ROFLMFAO~~~ It could only happen to me....

digitalwanderer · Apr 7, 2003, 09:50 PM

So I'm just as pleased as punch with the new GF4 and am glad I got it rather than waiting for the 9500 Pro to go sub-$150us...until I see a 9500 Pro for sale on nVnews for $140 today.

Then I notice the "for sale $140, or trade for GF4 ti4200 or better"...and I got better.

The long/short can be found here, but I might not be ATIless very long.

digitalwanderer · Apr 7, 2003, 09:53 PM

Never mind, it's a 9500 non-Pro ("but it OC up to 9500 Pro speeds!",

) The search continues...

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 7, 2003, 10:07 PM

Umm... don't you have a Gainward GF4 Ti 4400 just like me? If so, why would you want to exchange it for a card with worse performance?

~~craig588~~ · Apr 7, 2003, 10:35 PM

Um, with AA/AF the r9500pro is faster than even a ti4600.

digitalwanderer · Apr 7, 2003, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by craig588
Um, with AA/AF the r9500pro is faster than even a ti4600.

Yeah, what he said....but I don't think a 9500 non-Pro is.

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 7, 2003, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by craig588
Um, with AA/AF the r9500pro is faster than even a ti4600.

That's not generally correct. With 2xAA, it's no bit faster than a Ti 4400. Only with 4xAA and 8xAni, it's somewhat faster. But these modes can only be used with old games like Quake III where you have *lots* of excessive fps which you can sacrifice! With current games like Comanche 4, even with a fast CPU you'll only have framerates in the 40s! If you would try to activate 4xAA and 8xAni there, you'd quickly get slideshow speeds

So if you play current games, what you need is raw performance! If you only play old games, then you'll want a card that has a good AA speed, even if it has less raw performance. So it's up to you to decide - if you want to play current games, you need a card with optimal raw perfomance. If you don't like current games and prefer old games, you'll need optimal AA performance.

~~craig588~~ · Apr 7, 2003, 11:28 PM

You want good AA performace so you can turn it on with little FPS hit. Say your running unreal 2 at 60 FPS with the gf4, when you enable AA it will drop signifigantly to like 30-40 FPS, but with the r9500pro you would get like 55 FPS and when you turn on AA you only recieve a drop to 50FPS. (I just made up these numbers, but that is how the FPS would scale sort of)

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 8, 2003, 01:08 AM

Originally posted by craig588
You want good AA performace so you can turn it on with little FPS hit. Say your running unreal 2 at 60 FPS with the gf4, when you enable AA it will drop signifigantly to like 30-40 FPS, but with the r9500pro you would get like 55 FPS and when you turn on AA you only recieve a drop to 50FPS. (I just made up these numbers, but that is how the FPS would scale sort of)

Nope, that's abolutely wrong. It can still handle 2xAA very nicely

Just compare the following to my sig:

As you see, the lead of the Ti 4800SE becomes less, but it doesn't get behind.

Just found these benchmarks - even with 4xAA, it doesn't lose that much fps, much less than other GF4 cards!

Look at these Comanche4 benchmarks - it only uses around 4 fps with 4xAA, that really isn't much, or ist it?

The Albatron clearly loses more here.
Show me where the Radeon 9500 Pro loses less than 4 fps here - much less, actually, because it also starts out with less.

~~craig588~~ · Apr 8, 2003, 01:32 AM

Show me a comparison not done in 3dmark, nvidias drivers drivers are optimized for 3dmark. I'm acctually getting a gf4 soon, so I'll be able to test it myself agenst a r9700pro, a r9500 and a r9500pro

JCLW · Apr 8, 2003, 01:34 AM

Digi,

Just out of curiousity, what are the prices there for the 9500pro and the Gainward 4400? The 9500pro is about CDN$80 cheaper then the Gainward 4400 up here.

