I have often read & herd in more places than 1....

HawgsHead · Dec 9, 2006, 03:10 AM

that if U have a router you dont need virus protection or a firewall.Thats it's like 1 in a billion chance something can get into youre rig.True??

BlueMak · Dec 9, 2006, 03:19 AM

I can't see how that could be true.

Dark Lord · Dec 9, 2006, 03:52 AM

ive heard it before too. i think its because most routers have a built in firewall. i know mine does, its helped out quite abit.

HawgsHead · Dec 9, 2006, 06:09 AM

I dont know.Thats why i'm asking.Mabye someone can shed some light on this.

PangingJr · Dec 9, 2006, 06:55 AM

Router's firmware firewalls are often loosely called "hardware firewall"

a good software firewall is still recommended, regardless of your router setup and its firmware firewall or policies settings. that's if security is really your concern. however, you will need to find a good software firewall that work best in your software system by yourself.

read just a bit for more info on: Why you should always have a good software firewall on your PC.
http://www.routertech.org/pages.php?page=13

HawgsHead · Dec 9, 2006, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PangingJr

Router's firmware firewalls are often loosely called "hardware firewall"

a good software firewall is still recommended, regardless of your router setup and its firmware firewall or policies settings. that's if security is really your concern. however, you will need to find a good software firewall that work best in your software system by yourself.

read just a bit for more info on: Why you should always have a good software firewall on your PC.
http://www.routertech.org/pages.php?page=13

Oh yeah...I still run Zone Labs Security Suite.It has firewall,virus protection,anti-spyware,cache cleaner and some other stuff built in.I have been running it for 2 to 3 years now without a hitch.My 1st computer was a 386 Compaq notebook.I bought it new and paid a kings ransom for it.And I have only had 1 virus in all that time.I guess I'm just lucky.

Dyre Straits · Dec 9, 2006, 07:43 PM

I have a router, software firewall, and Virus Protection software running at all times. If you ever check the activity log, you'll know why it's important.

Judas · Dec 10, 2006, 12:43 AM

A router with a decent hardware firewall is by far the first course to take to protect you from all that garbage out there waiting to service. Although i don't or do (sticking neutral atm) to having antivirus included, that's more or less your choice. And highly suggest you have a router though, a decent one, and not a pos $40 dollar router either.

I still find www.xincom.com 's routers by far the best damn hardware fire walled and most reliable router out there today for a consumer end.

PangingJr · Dec 10, 2006, 03:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HawgsHead

Oh yeah...I still run Zone Labs Security Suite.It has firewall,virus protection,anti-spyware,cache cleaner and some other stuff built in.I have been running it for 2 to 3 years now without a hitch.My 1st computer was a 386 Compaq notebook.I bought it new and paid a kings ransom for it.And I have only had 1 virus in all that time.I guess I'm just lucky.

that sounds like you mean you won't need someone to shed some more light on this anymore?

Judas · Dec 10, 2006, 03:58 AM

lol.. yeah that sounds self explanatory

good catch panging

hawgs, you funny

PangingJr · Dec 10, 2006, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

lol.. yeah that sounds self explanatory

good catch panging

hawgs, you funny

lol, JD.
i think anyone can simply follow the messages given by Hawgs.
what i did is just that. lol.

Judas · Dec 10, 2006, 04:45 AM

yeah.. but i wasn't paying attention...

PangingJr · Dec 10, 2006, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

yeah.. but i wasn't paying attention...

ok, JD. let's me reply you... so you know why it's easy for me...
i don't think anyone (include you and me) will need to pay attention to every things that everyone says in any specific threads.
but i however do think i need to pay attention to the message (and ones before it, when it comes from the same person) that i am about to give a direct reply to it. i think you think and do the same.

swimtech · Dec 10, 2006, 08:02 AM

OK,
Basically, the router's hardware firewall protects against a bot or a person doing an explicit realtime attack of any sort on your computer from the 'outside world' because your computer's actual IP address is hidden, therefore protected, by the router. But, that's all it does - and pretty darn well (debatable, I know...).

Any picture or file that you bring onto your computer on purpose, including email and attachments, Flash applications run by a website you visit in a browser - like the gorgeous animated charts you see in the reviews here at DH, streamed video, the code for the browser page itself, etc., can contain embedded data that can pose a threat (those nasty folks!) - and is how most computers get "infected" anyway - even before hardware firewalls were widely used. Hardware firewalls do nothing to protect you from those things - which is why you need good real-time antivirus and antispyware applications.

