DJORedDragon

Ok I have been having problems with my computer randomly rebooting, it just freezes up and stutters then reboots, and I can't pin point the problem and I am completely stumped, so I want your guys advice before I waste money replacing parts that may be perfectly fine.List of stuff I have done to trouble shoot:

Memory: ok I have 4 sticks of Patriot memory, 2 sticks of 512 MB @ 2.5 CAS, and 2 sticks of 256 MB @ 3 CAS. I know this is a bad mixture, but I have the CAS clock set in bios to 3 and everything else to auto so It's not a conflict with memory. I ran Memtest86 overnight and it ran 24 times with 0 errors.

Processor: Ran Prime95 16 hours straight with no problems.

Video Card: I have a Sapphire Radeon X850XT, and I do not see anything wrong with it, no artifacts, lagging, or overheating perfectly fine.

Motherboard: I have an Asus A8R-MVP socket 939, I have RMAd my first board to Asus, and they sent me back a refurbished one (which is a good thing because the board has been looked over more than once) so it's not the board.

Power Supply: I have an Antec smart power 400 watt, and according to power supply calculators it is more than enough for my setup. And besides wouldn't a bad power supply simply shut off rather than restart?

Hard Drives: these are fairly new hard drives both SATA 3 GB/s both western digital 1 80 GB and 1 120 G, When I run check disk I get this:
C:\>chkdsk
The type of the file system is NTFS.

WARNING! F parameter not specified.
Running CHKDSK in read-only mode.

CHKDSK is verifying files (stage 1 of 3)...
File verification completed.
CHKDSK is verifying indexes (stage 2 of 3)...
Index verification completed.
CHKDSK is verifying security descriptors (stage 3 of 3)...
Security descriptor verification completed.
CHKDSK is verifying Usn Journal...
Usn Journal verification completed.
Correcting errors in the master file table's (MFT) BITMAP attribute.
CHKDSK discovered free space marked as allocated in the volume bitmap.
Windows found problems with the file system.
Run CHKDSK with the /F (fix) option to correct these.

78116030 KB total disk space.
5474628 KB in 31161 files.
10500 KB in 3018 indexes.
0 KB in bad sectors.
213410 KB in use by the system.
65536 KB occupied by the log file.
72417492 KB available on disk.

4096 bytes in each allocation unit.
19529007 total allocation units on disk.
18104373 allocation units available on disk.

C:\>fsutil dirty query C:
Volume - C: is NOT Dirty

But I don't think that is causing any problems as my other computer come back with the same error and has yet to have any problems.

Operating System Wise: I have unchecked automatically restart on hangs I dont get any type of blue screens when it restarts. It's not windows updates as I have it set to let me install them. I have checked the event log and cant find any problems at the time of restarts. It's not virus's or spyware as my computer is clean as a whistle. I have checked fro any conflicts with hardware and drivers cant find anything wrong there.

Heat: It is not a heat problem as my processor runs @ 37 C and vid card runs @ 43 C. I have 4 80 mm fans in my case one pulling air across the hard drives in the front, one in the side panel next to the vid card, and 2 in the back of the case as exhaust fans. I have a thermalright XP-90 with a 92 mm fan on the processor. Vid card has stock fan and power supply has 2 fans in it, so I guess you could say my case very well cooled.

Sorry for the long post but I wanted to cover all of the bases on what I have done to troubleshoot and pin point the problem and so far I cant, so maybe you guys can.

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kris23

it still could be your power supply 4oow is what i consider garbage if you are trying to run more than like a Radeon 9500 card and an athlon XP.

dont try to calculate watts with a PSU, use amps its alot better, the quality of the components is also an issue. antec usually makes decent PSUs but if its a multi-rail PSU that can be the problem there....... the rails in the PSU cap the power output to something like 18 amps or something depending on the PSU specs usually not enough.

ok i looked up the specs of the smartpower 400w and i really think you should get a new one..... its specs are absolutely pitiful....... two rails at 10 and 15 amps? thats sad, you may be choking your X850XT if it consumes as much as i think it is.......

get a more powerful single rail PSU MUCH MORE POWERFUL

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817163111
silverstone makes a good single rail PSU

