What makes a game great?

Oblivious · Nov 12, 2003, 05:09 AM

Howdy everyone,

Games have been cooking my noodle recently and I know I have my misconceptions. So I wanted to know the truth about gaming. I want to know what is most important to you guys in a game. Why do you play a game?

I've always liked twich gaming. To me it's a meditative experience... while I quake or CS I find my mind absolutely devoid of all thought. On the other hand I love RPGs like FF Tactics. They are like a puzzle... the challenge of beating them drives me to play.

Why do you play (what you play) ?

Edit: I appologize for the spelling errors! GOMEN!

Mazuko · Nov 12, 2003, 06:02 AM

I have been a gamer for years and I feel that I have developed some rather particular tastes.

Personally, I am partial to a game that meets several criteria that I have accumulated over the years, and quite frankly I feel that they apply to every genre I have played.

No matter how great a game may be, if the user interface (and keyboard mapping) is trash, the game is not worth playing. One of the magics of First Person Shooters like CS and Quake is the fact that the keyboard layouts remain relatively consitent throughout all FPS variations (IE W,A,S,D for movement). One example of how not to setup a keyboard is "Independence War" talk about some difficult commands to learn.

I like a game to be mentally challenging. This does not necessarily mean it has to have puzzles, rather it should somehow stimulate some thinking process. For example, how to get past door B, or how to circle around to eliminate enemies A,B, and C, all the way down to the horribly difficult puzzles of Riven and Myst.

I have always been one to believe that a game, no matter how phenominal the story line, can fail miserably without a decent soundtrack. Sound has come to play a role of increasing importance in gameing today. I still remember when simple bleeps and bloops were amazing to the ear. Now, we expect full symphonic musical scores that help to suck the player into the atmosphere of the game. A decent sound track is an absolute must in my mind. Most particularly in todays industry as video games are moving away from the simple concept of Mario and Luigi to the huge gaping movieesque storylines of the Final Fantasy Series. The music helps make the environiment, which helps make the game.

Graphical enhancements are great, but what good are they if the rest of the game is sub-par? These days I expect alot more out of a gaming engine. Especially when compared to what we used to accept as "high end" graphics out of older games like Pong, or any of the Commodore 64 games. If I do not find something visually appealing, I frequently pass it by.

Reputation, now I know many people feel that this is a bad way to judge games. However, if it is part of a series of games I have come to enjoy playing, I more often then not pick up the next game in the series. Just think of how many HL players are going to pick up HL2 just based on the name and the developer alone. If a game is garbage and they make a sequal, would you buy it? To put it in another perspective, if The Matrix sucked and they made a sequal, would you want to watch it? No? My point exactly. This in no way means that I will not try a product from another company, it just means that I will question the game before I buy it outright.

I suppose the most important aspect of a game for me is the story line. I am a bit biased here as I am a writer in my spare time. The storyline of a game is the games backbone. If the story line is trash, the game hits the bargain bin quickly. Let us take for example the game Gore. The game is a great multiplayer shoot em up. However, the developers threw some single player levels in at the last minute and expected it to work...well the single player aspect of the game is TRASH as the storyline is essentially non-existant. However, there is EXCEPTIONS to this rule. My point of example here is the Medal of Honor games. If any of us really looks at these games, there is no definitive storyline that captivates the player and there isn't even a neat "ending" to the games, they just stop after you beat that last hard level. While the driving force behind MOHAA is it's gameplay the storyline is really quite weak.

Another thing I feel is very important about gaming is fluidity. What exactly do I mean by fluidity? Well essentially I am talking about how the game flows from one thing to another. Let us take for example Return to Castle Wolfenstein. The player starts off in prison only for the story to take huge plot twists that pull the player further and further into the web of the games story. Fluidity is the process of which the game transitions from one aspect of the storyline to another. If it is choppy as hell, as is done with FallOut Tactics the player really loses his contact with the gaming world. In FOT the story jumps from point to point without really telling the player WHY things progressed they way they do or why they get moved to another bunker, beyond being told they have to.