- JW

digitalwanderer · Apr 8, 2003, 01:41 AM

The best price I saw on pricewatch for the same GF4 was about $189 shipped...which I could probably find a 9500 Pro for too. I'm sort of glad the deal fell thru, I sort of like this card and am thinking this is a sign that I should keep it. (That and it's phenom OCing with just a fan on an improvised bracket, or how damned nice quincux AA looks in everything. Yes, you heard me right...quincux looks damned fine to me on this card, it's entirely different than the GF3.

)

Vampyromaniac · Apr 8, 2003, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Asuka
That's not generally correct. With 2xAA, it's no bit faster than a Ti 4400. Only with 4xAA and 8xAni, it's somewhat faster. But these modes can only be used with old games like Quake III where you have *lots* of excessive fps which you can sacrifice! With current games like Comanche 4, even with a fast CPU you'll only have framerates in the 40s! If you would try to activate 4xAA and 8xAni there, you'd quickly get slideshow speeds

This is from AnandTech, btw

While I understand you are happy with your video card purchase,
you don't need to make it sound superior in front of other people to enjoy it, do you?

Anyway . . . dig', keep your eyes peeled, and you just may luck out like your freind, before!

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 8, 2003, 05:20 PM

Originally posted by JCLW
Digi,
Just out of curiousity, what are the prices there for the 9500pro and the Gainward 4400? The 9500pro is about CDN$80 cheaper then the Gainward 4400 up here.
- JW

You should rather look for the 4800SE (that's a 4400 with 8xAGP). Strangely enough, the older 4400 (without 8xAGP) is more expensive, even though they're exactly the same except for AGP speeds

At least over here, the Gainward Ti 4800SE is a lot cheaper than the 9500 Pro. I got mine for 165â‚¬ (US$182) in a nearby shop even, whereas the Radeon 9500 Pro is only listed by single retailers from time to time, for prices of at least 225â‚¬ (US$248), and then there's still 10â‚¬(US$11) for shipping

Besides that, Gainward is also offering a cheaper 64MB version w/ Ti 4800SE, so if you don't need AA at really high resolution, you can save a good bit of money (40â‚¬/US$44 over here). I've seen a review yesterday were the compared 128MB with 64MB cards, and the results were pretty much the same. Only in a few cases, the 128MB ones had a tiny lead of 3 fps.

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 8, 2003, 05:40 PM

Originally posted by digitalwanderer
The best price I saw on pricewatch for the same GF4 was about $189 shipped...which I could probably find a 9500 Pro for too. I'm sort of glad the deal fell thru, I sort of like this card and am thinking this is a sign that I should keep it.

As I said before - got mine for $182. A 9500 Pro would've been significantly more expensive (at least $248) - in case I should really be able to find a retailer who has it and not only make false promises

(That and it's phenom OCing with just a fan on an improvised bracket,

Same here

I can OC it quite a lot without getting any artifacts

If I think back to my Radeon 8500 - it wouldn't OC at all

Even worse, sometimes I'd already get ertifacts at stock clock speeds

or how damned nice quincux AA looks in everything. Yes, you heard me right...quincux looks damned fine to me on this card, it's entirely different than the GF3. )

Yes, gotta love that Quincunx

They apparently completely overworked it since GF3 times, absolutely no comparison.

digitalwanderer · Apr 8, 2003, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Asuka
[B]Originally posted by digitalwanderer
Yes, gotta love that Quincunx They apparently completely overworked it since GF3 times, absolutely no comparison.

BIG TIME! I used to think peeps were nuts who raved about Quincux, now I GET IT!

I just finished pulling off me heatsink/planing/re-attaching/splicing the fan so it don't leach my new babie's power and am getting ready to see how it does...I LOVE this part!

eyeguy616 · Apr 8, 2003, 07:56 PM

shtik/
You know, here has some good prices for video cards among other things. They have an ATI 9500 Pro 128megs for $170 while a non-pro 64megs is $135 new. nVidia's card prices are just as good - GeForce4 Ti4800 SE AGP 8X 128MB for $160 or GeForce4 Ti 4200 AGP 8X 64MB for $117! I bought my 9000 Pro from them last year ($86) and have since bought a 2x dvd-rw drive ($200) and a 50pc cakebox of 2x dvd-r's ($40)! Surperb online store!
/shtik
Now that the shtik is done, have fun with your card, dig.