I've yet to be infected too though, but I stick to visiting places that care enough to block stuff that might flow through them to hurt my 'puter (reputable, like DH...) and want me to come back, and I'm just lucky, um, covered by Providence, as well...

I did start running antivirus and spyware apps about two or three years ago too...

Judas · Dec 10, 2006, 08:09 AM

i still have yet to get a virus or have a problem.

Hardware fire walls stop intruders, but anything you choose to download could be infected allowing a gapping hole to be opened. But some really nice hardware routers have outbound firewalls as well, these suckers can be a bit of a pain and a saviour as well.

I don't run anti-virus, and i doubt i ever will. I haven't any need for it, i keep recent backups of the important files i need and NEED for sure in a safe place. IMO, i find that once you've been infected though, it's quite nasty to clean up, and i've cleaned up, and usually the computer never seems to run or work quite the same short of wiping and installing.

however i did run into something very odd awhile ago, apparently someone had managed to get a boot or bios overriding virus of some kind. That sucker was as near as hell to get rid of, short of just trying to flash the sucker away. Another story though

PangingJr · Dec 10, 2006, 02:32 PM

and how did your computer gets infected in the first place?

Antivirus software, or virus protection software, is exactly what its name implies, it's a software that we use to prevent a computer virus from infecting our computer.

H3X4D3C1M4L · Dec 10, 2006, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

i still have yet to get a virus or have a problem.

Hardware fire walls stop intruders, but anything you choose to download could be infected allowing a gapping hole to be opened.

My thoughts exactly.

If you mean router like those little boxes people buy at Best Buy to share their internet connection I wouldn't call those firewalls decent enough to be worthy of purging your regular software security suite(s).

I mean I run Zone Alarm for the program protection, but its anti spyware and anti virus is just crap.

I run Norton for its anti virus capabilities but the firewall on that is a joke.

I run AdAware and SpyBot S&D regularily but they don't do anything else.

So here I am running all these tools just to stay secure on that front.

Now if you want to talk routers.... a good router would be a dedicated PC running something like FreeBSD or NetBSD with a properly configured packet sniffer and firewall on that end

That'd be a good start, perhaps that and if you're not a gamer or just browse the internet and don't do much else a hardware firewall (dedicated solution) might be an option. These days though I don't think the hardware option is too widely used because A) People use those 'free' ones that come on the router and B) Machines are powerful enough to run some extra software so there's no need for a separate hardware packet sniffer

HawgsHead · Dec 10, 2006, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PangingJr

that sounds like you mean you won't need someone to shed some more light on this anymore?

It was just a question that I had in the back of my rather small mind for a while.I was just wondering if it was true.I take the protection down when running benchmarks and the like.And I know that when it's down,someone can get in.And I was wondering if the router offers any protection when it's down....see,theres a method too my madness.

Judas · Dec 11, 2006, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H3X4D3C1M4L

My thoughts exactly.

If you mean router like those little boxes people buy at Best Buy to share their internet connection I wouldn't call those firewalls decent enough to be worthy of purging your regular software security suite(s).

I mean I run Zone Alarm for the program protection, but its anti spyware and anti virus is just crap.

I run Norton for its anti virus capabilities but the firewall on that is a joke.

I run AdAware and SpyBot S&D regularily but they don't do anything else.

So here I am running all these tools just to stay secure on that front.

Now if you want to talk routers.... a good router would be a dedicated PC running something like FreeBSD or NetBSD with a properly configured packet sniffer and firewall on that end

That'd be a good start, perhaps that and if you're not a gamer or just browse the internet and don't do much else a hardware firewall (dedicated solution) might be an option. These days though I don't think the hardware option is too widely used because A) People use those 'free' ones that come on the router and B) Machines are powerful enough to run some extra software so there's no need for a separate hardware packet sniffer

most of those "routers" that are dirt cheap i've found to be the most simpistic routers that don't even have a firewall of any sort aside from being it's own router, and hiding your ip so that direct attacks aren't really possible.

Real Routers with any REAL type of hardware usually costs 80+ (before taxes). IT's nothing steller imo, but it's alot better then those routers that are more like hubs then anything.

the damn good ones i've found range from 200 and up. They've got a whole swack of firewall related features and options. Giving you the high end features anyone would want. Even preventing simplistic DOS attacks is nice.

