We support the UN security council 90% of the time and that case was no different. Somalia is an amazing source of diamonds, thus the civil war for control of them. We went in to protect american interests in the diamond trade. Our primary goal though was to stablize the country. I see your point though, we have done quite a bit of humanitarian work over the years. I'm willing to conceed that I was wrong. But I will say this, the US should be careful in choosing allies, we seem to be less and less prudent about the battles we fight. However, we shouldn't be confined by what the UN security council thinks is appropriate. WE are the targets of these attacks, WE are the most powerful military force in the world. These things bring a responsibility to protect our citizens, and sometimes staying out of other people's businesses is the best way to do that.
As far as israel is concerned we should try and minimize our involvment IMO. They are oppressing the people around them and expanding despite having been told many times not to. Even after they have signed treaties they have broken them. Reminiscent of Germany's expansion pre-WW2. The stealing of other people's home's isn't honorable, no matter what the justification is.

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Kelsenellenelvian

It was a low blow because they targeted citezens instead of military personnel that would have been an understandable declaration of war not just plain evil and w

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JavaFox

If you're referring to treaties like the Oslo Accords, then yes, you're right -- Israel has not honored them. But neither have the Palestinians. Under Oslo, the Palestinians were supposed to dismatle Hamas, but they have not. Israel is not the only one seemingly incapable of following treaties and agreements.

And on the other hand, blowing up civilian targets such as cafes, universities, and buses is wrong and dishonorable as well, regardless of the justification.

choppy9er

JavaFox loves his country,Hes right,we are not perfect,but we are called upon to do extraordinary deeds.On this day September 14th,we are fighting for our freedom and the freedom of our allies,God bless Britain and the Pakistan people for standing with us to hunt these people down and bring them to justice.We will soon be going into Iraq,and then after that probably Iran,who are hiding these terrorists in thier country.I hope the Iranian government comes to thier senses before this happens.The President of the United States of America told the world,You are either with us or against us.The people are together in this and we are poised for the next chapter to begin.Choppy

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FuNsTeR

thats where your wrong the majority of the people that make up the UK ie Scotland,England ,Wales and northern Ireland don't want war with Iraq ... if it does happen Blair will be out of a job .... as for Pakistan its as Democratic as the people are freindly
... so either your with us or against us lol what a laugh that fcuking imbocile has put trade Sanctions on its so called European allies including the UK ... it has shuned all attempts for climate control and shuned every other treaty involving aid and harmfull emisions .... on top of that it harbours the head of the company in India that killed over 20,000 in Bophal with chemicals through negligance ... the us goverment says it can't locate him , but greenpeace did ... what do you think would happen if the shoe is on the other foot?? ..... America is full of hypocritical w@nkers ....i'll sneer when America falls from grace .... the Evil Empire that believes in Controling other nations policies .... what you must remember in Scotland and the rest of the UK WE DO NOT TAKE KINDLY TO BULLIES .... and neither does Europe in general .... if anything it will speed up our aim of Independance in Scotland ... the tories will get in and will try to fcuk with our parliment ... just imagine the fun eh

America supports Terrorism and supports Dictatorships ... their is no way getting out of this ... your country men helped fund a Terrorist group attack your so called allies in the OPEN ..... with allies like you ... who needs enemies

SAOR ALBA

thats a " A FREE SCOTLAND" in my mother tongue you thick yank twats afore you slag Scotland off my small country has done more invented more than your tinpot nation will ever do ... and whats it like to live in a uncultured land that shuns its native cultures and history .... yes i did use the word "Natives" as your lot are our cast offs ... thick ignorant ones at that

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choppy9er

Wow,We really are a terrible vicious people,I stand corrected.I forgot how much the Scottish people detest the British.My last name is MacLeod,and my family(the Lewis branch)lost most of thier men and lost most of thier land to the MacKenzies in the Jackobite wars.We are going into Iraq,and Tony Blair will not loose his job,and the UK will fight with us because its in both of ours best interest to do so.In the news today,the Prime Minister has proof that the leader of Iraq has been helping training these terrorists,but we have no right to defend ourselves?We will be defending Scotland too,who has had terror in Lockerbie although I dont think it was planned to go there,I wonder who was responsible for that.Choppy

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FuNsTeR

not with me your not .... i will only fight and die for one country guess what it aint Britian or the USA ... you may have a Scottish second name ... but that counts for sod all your as much Scottish as i am English *sic* the facts are America has supported more despots/terrorists than any other nation their is no getting away from it ... as my gran onced said if you play with fire ... it WILL burn YOU .... you played with it once too often ... its not nice to be targetted by terrorists is it ?? now you understand how we feel or do you still openly support the Ira??