My final criteria about video games is simply fun factor. How much FUN do I have playing the game? Games like Counter-Strike/Half-Life and Atomic Bomberman have been long time favorites of mine. By todays standards they are no where near the pinnacle of visual or audio perfection but for their time, WOW! Half-Life nailed every single thing mentioned above and I ENJOYED playing it over and over again. Atomic Bomberman looks like an NES conversion to the PC, but it is so much fun it's ridiculous. Finally Counter-Strike still implementing a 16 bit gaming engine (thank you Quake 2!) it has managed to pull off something never done before, and never done since. Counter-Strike has never failed to entertain (speaking from the perspective of the tens of thousands that play it at any given second in time).

So to summarize this rather long post of mine here are my criteria:

A Workable User Interface
Some Form of Mental Involvement
Sound Track
Acceptable Graphics
Companies/Product Lines Reputation
Great Story Line
Fluidity of the Game
Fun Factor

I hope this answers your question

Markius · Nov 12, 2003, 01:51 PM

you are a writer? you dont like to write, do you? [JK]

for me a game has to be fun..thats it really...any genre will do, i like them all.

wertret · Nov 12, 2003, 01:55 PM

When i play a game i want to be part of the story, feel what the hero feel, so the plot is the most important for me. Max payne 2 or Undying are good examples.

IronChisel · Nov 12, 2003, 04:48 PM

A good story and a constant progression throughout the game that keeps you both interested and eager to progress, are what makes a game good to me. Deads spots are an instant killer with a short attention span.

Mazuko · Nov 12, 2003, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Markius
you are a writer? you dont like to write, do you? [JK]

Hah!

Dyre Straits · Nov 13, 2003, 01:54 AM

From my own experience, it matters not what kind of game it is, if it doesn't have a compelling story and plot, I tend to lose interest. That's one reason I'd never put a 'fragfest' game into a 'great game' category.

So, give me a good story and I'm one happy gamer.

Personal examples:

Deus Ex
Max Payne 1 & 2
Syberia
Descent 3 and Mercenary
The Tex Murphy Series

spark rain fire · Nov 13, 2003, 02:27 AM

cleavage.

Chaos · Nov 13, 2003, 02:33 AM

To me it's the feel that the game presents.....For me the original UT had a feel that was always fun even though it was very mindless at times.....Eye Candy is a must today but it has to be equaled by the gameplay. Max Payne 2 stands out in that department for me. Then there is COD, this is the first Army Simulation that was ever able to hold my attention. I think it is the amazing colours and lighting along with decent gameplay, it's a must have these days...

~~craig588~~ · Nov 13, 2003, 02:53 AM

I want games with driving, rail shooting, and great positional sound!

I really want to see a game like that.

On another note, games like rogue are also alot of fun.

Storyline is only important if its very good. Usually if its a bad storyline, it wont affect the game too terribly.

RoadhawK · Nov 13, 2003, 10:05 PM

Originality, every time.

I get sick of the same old fps formula. It's like someone delberately restricts what you can or cannot do because they can't be bothered or don't know how to be different.

Sound and graphics should always be secondary, after all, some of the best games over the last few years don't have amazing graphics or sound but it certainly helps to create an atmosphere that can make or break a big game.

Half life 2 and Doom III look great from the footage available but will they have that something that makes a game great? i guess we'll only know when we get the chance to try it firsthand.

Oblivious · Nov 14, 2003, 02:36 AM

Hmm, talk about a neglected thread! Well hey. I've read all your posts and it's really interesting to see what gamers want.

I think I should rephrase the question though: if you could make a game, what would it be like?

The_Neon_Cowboy · Nov 14, 2003, 02:42 AM

what matters most is that you get into the game... its hard to explain...