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DJORedDragon

Wow that power supply is insanely expensive, keep it under $80 please. I fail to see how 400 watts is not enough power when I have computers with less wattage power supplys running higher end components than you mentioned. The video card says a power supply with 350 watts or greater is required, and 400 watts is just fine.
I have the following systems running just fine with their power supplys with no problems:

Dell Dimension 8300, with stock 250 watt power supply
P4 @ 2.6 GHz
1 GB of ram speread across 4 256MB sticks
Radeon X700 Pro AGP
1 120 GB SATA drive

Custom built for my brother:
Running on a 400 watt modular MadDog Multimedia powersupply for 2 years now with 0 prolbems
P4 @ 3.2 GHZ Prescott
1 GB 2 512 sticks
1 120 GB, 1 80 GB
Radeon X850 Pro AGP
Biostar Motherboard

Custombuilt for sister:
350 watt Rosewill power supply
Sempron 3000+ socket AM2
512 MB ram
Sapphire Radeon X1650
MSI motherboard
1 20 GB hard drive

so I fail to see how 400 watts is underpowered for my system when these other computers are running just fine with lower power supplys for the components they are powering.

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Dyre Straits

A 400W PSU would be 'sufficient' IF the 12V AMP rating was at least 20A or better. It's the AMPs you want to consider as much as the Wattage.

I have to echo what was said above, this PSU is not sufficient as the 12V A caps at 15A...not good at all.

Specifications here:

http://www.antec.com/specs/SP400_spe.html

When looking for a PSU for your system, don't get any Dual Rail, get a Single Rail with at least 28A on the 12V. Prices will vary.

Good luck!

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kris23

obviously this guy doesnt like to spend money on anything but the bare minimums........ the PSU is the LAST thing you want to skimp on though...... you can buy a crappy CPU, RAM, HDD and the system should still run.

get a crappy PSU and you can destroy everything with that choice you made......

QUALITY IS WHAT MATTERS

how else could a 650w Corsair PSU power 2 8800GTXs and a quadcore?

500w Rosewill
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817182009

on another note, you are one of the most stingy people i have ever seen on Driver Heaven

you can skimp on other hardware but dont ever skimp on the PSU, i had alot of people lose their shit because they wanted to get that 15 dollar piece of crap and save a few dollars...... well... they lost those few dollars and alot more...... the PSUs pumped far more volts than it could handle and killed everything

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DJORedDragon

Ok thanks Dyre I will look into a new power supply soon but that will have to wait a while as I don't have any money at the moment (just bought a house extremely tight on money right now) So I'll have to put up with it randomly rebooting once or twice a week until I can order a decent one.

"obviously this guy doesnt like to spend money on anything but the bare minimums........ the PSU is the LAST thing you want to skimp on though...... you can buy a crappy CPU, RAM, HDD and the system should still run."

No I dont like to spend money on something that works just fine I grew up living by " If it ain't broke don't fix it" And I asked around and everyone told me to go with Antec for their quality.


That Rosewill looks nice I may get that one, how does this one look? 20 AMPs on both of the 12 v rails http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817101021


" on another note, you are one of the most stingy people i have ever seen on Driver Heaven"

thanks for letting me feel welcome here

Edit: found someone having the exact same problem as me http://forums.overclockersclub.com/i...howtopic=71573
Wow I trusted those who told me to go with Antec, but I will do my homework from now on.I do have a Ultra V series 350 watt backup power supply I got a @ microcenter for $5 with 18 Amps on the 12 v rail but I dont think that will be any better. Thanks for helping me pin point the problem.

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kris23

im sorry for being so harsh but there is an amont of people who just dont get a point until they are hit with it on the head........


I mean i honestly dont feel 130 dollars for a PSU isnt THAT expensive expecially since you have an X850XT on that machine.......

i mean isnt that card like $250+? i know you dont want to risk it getting shot by something easily avoided like a PSU...... i looked at all your PSU choices in all your builds and they are the most limiting ones i seen..... i remember skimping on a few things in my rig a while back......

i regretted it, not only did i waste money in the long run, it forced me down instead of letting me make the choices i wanted and ended up wasting even MORE money....... still slap myself because of it.....


i mean seriously, every other part in your system is high end, GPU,CPU,MOBO RAM could have been a bit better.......... but 1.5 is good still..... i know that at the time those components were very expensive as far as i remember

a low powered PSU if ran at 100% all day long has the possibility of killing everything its connected to by overheating and malfunctioning, i hope you understand that...... like i said im trying to help you make a choice but you are a little too limiting

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DJORedDragon

Understood. I paid $520 total for this computer 1 year ago, Processor, Case, motherboard, power supply and video card everything else I transfered over from my other computer(Ram DVD drive, and hard drives). I paid $154 for the card. I want to spend as little as needed on a good power supply.