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JavaFox

And what is the alternative? Former Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, who wanted to dissasemble the Pakistani judiciary, brought his country to the brink of civil war, and is a convicted terrorist? Great choice.

If you'll remember, until just recently, no modernized state supported the Kyoto Protocols anyway. Not the UK, not Japan, not France, and not Germany. Their song has changed only recently, but here in the US, we have better ideas. The Kyoto Protocols call for such radical changes over a short period of time that to implement them would be to the detriment of our economy. But President Bush is no dummy when it comes to energy. He, among other initiatives, supports carbon sequestration projects. You probably don't know what that is, though. The funny thing about you anti-Americans is that you all sound remarkably the same, and never do your homework. Why don't you learn about carbon sequestration and then tell me that the US isn't interested in environmental affairs. Until you have some intelligent critique of sequestration, you had better never open your mouth regarding President Bush's energy policy again.

Firstly, if you are going to complain, I have to ask that you use facts. And the fact of the matter is, that the Union Carbide gas explosion in Bhopal killed 4,000 NOT 20,000. Secondly, the gas leaked from a plant maintained by Union Carbide India Limited, which is considered a seperate legal entity maintained and staffed by Indians. The CEO of Union Carbide has no culpability. Finally, the Union Carbide disaster did not go unpunished. The US courts passed the case over to the Indian government. And in February of 1989, the Supreme Court of India ordered both Union Carbide Corporation and Union Carbide India Limited to pay $470 million, which they PAID IN FULL THE SAME MONTH. Justice was served.

I have proven conclusively that the US did what was best for the world. You cannot ignore my arguments. Read them, and try to make a point. Otherwise, shut up. There's enough ignorance in this world.

I love this kind of criticism. Well, I know what I want to say, but I'd like to quote reno, as he makes his point quite well: "If you hate America so much, stop taking showers, eating hot dogs, driving production vehicles (almost every european carmaker is owned by an American one), using modern profanity, using the internet, buying weapons and vehicles from our military, being defended by the UN (which is mostly American and British troops), using your intel or amd processor, listening to your speakers, watching [...] movies, stop wearing jeans, stop wearing tennis shoes, stop flying, [...] and for the love of your culture, stop using democracy/constitutional monarchies! After taking these steps you'll pretty much be free of America and our shitty country, and good ****ing riddance. "

I couldn't have said it better. If you truly think that the nation that produced Steinbeck, Boeing, penicillin, Breakfast at Tiffany's, Disney, Hemingway, jazz, Nutrasweet, the lightbulb, Fahrenheit 451, and modern micropressors has nothing to offer the world, then why don't you practice what you preach and get rid of us? Turn off your lights and air conditioning, stop taking antibiotics when you're sick, stop watching our movies and wearing our fashions, stop going to McDonalds, quit watching CNN and MTV, and stop listening to our music. And in the darkness, trapped in your insular little world --unable to travel because, after all, Boeing makes the vast majority of the planes in the world-- I hope you realize all that we've done. And when American-made F-16s and FA-18s roar overhead, protecting your continent yet again, I hope you realize how truly lost the world would be without us.