~eyeguy616

JCLW · Apr 8, 2003, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Asuka
Originally posted by JCLW
You should rather look for the 4800SE (that's a 4400 with 8xAGP). Strangely enough, the older 4400 (without 8xAGP) is more expensive, even though they're exactly the same except for AGP speeds
At least over here, the Gainward Ti 4800SE is a lot cheaper than the 9500 Pro. I got mine for 165â‚¬ (US$182) in a nearby shop even, whereas the Radeon 9500 Pro is only listed by single retailers from time to time, for prices of at least 225â‚¬ (US$248), and then there's still 10â‚¬(US$11) for shipping
Besides that, Gainward is also offering a cheaper 64MB version w/ Ti 4800SE, so if you don't need AA at really high resolution, you can save a good bit of money (40â‚¬/US$44 over here). I've seen a review yesterday were the compared 128MB with 64MB cards, and the results were pretty much the same. Only in a few cases, the 128MB ones had a tiny lead of 3 fps.

But I live in the land of ATI, where 9500pro cards can be found for ~US$170.

And with similar prices I'd take the 9500pro over a GF4.

http://www.canadacomputers.com/video.html

- JW

digitalwanderer · Apr 8, 2003, 08:49 PM

For $100, I am NOT bichting and am hanging on to this card! After the very slight modding it's doing 302/702 without any artifacts, I think connecting the fan to it's own power was the biggest help.

Pictures, for the curious.

JCLW · Apr 8, 2003, 09:42 PM

What is the stock clock?

- JW

digitalwanderer · Apr 8, 2003, 09:44 PM

Uhm...lemme check. 275/550 stock, guaranteed to 280/580 since it's a GS. 302/702 don't suck.

Zardon · Apr 8, 2003, 10:13 PM

I thought you would have snapped that 9500 non pro up digital, seeing as you can mod it to a 9700 pretty easy, generally.

digitalwanderer · Apr 8, 2003, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zardon
I thought you would have snapped that 9500 non pro up digital, seeing as you can mod it to a 9700 pretty easy, generally.

The guy had tried to mod it and got checkerboards so I knew it wasn't modable....I'm sort of glad I didn't, I see some serious potential for fun in this card.

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 8, 2003, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by digitalwanderer
For $100, I am NOT bichting and am hanging on to this card! After the very slight modding it's doing 302/702 without any artifacts, I think connecting the fan to it's own power was the biggest help.

I've seen some sites getting 315/720 out of this card, even without any modding

Pictures, for the curious.

<Babs PC> OMG! It's so pink and furry and hearty...

I can hear the poor thing screaming "Please shoot me!" all the way over here!

JCLW · Apr 8, 2003, 10:39 PM

700 on the memory is crazy. What kind of memory chips? 3.3 BGA?

- JW

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 8, 2003, 10:43 PM

Originally posted by digitalwanderer
The guy had tried to mod it and got checkerboards so I knew it wasn't modable....I'm sort of glad I didn't, I see some serious potential for fun in this card.

As I wrote already in another thread, this modding is utter nonsense and destined to fail from the very start, since they'll most definitely won't sell cards with 8 working pipelines as cheaper 9500 non-Pro when they could sell it as 9500 Pro - so you will get always more or less graphics errors like checkerboards, spontaneous crashes and whatnot when you try to mod it

JCLW · Apr 9, 2003, 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Asuka
Originally posted by digitalwanderer

As I wrote already in another thread, this modding is utter nonsense and destined to fail from the very start, since they'll most definitely won't sell cards with 8 working pipelines as cheaper 9500 non-Pro when they could sell it as 9500 Pro - so you will get always more or less graphics errors like checkerboards, spontaneous crashes and whatnot when you try to mod it

http://firingsquad.gamers.com/guides...ests/page2.asp

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 9, 2003, 01:07 AM

Originally posted by JCLW
http://firingsquad.gamers.com/guides...ests/page2.asp

"Celeron Overclocking Tests" - what has that got to do with anything?

