xenomorph1138

Installed kx drivers (3538) in brand new hp pavilion (Vista Premium 32bit)for my sblive 5.1 022x. Sound card seems to function and kx drivers work but audio has pops n cracks(artifacts). I uninstalled and reinstalled the drivers three times. I installed these programs twice and updated (Acid Music Studio & FL Studio) to rule out corrupt install. It is most noticable in Acid when playing pads, strings or atomospheres (low decibel). Plucked, drums and precussion not so noticable, for obvious reasons. A single loop in Acid with no plugins or effects running with less than 5% cpu usage. FL Studio very much the same. Load a single plugin with no effects and less than 5% cpu= pops and cracks (or maybe very short dropouts) every 2 to 5 seconds as long as 15 to 30 seconds but always. It's driving me nuts!!. PLEASE HELP, before I shoot my computer!!! Thanx for any and I mean any help or insight to this problem.
PS: This is my second post for this problem. The first (a few months ago) I recieved only one reply from another noob which wasn't much help. In the mean time I'll keep looking at more threads.

signed,
Extremely Frustrated

weenerdog

xeno:

what audio driver are you using in fl studio (options menu -> audio settings)? kx asio? primary sound driver? asio multimedia?

it sounds as if your buffer size is set too small. try using kx asio and clicking on the button that says 'asio panel' and setting the latency to something pretty high (32 ms?) and see if the pops and crackles go away. if that helps, work your way back down to the least latency that sounds good.

hope this helps

xenomorph1138

Thx for the response and suggestion. Actually I made some 10 sec wav recordings of the problem with each driver asio4all, direct sound, windows classic wav, that I was going to attach but when I saw the 1 byte limit, I thought, you've got to be kidding! I mean it would be alot easier to understand just what kind of clicks and pops if one could hear it. Anyway, yes I played with the latency in FL Studio on severals times with no luck elieviating the problem and seems to be unrelated. Although it is not as bad in FL as in Acid. My main gripe is with the sound coming from Acid. I mostly use FL for making loops for Acid then edit them in Sound Forge then goes to Acid. Acid it's like every 5 sec, click...pop...pop..click......the pops are more like a very very short dropout. when I expand the wav in Sound Forge you can see where it looks like the vol has just dropped to -40 decibels or less then jumps right bak up. (Note: the pops are not in the original loop, only when I play it back in Acid.)Not to sound ungrateful for kx drivers but I never had this kind of problems with the creative drivers in my XP machine with half the speed. I don't understand. This is so frustrating. I love all the features of the kx but if I can't get a decent sound out of either Acid or FL wtf it's not doin any good. Maybe it's the vista driver model. Sorry for dumpping. Do you or anyone else have any other suggestions? Cause my next and only other option is to get rid of Vista and try XP in this HP Pav. But not giving up yet. I'll stop babbling now. Thx for any and all help.

Maddogg6

Hmm - no test with kX ASIO driver? (this is the kX Project support forum - right? kX is more known for its ASIO performance than DSound or WAVE performance - tho, both are nothing to laugh at either - usually)

Some report good ASIO4ALL performance (In XP AFAIK) - but, I didn't when I tried - tho I dont have much optimized with my PC I use for other things too - and with Vistas dropped support of hardware accelerated audio... it would not be surprising to hear that Vistas slower anyway.

Russ

I would also suggest trying a newer version of kX. I would guess that there have been some improvements for Vista since 3538... Hopefully someone that is actually using Vista can point you to the best version to use with it (and maybe offer some other Vista related tips).

trex_daemon

Increasing the buffers will solve the problem. Had the same issue.

xenomorph1138

Thx for the input. [COLOR=orange]@trex[/COLOR] Yes I also tried the buffer adjustment with no luck. [COLOR=darkorange]@maddog[/COLOR] Forgive me and don't laugh but what is AFAIK? From my experince (in my XP machine with 1/2 the cpu) the asio4all in FL was by far twice the performance as the direct sound, MME and win classic wav drivers and without a question much better performance than anything I've been able to get out of my brand new Vista machine, (but XP machine still lacking in the cpu speed, 1.5ghz to my 3ghz in Vista machine). Of course the XP machine had the creative drivers in it. I never heard of kx until I got my new Vista machine and couldn't find drivers for it, so I never tried kx in my XP machine. But in my Vista machine asio4all has 1/2 the performance as the others which isn't saying much since none of the drivers seem to perform without poping and as I said in other post, this problem is not as bad in FL as in Acid but enough in both as to not be worth working with untill problem is solved. As for the asio test, I would have but I can't figure out how to use the asio drivers. In Acid it says I don't have an asio suppoted card (SB022x) and in FL,...well, I just assumed one needed to have an E-MU 1212M or 0404 or some other asio supported card, but if I am incorrectly informed and I can setup kx so I can use asio drivers I'm all on it if someone would like to point me in the right direction or include a link to some instructions I would really be grateful. [COLOR=orange]@Russ[/COLOR] As for updating kx, I tried uninstalling the 3538 drivers but Vista won't let me install the 3541 untill I reboot and when I reboot, Vista installs some generic drivers or SB drivers during boot process then I have to uninstall them and of course Vista says I have to reboot to complete the uninstall and round and round I go. Even if I go to device manager, same thing, I have to reboot and Vista does'nt give me a choice whether I want to install the hardware drivers (my XP gives me a choice. Go figure.) or not during boot and I have not been able to terminate the auto install process. I can see the hardware install icon in the system tray while this is going on but if I r-click or l-click on the icon nothing happens and finally a window pops up informing me that the drivers (not kx) were installed and round and round I go. I tried installing the 3541 over the 3538 and when I booted I got the BSOD. If there is anything else I can try to update kx in Vista or any other suggestions please tell me. I'm seriously contemplating downgrading to XP but in doing that to an HP machine with preinstalled Vista I'm bound to run into problems finding compatable drivers for hardware that was designed with Vista in mind and of course MS and the computer manufacturers don't want you to downgrade for obvious reasons. Am I babbling again? I know, I'm babbling again. [COLOR=cyan]Thx again for everyones input.[/COLOR] Please keep it coming.