FuNsTeR

duh hyper text protocol was invented by BT yes BT Telephone invented by whom a "SCOTSMAN" ALEXANDER GRAHAM BELL so much for your yank invention with the nuematic tyre you would be running on solid rubber and still going at a snail pace Tarmac Scottish invention ... i like too see your slow solid rubber tyres on cobbled stones he he more backache

penicillin was invented by Alexander Flemming of Scotland so you are wrong again
while your at it turn off your Tv , hand in your telephone hand in your golf clubs and your toothpaste and tooth brush and who invented steam trains eh? take it your lot would still be on the east coast ... and in your Scotch whiskey hand oh funnily enuff was it 3 Scotsmen the formed the American navy ?? ... the list is Endless and not forgeting Cola which coke ripped from a shop owner in fife after it was reviewed in the new york times 7 years later Coca cola appeared and they do not deny it their get around is that the original was called Kola ... how apt eh

Air Conditioner in Scotland Ha Ha don't make me laugh

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JavaFox

I really have to insist, Funster, that you get your facts straight. British Telecom never claimed --nor did they-- invent "hyper text protocol." BT claims to own the patent to hyperlinks -- a patent that is dubious at best and hardly applies to the Internet in its current form. The facts of the matter are as such: Tim Berners-Lee, an Englishman and Oxford graduate, invented HTML which paved the way for the WWW. Most people don't realize it, but the WWW and the Internet are not the same thing. The Internet was created by the US. The English can claim to have invented the Web, but the Internet developed out of the hard work of the American military (ARPANet) and academia.

Bah, "tyres" would have absolutely no use had Americans not taught the rest of the world what an automobile was supposed to be like.

Of course, the Japanese would later teach us a few things, too.

You are not completely correct. Alexander Fleming may have discovered penicillin, but it was Howard Florey and Ernst Chain, who were funded by the American Rockefeller Foundation, that discovered how useful the stuff was. Flemming was unable to isolate the mold, and thought it only to be useful in some specific situations. It was the funding of a super-rich American organization that enabled Florey and Chain to discover how useful the spore was.

But let's go on, shall we?

When you have severe burns on your body, what are you treated with? Sulfamylon cream! The US military developed it, and it accounts for a "50-percent reduction in burn fatalities due to infection." How about that? Could the world do without our development, and lose twice as many people to burns?

How about great advancements like the polio vaccine? You could do without that? American contributions to medicine are myriad, and the world would not be so well off was it not for our efforts.

Television was invented by an American. The telephone, contrary to popular belief, was invented by an Italian, NOT Alexander Graham Bell. Look it up. I don't really see the point of your arguments, though. I never said I could do without the labor and fruit of the hundreds of cultures and nations of this planet. You are the one that said you could do without America.

I never once said that America alone had been responsible for the wellbeing of the world. And I don't piss on other cultures like you do. I respect cultures different from my own. And every time I write, use a compass, or flush a toilet, I realize that those were not American inventions. But if you truly find American developments insignificant and American culture reprehensible, then why do you partake? Stop listening to our music, watching our movies, and reading our classics. Stop using our medical technology, our Boeing jets, and our Internet. Stop powering your computers with our processors. Stop wearing blue jeans. If you can't recognize the impact America has had on this world, you are painfully ignorant and no amount of debate is likely to convince you otherwise.

ByteMe

javafox- why do you insist on using so many facts? You'll scare all of them off.

JavaFox

Facts, I've found, are a pretty good way to combat propaganda and mindlessness. But you're right, ByteMe, some people can't handle facts.

Frodo301

and apparently.....from the looks of.... Funster's writing style...he cannot..... or will not..... form... complete sentences.... either.

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Smoothdrive

Lol..why can't we all just get along kids ??

A bit silly comparing the US to Scotland..simply due to size and funding the US can beat Scotland..

Than again..i don't see why you are a better man when someone from your country invented something.. wow the audio cassette is a Dutch invention..so ?? what did i do to invent it ?? how does this make me better ?? should i be proud now ?? maybe it makes my country better...than again..what did i do to be born in this country ?? If i were born in Iraq i'ld be proud of Saddam probably for standing up against the western world..

the silly games we play...

Anyway this topic was about september 11th i guess.. so..here goes ..

I feel September 11th was bad but not as bad as the Americans make it up to be..IMO the US was more shocked by the fact that they can be attacked in their own country than the event by itself.

Minute's silence..sure this year..but in 6 years from now..no i'm not going to bother

As for the Attacks..for once our government does what i would do..we support the attack on Iraq when and if it comes..we hope the UN can agree on it, if not we still support the attacks. To my suprise i even heard in the news this morning that we are sending a squad of F-16's to Afghanistan to help out the Americans there so they can free recources for Iraq..