Bicka · Nov 14, 2003, 03:57 AM

Its kinda hard for me to pin point my exact style.
I really do prefer a really good story driven game (metal gear solid1+2, system shock 1+2) or something unique and different (hidden and dangerous).
As an all time favourite game I can't really put in multiplayer games because most of them still havent lived up to what they really could achieve. The only one multiplayer game thats came close was Hidden and dangerous. A highly buggy game but great idea none the less.
Somewhere in the mixed mess of all time great games, Quake has to make an appearence. The one game that didnt have a single storyline to its progression but yet was immensely addictive and fun. I couldnt tell you how many times I played that from begining to end.

~~craig588~~ · Nov 14, 2003, 04:12 AM

The one game I can remember that was pretty bad in every aspect except for storyline was fallout. Graphics were eh, sound was eh, control was eh, system was pretty good, but the storyline was freaking amazing!

I loved Fallout and Fallout 2. Fallout tactics sucked because they tried to make an action game out of it, and thats not what it needed.

Bicka · Nov 14, 2003, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oblivious
Hmm, talk about a neglected thread! Well hey. I've read all your posts and it's really interesting to see what gamers want. I think I should rephrase the question though: if you could make a game, what would it be like?

Probably something that equals the world in scale and lets you do whatever you want to do. That would be my single player game at least. Give me a character I can relate to and a story that compels me to continue playing and you got yourself a game.
My ideal multiplayer game has always been something that incorporates teamwork to pilot, target, aim and manage a flying craft. Always liked the idea of having the ability to see a group of people pull together and work as one. Just to be able to walk in to it and see what individual people are doing. Thats my idea of a multiplayer world. Not the kind where you walk around with a gun clicking on things and instantly taking off and shooting away like a mad man. My game would have a reason to use what it has in it. Even if there wasnt an enemy to fight and it was just a case of using the ship to get to a location on the world and explore, then i'd be happy. If you've ever wanted to have a walk around 'nature' in 3dmark then you'll know what I'm getting at.

Nov 12, 2003, 05:09 AM	#1
Oblivious DivrerHaeven Seinor Mebmer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 236 Rep Power: 0	What makes a game great? Howdy everyone, Games have been cooking my noodle recently and I know I have my misconceptions. So I wanted to know the truth about gaming. I want to know what is most important to you guys in a game. Why do you play a game? I've always liked twich gaming. To me it's a meditative experience... while I quake or CS I find my mind absolutely devoid of all thought. On the other hand I love RPGs like FF Tactics. They are like a puzzle... the challenge of beating them drives me to play. Why do you play (what you play) ? Edit: I appologize for the spelling errors! GOMEN! __________________ Pepole olny raed wrods. Btu oyu shuodl sitll check oyur spleling! http://realgar.hopto.org Last edited by Oblivious; Nov 12, 2003 at 05:17 AM.