PS: I have 2 other SB cards. CT4760 out of a server and CT4780 out of a Dell if anyone knows if either one of these cards are known to work better.

[COLOR=lime]Also, are there any knowlegable Vista people out there?[/COLOR]

Russ

I think that you should be able to install kX over the generic driver that Vista is auto-installing. For that matter, before reinstalling kX, you might give the generic driver a try, just to see how it performs.

Beyond the above, I would suggest performing a clean boot (i.e. run MSCONFIG and (temporarily) disable everything on the STARTUP tab, except kxmixer, and maybe disable any services on the SERVICES tab that might be causing problems (i.e. anti-virus, etc)) and re-test, to try and rule out other software as causing the problem (OEM systems tend to come bundled with a bunch of worthless junk, that often starts automatically with Windows).

xenomorph1138

@ Russ Thx I'll do that and report back later. Thx again.

Xeno

Maddogg6

As Far As I Know

kX is up to version 3545B now, perhaps Vista install issues have been worked out.
http://www.hardwareheaven.com/general-...ion-3545b.html

I seen mention of installing manually in safe mode (?? what ever that means exactly??)

xenomorph1138

Haven't had a chance to try any of the latest suggestions today (MSCONFIG and Safe Mode ideas). Good suggestions. I'll try the safe mode first. I'm a little more familiar with it, than the MSGONFIG. I'll check back. THX.

Xeno

Russ

Sure, take your time

I am not sure if there are any differences under Vista, but MsConfig is actually pretty simple to use.

i.e.
Start -> Run -> MsConfig -> OK
Startup Tab: Uncheck everything except kxmixer (and maybe stuff like software related to keyboard or mouse).
Services Tab: Check the box labeled "Hide All Microsoft Services" to narrow down the number of services shown. Uncheck stuff like any antivirus service, or anything that you suspect might contribute to the problem.
Click Apply, and restart.

After restarting, the msconfig utility should come back up to let you know that you are using a selective startup. Just cancel out of that and test. When you are done testing, you can just run msconfig again, and choose "Normal Startup" on the General tab to re-enable everything (or optionally, if the problem went away, you might try re-enabling things one at a time, to try and determine which specific thing is causing the problem).

How to use MSCONFIG in Windows XP and Vista

Of course, the above might not help at all, as there are many possible causes.

xenomorph1138

OK...I tried the generic driver. Did not work so well. Made this god awful sound, so that was dead. In safe mode I was able to get the 3545b installed. No prob. Just no sound at all and I played around with it all day. Ok...maybe it was 2 or 3 hrs but it felt like all day. Not even system sounds. I tried swirching rear to front. Front to rear. When I installed 3538 a few months back, I had sound right away. Didn't have to mess around with the settings, other than switching the front and rear but I have my phones plugged into either one anyway and the other goes to my amp. Any thoughts. This problem is really burnin' me out. It's pretty much been like this since I did the 3538 install few months back. But I did not notice the clicks and pops (or what ever they are)so much because I work with alot of drum and percussion sounds, samples and loops. Then recently I started working with pads, strings and atomosphere sounds and those pops and clicks were right in my face. I can't pretend there not there. I guess I'll try 3541. Please keep the input coming. Thank you for your invaluable help and patience.

Xeno

[COLOR=lime]PS:ANYONE OUT THERE USING VISTA 32 AND SB0228 CARD WITH ACID AND OR FL STUDIO THAT HAD SIMILAR PROBLEMS PLEASE SHARE YOUR WISDOM.[/COLOR]

Russ

Hmm, do you have more then 4GB of RAM?

