Audigy 2 ZS mic and line question

igor_levicki · Dec 3, 2003, 05:38 PM

Hi,
Is it finaly possible to have indepedent effects and to record indepedent streams from mic-in and line-in at the same time (or the signals are still mixed in analog before they get to DSP)?
Thanks.

Daniel Drummond · Dec 3, 2003, 05:59 PM

That won't be possible because the hardware structure of the soundcard. Mic-in and line-in are not handled by the creative chip. Instead they're handled by an AC97 codec which sends its output signal to the creative chip, where dsp really happens, so only the AC97 output mixed sound can be affected.
In the help file that is available through KX mixer, take a look at kX Input/Output Signal Flow Diagram and you understand this better.

pzmt · Dec 4, 2003, 11:02 AM

It is posible to add independent efects to mic and line in (and independent recording too). There is some undocumented options to enable Philips ADC on Audigy 2. Mic will go throught AC97 ADC and line in throught Philips ADC. This is default way for example on Linux ALSA driver (1.0.0rc1) - you are able to listen line in + mic and independent record mic without line in. (Sorry, I don't use kxdrivers, but I am sure that this can by done with current kxdrivers, default creative drivers have independent mic and analog mix).

igor_levicki · Dec 4, 2003, 09:55 PM

Thanks pxmt I thought it was possible since I can have separate effects in windows.

Daniel Drummond · Dec 5, 2003, 12:11 AM

No, this can't be done by KX drivers.

pzmt · Dec 5, 2003, 08:08 AM

Use kxctrl -sac97 0 0 to enable Philips ADC (kxctrl -sac97 0 9f1f to disable) choose ac97 recording source to Mic, set AC97 Recording Level for mic, set volume for line in (and unmute) . On input in 0, in 1 (AC97) will by mic and on input in10, in11 (AC97.2) will by line in. On in10, in11 will be mix from all analog sources - than if you want listen only line in mute cd and other analog sources (not for Audigy Drive). This should work from kxdrivers 5.00.3533 and is marked in ChangeLog as experimental. As I wrote I am not using kxdrivers, but I think, that this should work (I will try it, and send result on monday).

Daniel Drummond · Dec 5, 2003, 10:50 AM

Pzmt, that's great! I'm certainly going to try it out... So there is a back door to it... Nice. I said this couldn't be done because this has been discussed many times and that was the answer. But I found the thread about enabling philips adc and I saw it's pretty new info around here. Thanks!

pzmt · Dec 5, 2003, 11:46 AM

Looks like you have Audigy 1. this should work on it too, but there is one problem: default is mix output from AC97 routed to front speaker, and Philips ADC is connected to this mix(this bypass DSP). Then you will hear line in from front speaker. This can by dissabled, but I don't know if kxdrivers supports this now. On Audigy 2 it should work OK.

Nando Dominguez · Dec 5, 2003, 02:22 PM

Hi everyone.

Can anyone tell me how to do it?

Sorry, I'm not programmer so when I look into kXctrl it's very confused for me.
Thanx
Nando

musicman · Dec 5, 2003, 03:56 PM

would a person be able to record an AC97 mic, and a Line2/Mic2 on the Audigy Drive at the same time for two different track sources

Daniel Drummond · Dec 7, 2003, 10:27 PM

Musicman, yes, if you use KX ASIO that's easily accomplished.

**Eugene Gavrilov** · Dec 7, 2003, 11:27 PM

well... concerning this Philips UDA
it is really present on Audigy1 board, and there seems to be a special hardware 'bit' to enable/disable certain signal routings
however, due to lack of any related documentation, it is currently impossible to check the details...
especially since I currently don't have any live/audigy1(2) board with an AC-97 codec

if you simply enable ac97 master volume (by using the "kxctrl -sac97 0 0" command), you may not always get what you really need

anyway, =both= the ac97 input and philips UDA input are available as separate sources in the kX Mixer
('ac97' and 'ac97 2')
you may also need to execute additional commands in order to achieve your goal...
so, the question is: are there any special 'bits' -- and what are they

-=-=

audigy2 users may wish to play with the 0x80 bit of the HCFG register
(kxctrl -gfn0 0x14 --- kxctrl -sfn0 0x14 {value AND/XOR 0x80 } ) --- NOTE do NOT program this register unless you really know what you are doing since this can damage your card / cause your PC to hang etc...