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kris23

wow you got good deals for the parts but an AGP board probably wasnt the best choice at the time but it still has its uses at least.......

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Dyre Straits

You're welcome.

Now, again, unless you have a mobo and video cards that support Crossfire there's no reason to be looking at Dual Rail PSUs. In fact, there have been known problems with some Dual Rail PSUs. (When "dual rail" is used, it normally refers to there being 2 +12V rails on the PSU.)

Look for a good quality single +12V PSU with anything over 20A....28A preferably.

RE: The ULTRA you already have, you won't be losing anything giving it try.

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DJORedDragon

Tried the Ultra power supply, it sucks lol tried to play Americas Army, within 30 mins of playing my computer just turned off, so this power supply cant handle my rig. So I'm back with the antec.

Can't believe you guys didnt notice my board is a crossfire board with 2 PCI express Slots. It's just like your's Dyre except mine runs 2 Vid cards @ 8x and yours runs 2 vid cards @ 16x when in crossifre mode, which is why your's is the A8R32(16x for each card)-MVP "Deluxe"

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Dyre Straits

Not so much that it wasn't noticed, it's more to the point of whether you are going to use two video cards or not. If you don't plan to use two video cards, it's kind of silly to get a dual rail PSU. If you do get one -- dual rail, that is -- it better have sufficient A's on each one.

RE: The ULTRA -- Well, at least you tried.

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kris23

lol i didnt notice thats for sure, thought it was AGP like all the others you built

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kris23

you really dont need dual rail at all if its powerful enough, if it breaks 50A, you are pretty much set. the rest is up to the cable layout of the PSU. juice needs to flow

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DJORedDragon

Doh! Just checked my brothers computer power supply, and he has 1 12v rail @ 28 Amps thats whay his computer is stable. And my sisters cheap Rosewill power supply has a 20 Amp rail. As for the Dell it's over 4 years old long before dual 12 v rails came along so I'm assuming it's a single 12v rail with decent amps. Now I understand why amps are more important for stability, hey live and learn

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DJORedDragon

Ok kris I ordered the Rosewill that you posted based on the reviews it's a very good PSU, should be here by the end of the week. Will let you know if it solves my rebooting problems after I let it run a few weeks. Thank you

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Dyre Straits

Good luck! We're keeping our fingers crossed for you.

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H3X4D3C1M4L

Then be prepared to be back here complaining about your system being unstable or just not working in general.

kris23

i am praying that your computer survives....... lets hope the extra amps was what you needed.

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kris23

lol like i said, dont skimp on the power supply you should spend the most on that item....

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H3X4D3C1M4L

Its not even that you need to spend alot. The kind of cheap attitude displayed here just won't get you anywhere. What good is spending money on something that just won't work that well and will frustrate you?

To me money is well spent if you're going to enjoy it and not agonize over spending $x more than you wanted to.

DJORedDragon

Update!!!, well I've had to Rosewill installed for about 2 weeks now and all of the random reboots have disappeared, also I've noticed a 5-10% FPS increase with more power for my vid card. So never again will I buy a Antec PSU, I opened it up and there they were staring me in the face the infamous fuhjyyu caps all over the PSU.

But I am a little concerned, I am monitoring my motherboard with the Asus PC Probe software and and the 12 volt rail fluctuates from 11.79-11.86-11.92 volts, it mostly stays @ 11.86 V. Also the other voltages will fluctuate .01 volts up and down. Don't know if thats good or bad, could be the software too.

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kris23

doesnt seem all that bad.... but fluctuations in general arent that good for stability...... just monitor everything closely, .01 volt fluctuations are normal from what i see so if thats where it mostly is then it should be just fine.....

be sure to keep the boxes around until the warranty period is up.

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Dyre Straits

I think those fluctuations are all well within the limits.

Also, if you're monitoring with software, that's the least dependable mode of monitoring. It's best to do it with a DMM -- if you know how to do it.

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