Nov 12, 2003, 06:02 AM	#2
Mazuko DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Fredericksburg, VA Posts: 1,008 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	I have been a gamer for years and I feel that I have developed some rather particular tastes. Personally, I am partial to a game that meets several criteria that I have accumulated over the years, and quite frankly I feel that they apply to every genre I have played. No matter how great a game may be, if the user interface (and keyboard mapping) is trash, the game is not worth playing. One of the magics of First Person Shooters like CS and Quake is the fact that the keyboard layouts remain relatively consitent throughout all FPS variations (IE W,A,S,D for movement). One example of how not to setup a keyboard is "Independence War" talk about some difficult commands to learn. I like a game to be mentally challenging. This does not necessarily mean it has to have puzzles, rather it should somehow stimulate some thinking process. For example, how to get past door B, or how to circle around to eliminate enemies A,B, and C, all the way down to the horribly difficult puzzles of Riven and Myst. I have always been one to believe that a game, no matter how phenominal the story line, can fail miserably without a decent soundtrack. Sound has come to play a role of increasing importance in gameing today. I still remember when simple bleeps and bloops were amazing to the ear. Now, we expect full symphonic musical scores that help to suck the player into the atmosphere of the game. A decent sound track is an absolute must in my mind. Most particularly in todays industry as video games are moving away from the simple concept of Mario and Luigi to the huge gaping movieesque storylines of the Final Fantasy Series. The music helps make the environiment, which helps make the game. Graphical enhancements are great, but what good are they if the rest of the game is sub-par? These days I expect alot more out of a gaming engine. Especially when compared to what we used to accept as "high end" graphics out of older games like Pong, or any of the Commodore 64 games. If I do not find something visually appealing, I frequently pass it by. Reputation, now I know many people feel that this is a bad way to judge games. However, if it is part of a series of games I have come to enjoy playing, I more often then not pick up the next game in the series. Just think of how many HL players are going to pick up HL2 just based on the name and the developer alone. If a game is garbage and they make a sequal, would you buy it? To put it in another perspective, if The Matrix sucked and they made a sequal, would you want to watch it? No? My point exactly. This in no way means that I will not try a product from another company, it just means that I will question the game before I buy it outright. I suppose the most important aspect of a game for me is the story line. I am a bit biased here as I am a writer in my spare time. The storyline of a game is the games backbone. If the story line is trash, the game hits the bargain bin quickly. Let us take for example the game Gore. The game is a great multiplayer shoot em up. However, the developers threw some single player levels in at the last minute and expected it to work...well the single player aspect of the game is TRASH as the storyline is essentially non-existant. However, there is EXCEPTIONS to this rule. My point of example here is the Medal of Honor games. If any of us really looks at these games, there is no definitive storyline that captivates the player and there isn't even a neat "ending" to the games, they just stop after you beat that last hard level. While the driving force behind MOHAA is it's gameplay the storyline is really quite weak. Another thing I feel is very important about gaming is fluidity. What exactly do I mean by fluidity? Well essentially I am talking about how the game flows from one thing to another. Let us take for example Return to Castle Wolfenstein. The player starts off in prison only for the story to take huge plot twists that pull the player further and further into the web of the games story. Fluidity is the process of which the game transitions from one aspect of the storyline to another. If it is choppy as hell, as is done with FallOut Tactics the player really loses his contact with the gaming world. In FOT the story jumps from point to point without really telling the player WHY things progressed they way they do or why they get moved to another bunker, beyond being told they have to. My final criteria about video games is simply fun factor. How much FUN do I have playing the game? Games like Counter-Strike/Half-Life and Atomic Bomberman have been long time favorites of mine. By todays standards they are no where near the pinnacle of visual or audio perfection but for their time, WOW! Half-Life nailed every single thing mentioned above and I ENJOYED playing it over and over again. Atomic Bomberman looks like an NES conversion to the PC, but it is so much fun it's ridiculous. Finally Counter-Strike still implementing a 16 bit gaming engine (thank you Quake 2!) it has managed to pull off something never done before, and never done since. Counter-Strike has never failed to entertain (speaking from the perspective of the tens of thousands that play it at any given second in time). So to summarize this rather long post of mine here are my criteria: A Workable User Interface Some Form of Mental Involvement Sound Track Acceptable Graphics Companies/Product Lines Reputation Great Story Line Fluidity of the Game Fun Factor I hope this answers your question __________________ E-bay feedback: http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAP...me=STRK:ME:UFS Last edited by Mazuko; Nov 12, 2003 at 06:09 AM.

Nov 12, 2003, 01:51 PM	#3
Markius DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,350 Rep Power: 0	you are a writer? you dont like to write, do you? [JK] for me a game has to be fun..thats it really...any genre will do, i like them all. __________________ DriverHeavens Aussie... "Lifes tragedy is that we get old too soon and wise too late"

Nov 12, 2003, 01:55 PM	#4
wertret Still watching... Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Orihuela (Spain) Posts: 1,560 Rep Power: 0	When i play a game i want to be part of the story, feel what the hero feel, so the plot is the most important for me. Max payne 2 or Undying are good examples. __________________ "They who dream by day are cognizant of many things which escape those who dream only by night."