/Eugene

pzmt · Dec 8, 2003, 07:50 AM

I have Audigy 1 (using ALSA under linux). Philips ADC is enabled by default. On audigy 1 was only problem route from AC97 output to front speakers, which is enabled by default (on Audigy 2 is dissabled - I think). On Audigy 1 this route can by dissabled by seting bit 0x80 in HCFG and setting master volume on AC97. On Audigy 2 is only needed setting master volume. I use Philips ADC as default input for 2-3 week. From feedback looks, like it is working well on Audigu 2 too.

pzmt · Dec 9, 2003, 08:16 AM

Hi,

Last evening I tested kxdrivers version 3536. It works but setup is diffrent. I used Audigy 1.

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Use at your own risk.
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For Audigy 1 only:
use command line and execute

kxctrl -gfn0 0x18

it prints some value - for me it was 0xe000
set 0x80 bit to this value newval = 0xe080

then run
kxctrl -sfn0 0x18 newval
for me it was kxctrl -sfn0 0x18 0xe080

this dissables route from ac97 to front speakers - it is needed only form Audigy 1

Then for Audigy 1 and Audigy2:

run
kxctlr -sac97 2 0

this sets master volume for ac97.

Thats all.

Then
on ac97 page
set recording source to mic, set record gain (better smaller, other there will be loopback - and bad sound)
unmute line, set line in volume
on volume page (I think it was second)
unmute and set ac97 volume - you should hear mic from speakers
unmute and set ac97.2 volume - you should hear line in

mic is on prolog outputs 0, 1
line in is on prolog outputs 10, 11

Do not reset ac97. If yes then rerun kxctrl -sac97 2 0

Caster · Feb 5, 2004, 03:40 PM

Thanks, works like a charm! What's the best way to let this happen after each restart, just some .bat file in startup or another way to let KX remember those changes?

**Eugene Gavrilov** · Feb 6, 2004, 12:29 AM

ac97 setting should be restored automatically

as for 'hcfg' setting, you will need to use a 'bat' file or something like that...
perhaps, I will add an option to disable ac97->front routing in the future [probably, to the 'ac97' page of the kxmixer]

/E

igor_levicki · Jan 3, 2005, 03:46 AM

@Eugene:
What is the status of this feature in current drivers/next planned release?

**dj_stick** · Jan 3, 2005, 10:49 PM

there is an option in the ac97 page regarding this
but i still use a batch file

Code:

@echo off
kxctrl $0 -sac97 2 0
kxctrl $1 -sac97 2 0
kxctrl $0 -shw 19 1

$0 is my audigy and $1 is my audigy 2, it put it in the start-up folder in the start menu

**Eugene Gavrilov** · Jan 7, 2005, 04:07 AM

>> there is an option in the ac97 page regarding this
>> but i still use a batch file

but does the option work?

E.

**dj_stick** · Jan 7, 2005, 04:35 AM

yes the option does work

after that post i did a little testing going between the mixer option and the command line and seeing the kX mixer's reaction

Dec 3, 2003, 05:38 PM	#1
igor_levicki Intel Black Belt Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Belgrade, Serbia Posts: 128 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Audigy 2 ZS mic and line question Hi, Is it finaly possible to have indepedent effects and to record indepedent streams from mic-in and line-in at the same time (or the signals are still mixed in analog before they get to DSP)? Thanks. __________________ Regards, Igor Levicki -- Creative Audigy 2 ZS Retail (SB0350) kX 3538h