PS Javafox..you're a walking encyclopedia man..or are you keeping one next to your keyboard ??

Question: who first bombed London ??

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JavaFox

The basic gist of Funster's argument was that the US has done bad political things in the past and, as such, has no reason to be upset about 9-11. And that is wrong. Firstly, as I pointed out earlier, the US did a lot of what it did because the alternative was worse. I don't think Funster can really contest that, and I can only take his silence on the matter as an admission of that inability. I told him that if he really feels that the US is nothing but a mere bunch of dregs, he should refuse to support American companies by using American technologies, and that he should refuse to participate in the propagation of American culture (which he considers base). He responded by saying that the Scots have done more for the world than "than your tinpot nation will ever do." He goes on to call the US "a uncultured land" -- ignoring the fact that my "cultural" knowlege tells me that he should have said "an uncultured land" instead. A lot of anti-Americans like to say that the US has no culture, which is absurdity. We have a rich and amazing culture that the rest of the world enjoys.

I did not say that the US could exist without the cultural, scientific, and technological developments of other nations. I never said that. I do not spit on other cultures like Funster does. If he thinks he can live comfortably without technology and culture fashioned by American hands, he is only lying to himself.

And you would be wrong about that because you don't know the facts. The fact of the matter is, more Americans were killed on September 11 last year than on ANY DAY in America's history since our Civil War. The bloody D-Day Invasion that everyone is familar with left 2,000 Americans dead. Think about that and then tell me that it wasn't significant. The only time that our country lost that many people in one day, Smoothdrive, was when we were fighting ourselves. For the purposes of comparion, I estimate that the US lost an average (all other things being equal) of 251 men a day during World War II (December 7, 1942 - August 14, 1945; 300,000 casualties). In terms of human loss, 9-11 was ten times more significant than any given day during WWII, as far as Americans are concerned.

Well, good. I am glad that we do have allies in this.

The thing I like about debate is that it excites a desire in the participants to seek out new knowledge. I'm not a historical encyclopedia on all matters, and I don't know every fact. I know a bit about history though, and I know a lot of tidbits, and I know how to do research. It's easy to do, and I learn a lot from it. I knew, for example, that America lost more on 9-11 than any other day except during the Civil War. A little research and math is all it took for me to estimate of the number of Americans that died per day during WWII.

What do you mean? Who bombed London first during what time period? If you're referring to WWII, the Germans did -- from their zeppelins.

Smoothdrive

Goodie Goodie..i know a fact..during the American civil war more people were killed in onde day because they were in pow camps..these camps were terrible mind you..comparible to the nazi germany camps.

I have to admit however that i have no clue as to how many people died exactly in the WTC attack..the thing that shocked me most was that the victims are not soldiers, they were not at war with anyone and could not even have forseen this I can not comprehend how people can be able to do such acts against innocent people..same as the victims in Israel who just get bombed while doing there daily thing..terrorists really are the lowest scum on the earth as far as i'm concerned and i feel no compassion what so ever for countries that give shelter to or even train these people. If they take military targets it still is a low deed but at least the victims are soldiers than..a soldier knows he may hav to give his life and chooses to put himself in that situation.. I can only imagine the leaders that give orders for these acts are the same as a bomber crew whom only see the explosions from the air and don't have to look into the eyes of their victims.


I was reffering to in the last 600 years or so..and it was more to test your encyclopeida skills so never mind .....i did not know that germans took there Zeppelins to London for bombing..tought they only used airplanes and V2's to bomb london

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JavaFox

Not really. The most people lost in a single day during the Civil War was during the battle of Antietam (September 17, 1862), where over 23,000 men were either killed, wounded, or could not be accounted for (MIA). It was an incredibly bloody battle, but practically no ground was either gained or lost. The men died in battle, not in POW camps.

Actually, I have to apologize, I was mistaken. Germany did not use zeppelins to bomb London in WWII; they used them in WWI. They weren't that great, though -- they would often fly off course, or get shot down, but you have to admit -- it was probably really scary to get bombed from a zeppelin. Here is a delightful propaganda ode to zeppelins that I found online:

Zeppelin, flieg,
Hilf uns im krieg,
Flieg nach England,
England wird abgebrannt,
Zeppelin, flieg!