JCLW · Apr 9, 2003, 01:10 AM

It was a quick example of speed binning, which is what ATI does with the R300 core and explains why 9500s can be made into 9700 class cards.

Quote:

What speed is that chip?
Speed binning seems to be a pretty common technique among processor and graphics chip manufacturers. Basically, all Celeron and TNT2 chips are the same, but some chips run faster than others. Manufacturers test chips, and throw them into different speed "bins" depending on how fast they run. That's why there are fewer Ultra TNT2 chips than normal TNT2 chips. All the normal 125MHz chips are the ones that couldn't cut it at 150MHzâ€¦ is that really the case?
What happens if yields improve and almost all the TNT2 chips are capable of reaching Ultra speeds, but there isn't enough demand for all the Ultra chips? Simple, you just sell the excess Ultra tested chips as normal TNT2s.

~~Asuka~~ · Apr 9, 2003, 01:40 AM

Originally posted by JCLW
It was a quick example of speed binning, which is what ATI does with the R300 core and explains why 9500s can be made into 9700 class cards.

Nope. While you might be able to overclock them to 9700 speeds (although I'd doubt even that - my old R8500 had no OC ability at all

), you will not be able to fix the broken pipelines, and also, the 9500 is 128bit and not 256bit like the 9700(non-Pro and Pro), so making a 9500 non-Pro into a 9700 is definitely impossible.
Concerning the demand: there's a HUGE demand for 9500 Pro chips (so much that they have problems satisfying it), but only a much lesser demand for 9500 non-Pro chips. They'd be incredibly stupid if they would go now and sell 9500 Pro chips as 9500 non-Pro chips, just because the demand for 9500 Pro chips is a great deal bigger than for 9500 non-Pro chips, and they would also earn much less from that. Doing such a thing would only be a desperate last resort if no one would want 9500 Pro chips, but lots of people would want 9500 non-Pro chips - but in reality, practically the opposite is the case.

JCLW · Apr 9, 2003, 03:50 AM

http://duhvoodooman.com/9500mod/9500mod_1.htm
http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...00-dx9-p1.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/d.../news6115.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/d.../news6109.html
http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showth...hreadid=154428

The 9500, 9500pro, 9700, and 9700pro all use the same core - the R300.
There are two reference ATI PCBs for the R300 - a 128bit memory bus version and a 256bit memory bus version.

Early 9500s were built on the 256bit PCB (because ATI finalized it before the 128bit version) so if you are lucky enough to get a 9500 with eight working pipelines that was built on a 256bit PCB, then you can enable the extra four pipelines and the full 256bit memory bus.

My 8500LE (250/250 stock) does 315/310 without any kind of voltmods or extra cooling, and there are thousands of people who have sucessfully enabled all eight pipelines on their regular 9500 cards.

As we're kind of threadjacking I will say no more on the matter.

Apr 7, 2003, 09:50 PM	#1
digitalwanderer Colour Commentator Join Date: May 2002 Location: Highland, IN USA Posts: 5,619 Rep Power: 0	ROFLMFAO~~~ It could only happen to me.... So I'm just as pleased as punch with the new GF4 and am glad I got it rather than waiting for the 9500 Pro to go sub-$150us...until I see a 9500 Pro for sale on nVnews for $140 today. Then I notice the "for sale $140, or trade for GF4 ti4200 or better"...and I got better. The long/short can be found here, but I might not be ATIless very long. __________________ WTF is up with the sigs?