Dec 3, 2003, 05:59 PM	#2
Daniel Drummond DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brazil Posts: 1,137 Rep Power: 0	That won't be possible because the hardware structure of the soundcard. Mic-in and line-in are not handled by the creative chip. Instead they're handled by an AC97 codec which sends its output signal to the creative chip, where dsp really happens, so only the AC97 output mixed sound can be affected. In the help file that is available through KX mixer, take a look at kX Input/Output Signal Flow Diagram and you understand this better. __________________ www.palcomp3.com.br/ed

Dec 4, 2003, 09:55 PM	Thread Starter #4
igor_levicki Intel Black Belt Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Belgrade, Serbia Posts: 128 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Thanks pxmt I thought it was possible since I can have separate effects in windows. __________________ Regards, Igor Levicki -- Creative Audigy 2 ZS Retail (SB0350) kX 3538h

Dec 5, 2003, 12:11 AM	#5
Daniel Drummond DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brazil Posts: 1,137 Rep Power: 0	No, this can't be done by KX drivers. __________________ www.palcomp3.com.br/ed

Dec 5, 2003, 10:50 AM	#7
Daniel Drummond DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brazil Posts: 1,137 Rep Power: 0	Pzmt, that's great! I'm certainly going to try it out... So there is a back door to it... Nice. I said this couldn't be done because this has been discussed many times and that was the answer. But I found the thread about enabling philips adc and I saw it's pretty new info around here. Thanks! __________________ www.palcomp3.com.br/ed

Dec 4, 2003, 11:02 AM	#3
pzmt DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 28 Rep Power: 0	It is posible to add independent efects to mic and line in (and independent recording too). There is some undocumented options to enable Philips ADC on Audigy 2. Mic will go throught AC97 ADC and line in throught Philips ADC. This is default way for example on Linux ALSA driver (1.0.0rc1) - you are able to listen line in + mic and independent record mic without line in. (Sorry, I don't use kxdrivers, but I am sure that this can by done with current kxdrivers, default creative drivers have independent mic and analog mix).

Dec 5, 2003, 08:08 AM	#6
pzmt DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 28 Rep Power: 0	Use kxctrl -sac97 0 0 to enable Philips ADC (kxctrl -sac97 0 9f1f to disable) choose ac97 recording source to Mic, set AC97 Recording Level for mic, set volume for line in (and unmute) . On input in 0, in 1 (AC97) will by mic and on input in10, in11 (AC97.2) will by line in. On in10, in11 will be mix from all analog sources - than if you want listen only line in mute cd and other analog sources (not for Audigy Drive). This should work from kxdrivers 5.00.3533 and is marked in ChangeLog as experimental. As I wrote I am not using kxdrivers, but I think, that this should work (I will try it, and send result on monday).

Dec 5, 2003, 11:46 AM	#8
pzmt DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 28 Rep Power: 0	Looks like you have Audigy 1. this should work on it too, but there is one problem: default is mix output from AC97 routed to front speaker, and Philips ADC is connected to this mix(this bypass DSP). Then you will hear line in from front speaker. This can by dissabled, but I don't know if kxdrivers supports this now. On Audigy 2 it should work OK.

Dec 5, 2003, 02:22 PM	#9
Nando Dominguez DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Spain Posts: 280 Rep Power: 0	Hi everyone. Can anyone tell me how to do it? Sorry, I'm not programmer so when I look into kXctrl it's very confused for me. Thanx Nando

Dec 5, 2003, 03:56 PM	#10
musicman DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Texas Posts: 23 Rep Power: 0	mic & line in would a person be able to record an AC97 mic, and a Line2/Mic2 on the Audigy Drive at the same time for two different track sources

Dec 7, 2003, 10:27 PM	#11
Daniel Drummond DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Brazil Posts: 1,137 Rep Power: 0	Musicman, yes, if you use KX ASIO that's easily accomplished. __________________ www.palcomp3.com.br/ed