Zelig · Dec 11, 2006, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H3X4D3C1M4L

Now if you want to talk routers.... a good router would be a dedicated PC running something like FreeBSD or NetBSD with a properly configured packet sniffer and firewall on that end

That'd be a good start, perhaps that and if you're not a gamer or just browse the internet and don't do much else a hardware firewall (dedicated solution) might be an option. These days though I don't think the hardware option is too widely used because A) People use those 'free' ones that come on the router and B) Machines are powerful enough to run some extra software so there's no need for a separate hardware packet sniffer

I use smoothwall on my fanless Pentium 1 rig, it works wonderfully.

H3X4D3C1M4L · Dec 11, 2006, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zelig

I use smoothwall on my fanless Pentium 1 rig, it works wonderfully.

See now that's a smarter move

Even running something like Server 2003, after you completely gut it and take out all the stuff that usually leaves holes in the armor, and then slap on Zone Alarm, add in a big disk to make it a NAS then hook it up to a switch, you'll find you have something that's much more useful than a router, especially if the old PC is just lying around

Dec 9, 2006, 03:10 AM	#1
HawgsHead Rest In Peace Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Danville Virginia.The United States of America"In the God of Abraham,Isaac and Jacob We Trust" Posts: 2,012 Rep Power: 0	I have often read & herd in more places than 1.... that if U have a router you dont need virus protection or a firewall.Thats it's like 1 in a billion chance something can get into youre rig.True?? __________________ Rig specs to the left in the boxes....X-Box 360 w/Hitachi 42" HDTV....If Darwins theory of evolution is true then why are monkeys still monkeys?It takes much more faith to believe in Darwin's theory over the Genesis account of creation.

Dec 9, 2006, 03:19 AM	#2
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,465 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	I can't see how that could be true. __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*

Dec 9, 2006, 03:52 AM	#3
Dark Lord HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Grand Rapids, MI Posts: 5,945 Rep Power: 125 System Specs	ive heard it before too. i think its because most routers have a built in firewall. i know mine does, its helped out quite abit. __________________

Dec 9, 2006, 06:09 AM	Thread Starter #4
HawgsHead Rest In Peace Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Danville Virginia.The United States of America"In the God of Abraham,Isaac and Jacob We Trust" Posts: 2,012 Rep Power: 0	I dont know.Thats why i'm asking.Mabye someone can shed some light on this. __________________ Rig specs to the left in the boxes....X-Box 360 w/Hitachi 42" HDTV....If Darwins theory of evolution is true then why are monkeys still monkeys?It takes much more faith to believe in Darwin's theory over the Genesis account of creation.

Dec 10, 2006, 08:02 AM	#14
swimtech HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 4,040 Rep Power: 124 System Specs	OK, Basically, the router's hardware firewall protects against a bot or a person doing an explicit realtime attack of any sort on your computer from the 'outside world' because your computer's actual IP address is hidden, therefore protected, by the router. But, that's all it does - and pretty darn well (debatable, I know...). Any picture or file that you bring onto your computer on purpose, including email and attachments, Flash applications run by a website you visit in a browser - like the gorgeous animated charts you see in the reviews here at DH, streamed video, the code for the browser page itself, etc., can contain embedded data that can pose a threat (those nasty folks!) - and is how most computers get "infected" anyway - even before hardware firewalls were widely used. Hardware firewalls do nothing to protect you from those things - which is why you need good real-time antivirus and antispyware applications. I've yet to be infected too though, but I stick to visiting places that care enough to block stuff that might flow through them to hurt my 'puter (reputable, like DH...) and want me to come back, and I'm just lucky, um, covered by Providence, as well... I did start running antivirus and spyware apps about two or three years ago too... __________________ It's not so much getting your way that matters or not - what matters is how you go about getting it.

Dec 9, 2006, 06:55 AM	#5
PangingJr Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 5,989 Rep Power: 71	Router's firmware firewalls are often loosely called "hardware firewall" a good software firewall is still recommended, regardless of your router setup and its firmware firewall or policies settings. that's if security is really your concern. however, you will need to find a good software firewall that work best in your software system by yourself. read just a bit for more info on: Why you should always have a good software firewall on your PC. http://www.routertech.org/pages.php?page=13

Dec 10, 2006, 02:32 PM	#16
PangingJr Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 5,989 Rep Power: 71	and how did your computer gets infected in the first place? Antivirus software, or virus protection software, is exactly what its name implies, it's a software that we use to prevent a computer virus from infecting our computer.