Nov 12, 2003, 04:48 PM	#5
IronChisel DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: With the Winds Posts: 263 Rep Power: 0	A good story and a constant progression throughout the game that keeps you both interested and eager to progress, are what makes a game good to me. Deads spots are an instant killer with a short attention span. __________________ Last edited by IronChisel; Nov 12, 2003 at 07:23 PM.

Nov 13, 2003, 02:27 AM	#8
spark rain fire i am rad. Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: central pa Posts: 236 Rep Power: 0	cleavage. __________________ ---- [color=red]http://www.invalidsystemdisk.vze.com[/color]

Nov 13, 2003, 02:33 AM	#9
Chaos Number Nine Join Date: May 2002 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 5,269 Rep Power: 165 System Specs	To me it's the feel that the game presents.....For me the original UT had a feel that was always fun even though it was very mindless at times.....Eye Candy is a must today but it has to be equaled by the gameplay. Max Payne 2 stands out in that department for me. Then there is COD, this is the first Army Simulation that was ever able to hold my attention. I think it is the amazing colours and lighting along with decent gameplay, it's a must have these days... __________________

Nov 13, 2003, 02:53 AM	#10
~~craig588~~ Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: In clothing Posts: 3,510 Rep Power: 0	I want games with driving, rail shooting, and great positional sound! I really want to see a game like that. On another note, games like rogue are also alot of fun. Storyline is only important if its very good. Usually if its a bad storyline, it wont affect the game too terribly.

Nov 13, 2003, 10:05 PM	#11
RoadhawK DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Location: Location Posts: 2 Rep Power: 0	Originality, every time. I get sick of the same old fps formula. It's like someone delberately restricts what you can or cannot do because they can't be bothered or don't know how to be different. Sound and graphics should always be secondary, after all, some of the best games over the last few years don't have amazing graphics or sound but it certainly helps to create an atmosphere that can make or break a big game. Half life 2 and Doom III look great from the footage available but will they have that something that makes a game great? i guess we'll only know when we get the chance to try it firsthand.

Nov 14, 2003, 02:36 AM	Thread Starter #12
Oblivious DivrerHaeven Seinor Mebmer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Baltimore, MD Posts: 236 Rep Power: 0	Hmm, talk about a neglected thread! Well hey. I've read all your posts and it's really interesting to see what gamers want. I think I should rephrase the question though: if you could make a game, what would it be like? __________________ Pepole olny raed wrods. Btu oyu shuodl sitll check oyur spleling! http://realgar.hopto.org

Nov 14, 2003, 02:42 AM	#13
The_Neon_Cowboy HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 16,009 Rep Power: 90 System Specs	what matters most is that you get into the game... its hard to explain... __________________

Nov 14, 2003, 03:57 AM	#14
Bicka DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 670 Rep Power: 0	Its kinda hard for me to pin point my exact style. I really do prefer a really good story driven game (metal gear solid1+2, system shock 1+2) or something unique and different (hidden and dangerous). As an all time favourite game I can't really put in multiplayer games because most of them still havent lived up to what they really could achieve. The only one multiplayer game thats came close was Hidden and dangerous. A highly buggy game but great idea none the less. Somewhere in the mixed mess of all time great games, Quake has to make an appearence. The one game that didnt have a single storyline to its progression but yet was immensely addictive and fun. I couldnt tell you how many times I played that from begining to end.

Nov 14, 2003, 04:12 AM	#15
~~craig588~~ Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: In clothing Posts: 3,510 Rep Power: 0	The one game I can remember that was pretty bad in every aspect except for storyline was fallout. Graphics were eh, sound was eh, control was eh, system was pretty good, but the storyline was freaking amazing! I loved Fallout and Fallout 2. Fallout tactics sucked because they tried to make an action game out of it, and thats not what it needed.