Apr 7, 2003, 09:53 PM	Thread Starter #2
digitalwanderer Colour Commentator Join Date: May 2002 Location: Highland, IN USA Posts: 5,619 Rep Power: 0	Damn it. Never mind, it's a 9500 non-Pro ("but it OC up to 9500 Pro speeds!", ) The search continues... __________________ WTF is up with the sigs?

Apr 8, 2003, 01:41 AM	Thread Starter #11
digitalwanderer Colour Commentator Join Date: May 2002 Location: Highland, IN USA Posts: 5,619 Rep Power: 0	Uhm, well... The best price I saw on pricewatch for the same GF4 was about $189 shipped...which I could probably find a 9500 Pro for too. I'm sort of glad the deal fell thru, I sort of like this card and am thinking this is a sign that I should keep it. (That and it's phenom OCing with just a fan on an improvised bracket, or how damned nice quincux AA looks in everything. Yes, you heard me right...quincux looks damned fine to me on this card, it's entirely different than the GF3. ) __________________ WTF is up with the sigs?

Apr 8, 2003, 05:40 PM	#14
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Re: Uhm, well... Originally posted by digitalwanderer The best price I saw on pricewatch for the same GF4 was about $189 shipped...which I could probably find a 9500 Pro for too. I'm sort of glad the deal fell thru, I sort of like this card and am thinking this is a sign that I should keep it. As I said before - got mine for $182. A 9500 Pro would've been significantly more expensive (at least $248) - in case I should really be able to find a retailer who has it and not only make false promises (That and it's phenom OCing with just a fan on an improvised bracket, Same here I can OC it quite a lot without getting any artifacts If I think back to my Radeon 8500 - it wouldn't OC at all Even worse, sometimes I'd already get ertifacts at stock clock speeds or how damned nice quincux AA looks in everything. Yes, you heard me right...quincux looks damned fine to me on this card, it's entirely different than the GF3. ) Yes, gotta love that Quincunx They apparently completely overworked it since GF3 times, absolutely no comparison.

Apr 8, 2003, 08:49 PM	Thread Starter #18
digitalwanderer Colour Commentator Join Date: May 2002 Location: Highland, IN USA Posts: 5,619 Rep Power: 0	OMFG! 302/702! For $100, I am NOT bichting and am hanging on to this card! After the very slight modding it's doing 302/702 without any artifacts, I think connecting the fan to it's own power was the biggest help. Pictures, for the curious. __________________ WTF is up with the sigs?

Apr 7, 2003, 10:07 PM	#3
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Umm... don't you have a Gainward GF4 Ti 4400 just like me? If so, why would you want to exchange it for a card with worse performance?

Apr 7, 2003, 10:35 PM	#4
~~craig588~~ Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: In clothing Posts: 3,510 Rep Power: 0	Um, with AA/AF the r9500pro is faster than even a ti4600.

Apr 7, 2003, 10:53 PM	#6
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by craig588 Um, with AA/AF the r9500pro is faster than even a ti4600. That's not generally correct. With 2xAA, it's no bit faster than a Ti 4400. Only with 4xAA and 8xAni, it's somewhat faster. But these modes can only be used with old games like Quake III where you have lots of excessive fps which you can sacrifice! With current games like Comanche 4, even with a fast CPU you'll only have framerates in the 40s! If you would try to activate 4xAA and 8xAni there, you'd quickly get slideshow speeds So if you play current games, what you need is raw performance! If you only play old games, then you'll want a card that has a good AA speed, even if it has less raw performance. So it's up to you to decide - if you want to play current games, you need a card with optimal raw perfomance. If you don't like current games and prefer old games, you'll need optimal AA performance.