<edit>
The above should read 2GB of RAM...
</edit>

xenomorph1138

@Russ, I only have 3gb ram. I think thats the max one can have in a 32bit system. In a fit of desperation I put my X-Fi back in and I suddenly remembered why I took it out in the first place and put SBLiive back and found out about KX Project. Half the devices that are there in XP are just not there in Vista, for instance anything other than mic and line-in rec in Vista you can forget it! Recording from one program to another? Get error "Device does not exist." Anyway I'm gonna try CT4780 and see if that works any better. I'll get back and let u know how it went. Sorry for getting off topic.


[COLOR=#00ff00]PS:ANYONE OUT THERE USING VISTA 32 AND SB0228 CARD WITH ACID AND OR FL STUDIO THAT HAD SIMILAR PROBLEMS PLEASE SHARE YOUR WISDOM.[/COLOR]

Russ

Oops, sorry that should have read 2GB...

Here is a quote from Eugene (regarding Vista):

xenomorph1138

Thx for the quote. Not sure how it relates to my problem. I also checked out the link. Very informative. I put the CT4780 in and after I sign off here I'll install KX Drivers. Hope this works. BTW do you know which Audigy card works best with KX drivers? I think I might go on ebay and pick up a 24bit. Also, can I use asio drivers with SBlive? (not asio4all) Thx again. I'll post my results tomorrow.

[COLOR=#00ff00]PS:ANYONE OUT THERE USING VISTA 32 AND SB0228 CARD WITH ACID AND OR FL STUDIO THAT HAD SIMILAR PROBLEMS PLEASE SHARE YOUR WISDOM.[/COLOR]

xeno

Russ

Well the issue is with the sound card's hardware. As I understand it, it can only work with addresses below 2GB, so in order to use these cards with >2GB, some work-around is needed, and currently Eugene does not have a workaround for the WinMM/DSound/KS buffers.

You may get better results with XP, since XP generally limits applications to the lower 2GB of the 4GB address space, while the OS uses the upper 2GB (or maybe E. was able to limit the memory boundaries under XP? (I do not know, I do not do driver development, but I have seen reports of people using >2GB successfully with XP)).

I am not an expert on this issue, but I imagine the results that you get could vary with memory usage (hardware and application, etc). This may explain the different results you are getting at different times (i.e. no sound, choppy sound, etc)?

I think that leaves only a few possible solutions:
1) Use the Creative driver.
2) Remove some memory from the system.
3) Use Windows XP.

xenomorph1138

You understand a hell of alot more than I do about computers cause I'm still havin' hard time keepin up,but no matter. After installing the CT4780 and the KX3545b drivers, In Acid I think I have a winner behind door number 3. ASIO4all in Acid seems to be working...not 100%, but damn close. MME, Dsound not so good, but audibly better. Now, if it stays that way, I'm happy as a pig in shit. Tommorrow, I'll check out FL Studio to see how thats performing. BTW, can someone tell me what sample rates and bit depths does the kx asio support? Thx again for all the support. And thx [COLOR=wheat]E.[/COLOR]

Russ

With 10k1 Models (both cards that you have):
16 bit/44.1 kHz for playback only.
16 bit/48 kHz for playback and recording.

With 10k2 Models:
16 bit/44.1 kHz for playback only.
16 bit/48 kHz for playback and recording.
24 bit/48 kHz for playback and recording (only in recent versions of kX).

xenomorph1138

OK. Things are lookin' better. My therapist even says I can get off the prozac. Anyway, I'm working on getting my recording and editing program setup (Sound Forge). I am able to record from one prog to another. Record from mic is good. Line-in I am having a problem getting a signal when recording. I unmuted AC97 on the "in & out" page in the kx mixer so I can hear it out the speakers but there is no signal in the rec level meters in Sound Forge. ACV97 page I unmuted the rec gain and turned the sliders up and also tried highlighting the line-in on the drop down menu but no signal. Is there something I need to setup in the DSP? Thx again.

Russ

Recording from the MIC and recording from Line In are both recording from AC97, so the setup and DSP config is exactly the same for both [COLOR=Gray](ignoring options specific to the MIC, such as +20 dB MIC Boost)[/COLOR], except you need to choose MIC or Line In as the AC97 source on the AC97 page of kxmixer, depending on which one you want to record from at the time. It is the same for any AC97 source.

xenomorph1138

@Russ, Thx for all your help and input. I haven't solved the line-in thing yet but that's not a high priority at the moment. I do have one more question. On my other spare cards there are two sets of pins opposite the external plugins. It says AUD_EXT. Do you know what that is for? Thx, you've been extremely helpful and patient. It's to bad one can't get this kind of support with with the shit we buy. Go figure. Right?

PS:I installed xp on an alternate hd in my hp (vista) machine. Found all the xp drivers for the hp mb (asus). HP told me ethernet drivers would not work but apparently they do, since I'm online now. Anyway, I guess we can close out this thread and I hope this topic was or will be helpful to someone else. Thx again.

Xeno