Dec 7, 2003, 11:27 PM	#12
Eugene Gavrilov kX Project Lead Programmer and Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3,106 Rep Power: 73	well... concerning this Philips UDA it is really present on Audigy1 board, and there seems to be a special hardware 'bit' to enable/disable certain signal routings however, due to lack of any related documentation, it is currently impossible to check the details... especially since I currently don't have any live/audigy1(2) board with an AC-97 codec if you simply enable ac97 master volume (by using the "kxctrl -sac97 0 0" command), you may not always get what you really need anyway, =both= the ac97 input and philips UDA input are available as separate sources in the kX Mixer ('ac97' and 'ac97 2') you may also need to execute additional commands in order to achieve your goal... so, the question is: are there any special 'bits' -- and what are they -=-= audigy2 users may wish to play with the 0x80 bit of the HCFG register (kxctrl -gfn0 0x14 --- kxctrl -sfn0 0x14 {value AND/XOR 0x80 } ) --- NOTE do NOT program this register unless you really know what you are doing since this can damage your card / cause your PC to hang etc... /Eugene

Dec 8, 2003, 07:50 AM	#13
pzmt DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 28 Rep Power: 0	I have Audigy 1 (using ALSA under linux). Philips ADC is enabled by default. On audigy 1 was only problem route from AC97 output to front speakers, which is enabled by default (on Audigy 2 is dissabled - I think). On Audigy 1 this route can by dissabled by seting bit 0x80 in HCFG and setting master volume on AC97. On Audigy 2 is only needed setting master volume. I use Philips ADC as default input for 2-3 week. From feedback looks, like it is working well on Audigu 2 too.

Dec 9, 2003, 08:16 AM	#14
pzmt DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 28 Rep Power: 0	Hi, Last evening I tested kxdrivers version 3536. It works but setup is diffrent. I used Audigy 1. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Use at your own risk. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! For Audigy 1 only: use command line and execute kxctrl -gfn0 0x18 it prints some value - for me it was 0xe000 set 0x80 bit to this value newval = 0xe080 then run kxctrl -sfn0 0x18 newval for me it was kxctrl -sfn0 0x18 0xe080 this dissables route from ac97 to front speakers - it is needed only form Audigy 1 Then for Audigy 1 and Audigy2: run kxctlr -sac97 2 0 this sets master volume for ac97. Thats all. Then on ac97 page set recording source to mic, set record gain (better smaller, other there will be loopback - and bad sound) unmute line, set line in volume on volume page (I think it was second) unmute and set ac97 volume - you should hear mic from speakers unmute and set ac97.2 volume - you should hear line in mic is on prolog outputs 0, 1 line in is on prolog outputs 10, 11 Do not reset ac97. If yes then rerun kxctrl -sac97 2 0

Feb 5, 2004, 03:40 PM	#15
Caster DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 2 Rep Power: 0	Thanks, works like a charm! What's the best way to let this happen after each restart, just some .bat file in startup or another way to let KX remember those changes?

Feb 6, 2004, 12:29 AM	#16
Eugene Gavrilov kX Project Lead Programmer and Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3,106 Rep Power: 73	ac97 setting should be restored automatically as for 'hcfg' setting, you will need to use a 'bat' file or something like that... perhaps, I will add an option to disable ac97->front routing in the future [probably, to the 'ac97' page of the kxmixer] /E

Jan 3, 2005, 03:46 AM	Thread Starter #17
igor_levicki Intel Black Belt Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Belgrade, Serbia Posts: 128 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	@Eugene: What is the status of this feature in current drivers/next planned release? __________________ Regards, Igor Levicki -- Creative Audigy 2 ZS Retail (SB0350) kX 3538h

Jan 7, 2005, 04:07 AM	#19
Eugene Gavrilov kX Project Lead Programmer and Coordinator Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3,106 Rep Power: 73	>> there is an option in the ac97 page regarding this >> but i still use a batch file but does the option work? E.