Apr 7, 2003, 11:28 PM	#7
~~craig588~~ Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: In clothing Posts: 3,510 Rep Power: 0	You want good AA performace so you can turn it on with little FPS hit. Say your running unreal 2 at 60 FPS with the gf4, when you enable AA it will drop signifigantly to like 30-40 FPS, but with the r9500pro you would get like 55 FPS and when you turn on AA you only recieve a drop to 50FPS. (I just made up these numbers, but that is how the FPS would scale sort of)

Apr 8, 2003, 01:08 AM	#8
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by craig588 You want good AA performace so you can turn it on with little FPS hit. Say your running unreal 2 at 60 FPS with the gf4, when you enable AA it will drop signifigantly to like 30-40 FPS, but with the r9500pro you would get like 55 FPS and when you turn on AA you only recieve a drop to 50FPS. (I just made up these numbers, but that is how the FPS would scale sort of) Nope, that's abolutely wrong. It can still handle 2xAA very nicely Just compare the following to my sig: As you see, the lead of the Ti 4800SE becomes less, but it doesn't get behind. Just found these benchmarks - even with 4xAA, it doesn't lose that much fps, much less than other GF4 cards! Look at these Comanche4 benchmarks - it only uses around 4 fps with 4xAA, that really isn't much, or ist it? The Albatron clearly loses more here. Show me where the Radeon 9500 Pro loses less than 4 fps here - much less, actually, because it also starts out with less.

Apr 8, 2003, 01:32 AM	#9
~~craig588~~ Banned Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: In clothing Posts: 3,510 Rep Power: 0	Show me a comparison not done in 3dmark, nvidias drivers drivers are optimized for 3dmark. I'm acctually getting a gf4 soon, so I'll be able to test it myself agenst a r9700pro, a r9500 and a r9500pro

Apr 8, 2003, 01:34 AM	#10
JCLW Long Live The P6! Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The Great White North Posts: 119 Rep Power: 0	Digi, Just out of curiousity, what are the prices there for the 9500pro and the Gainward 4400? The 9500pro is about CDN$80 cheaper then the Gainward 4400 up here. - JW

Apr 8, 2003, 05:20 PM	#13
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by JCLW Digi, Just out of curiousity, what are the prices there for the 9500pro and the Gainward 4400? The 9500pro is about CDN$80 cheaper then the Gainward 4400 up here. - JW You should rather look for the 4800SE (that's a 4400 with 8xAGP). Strangely enough, the older 4400 (without 8xAGP) is more expensive, even though they're exactly the same except for AGP speeds At least over here, the Gainward Ti 4800SE is a lot cheaper than the 9500 Pro. I got mine for 165â‚¬ (US$182) in a nearby shop even, whereas the Radeon 9500 Pro is only listed by single retailers from time to time, for prices of at least 225â‚¬ (US$248), and then there's still 10â‚¬(US$11) for shipping Besides that, Gainward is also offering a cheaper 64MB version w/ Ti 4800SE, so if you don't need AA at really high resolution, you can save a good bit of money (40â‚¬/US$44 over here). I've seen a review yesterday were the compared 128MB with 64MB cards, and the results were pretty much the same. Only in a few cases, the 128MB ones had a tiny lead of 3 fps.

Apr 8, 2003, 07:56 PM	#16
eyeguy616 ZZzzzzzzzzzz........... Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 324 Rep Power: 0	shtik/ You know, here has some good prices for video cards among other things. They have an ATI 9500 Pro 128megs for $170 while a non-pro 64megs is $135 new. nVidia's card prices are just as good - GeForce4 Ti4800 SE AGP 8X 128MB for $160 or GeForce4 Ti 4200 AGP 8X 64MB for $117! I bought my 9000 Pro from them last year ($86) and have since bought a 2x dvd-rw drive ($200) and a 50pc cakebox of 2x dvd-r's ($40)! Surperb online store! /shtik Now that the shtik is done, have fun with your card, dig. ~eyeguy616

Apr 8, 2003, 09:42 PM	#19
JCLW Long Live The P6! Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The Great White North Posts: 119 Rep Power: 0	What is the stock clock? - JW

Apr 8, 2003, 09:44 PM	Thread Starter #20
digitalwanderer Colour Commentator Join Date: May 2002 Location: Highland, IN USA Posts: 5,619 Rep Power: 0	Uhm...lemme check. 275/550 stock, guaranteed to 280/580 since it's a GS. 302/702 don't suck. __________________ WTF is up with the sigs?

Apr 8, 2003, 10:13 PM	#21
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	I thought you would have snapped that 9500 non pro up digital, seeing as you can mod it to a 9700 pretty easy, generally.

Apr 8, 2003, 10:34 PM	#23
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Re: OMFG! 302/702! Originally posted by digitalwanderer For $100, I am NOT bichting and am hanging on to this card! After the very slight modding it's doing 302/702 without any artifacts, I think connecting the fan to it's own power was the biggest help. I've seen some sites getting 315/720 out of this card, even without any modding Pictures, for the curious. <Babs PC> OMG! It's so pink and furry and hearty... I can hear the poor thing screaming "Please shoot me!" all the way over here!

Apr 8, 2003, 10:39 PM	#24
JCLW Long Live The P6! Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The Great White North Posts: 119 Rep Power: 0	700 on the memory is crazy. What kind of memory chips? 3.3 BGA? - JW

Apr 8, 2003, 10:43 PM	#25
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by digitalwanderer The guy had tried to mod it and got checkerboards so I knew it wasn't modable....I'm sort of glad I didn't, I see some serious potential for fun in this card. As I wrote already in another thread, this modding is utter nonsense and destined to fail from the very start, since they'll most definitely won't sell cards with 8 working pipelines as cheaper 9500 non-Pro when they could sell it as 9500 Pro - so you will get always more or less graphics errors like checkerboards, spontaneous crashes and whatnot when you try to mod it

Apr 9, 2003, 01:07 AM	#27
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by JCLW http://firingsquad.gamers.com/guides...ests/page2.asp "Celeron Overclocking Tests" - what has that got to do with anything?

Apr 9, 2003, 01:40 AM	#29
~~Asuka~~ BANNED Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Germany Posts: 579 Rep Power: 0	Originally posted by JCLW It was a quick example of speed binning, which is what ATI does with the R300 core and explains why 9500s can be made into 9700 class cards. Nope. While you might be able to overclock them to 9700 speeds (although I'd doubt even that - my old R8500 had no OC ability at all ), you will not be able to fix the broken pipelines, and also, the 9500 is 128bit and not 256bit like the 9700(non-Pro and Pro), so making a 9500 non-Pro into a 9700 is definitely impossible. Concerning the demand: there's a HUGE demand for 9500 Pro chips (so much that they have problems satisfying it), but only a much lesser demand for 9500 non-Pro chips. They'd be incredibly stupid if they would go now and sell 9500 Pro chips as 9500 non-Pro chips, just because the demand for 9500 Pro chips is a great deal bigger than for 9500 non-Pro chips, and they would also earn much less from that. Doing such a thing would only be a desperate last resort if no one would want 9500 Pro chips, but lots of people would want 9500 non-Pro chips - but in reality, practically the opposite is the case.

Apr 9, 2003, 03:50 AM	#30
JCLW Long Live The P6! Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: The Great White North Posts: 119 Rep Power: 0	http://duhvoodooman.com/9500mod/9500mod_1.htm http://www.digit-life.com/articles2/...00-dx9-p1.html http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/d.../news6115.html http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/video/d.../news6109.html http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/showth...hreadid=154428 The 9500, 9500pro, 9700, and 9700pro all use the same core - the R300. There are two reference ATI PCBs for the R300 - a 128bit memory bus version and a 256bit memory bus version. Early 9500s were built on the 256bit PCB (because ATI finalized it before the 128bit version) so if you are lucky enough to get a 9500 with eight working pipelines that was built on a 256bit PCB, then you can enable the extra four pipelines and the full 256bit memory bus. My 8500LE (250/250 stock) does 315/310 without any kind of voltmods or extra cooling, and there are thousands of people who have sucessfully enabled all eight pipelines on their regular 9500 cards. As we're kind of threadjacking I will say no more on the matter.