Should I Crossfire Or Dump ATI/AMD?

topbob · Sep 20, 2007, 07:26 PM

Yes, the time has already come again, for a badly needed upgrade to be done on my PC. I just bought my mobo and video card about 6 months or so ago, right when Shivering Isles came out, which runs nicely at decent settings mind you. Two new games that I want to be able to play at max settings, Team Fortress 2 and Fortress Forever, do not run very nicely on it however. I'm trying to determine what would be the best way to go about upgrading. I know I'm due for a new CPU and RAM upgrade, but I want my current mobo+RAM to last awhile longer. Heres the question.
Do I go for another x1950 card (for about $160 USD) (Crossfire them), and a new AMD X2 4200 (for around $80 USD), and keep my current mobo and RAM, and if I do this, how much of a performance increase do you imagine I am looking at?
Or is the performance increase not worth it, and just hold out, save up some more cash, and make the switch to Intel/nVidia? (I'm very disappointed with my x1950's performance)
Thanks for any advice you can give.

ChaosMinionX · Sep 20, 2007, 07:34 PM

What would you be upgrading to if you did not get another x1950pro? And not to mention its the lowest model you can get of the R580+ so I hope you didnt expect to max out graphics on games.

Judas · Sep 20, 2007, 07:36 PM

you think a 1.5 times FPS improvement might do? (if that?).... i'm very unhappy still with windows XP crossfire performance and reliability.

Ferret_Style · Sep 20, 2007, 10:35 PM

Honestly i think your weakest link is your CPU versus your video card. The X1950 should do fine on most games unless they are DX10 then you would want a newer card. The only catch i have seen of video cards is that the DX9 cards in alot of cases out perform the X10 cards on DX9 application unless you go for the top of the line ($300+). Going Dual Core is going to help you out more then anything with ATI and Nvidia using dual core optimization for the drivers now.

topbob · Sep 20, 2007, 11:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChaosMinionX

What would you be upgrading to if you did not get another x1950pro? And not to mention its the lowest model you can get of the R580+ so I hope you didnt expect to max out graphics on games.

If I didn't get another x1950 I would want to save up and get a high end nVidia 8800.
I didn't expect to max out graphics, but I expected a large performance increase from my AGP x800 Pro, which was apparent, but nothing amazing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

you think a 1.5 times FPS improvement might do? (if that?).... i'm very unhappy still with windows XP crossfire performance and reliability.

Yea thats not ganna be enough, I'm already looking at less then 30 fps in TF2, average.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferret_Style

Honestly i think your weakest link is your CPU versus your video card. The X1950 should do fine on most games unless they are DX10 then you would want a newer card. The only catch i have seen of video cards is that the DX9 cards in alot of cases out perform the X10 cards on DX9 application unless you go for the top of the line ($300+). Going Dual Core is going to help you out more then anything with ATI and Nvidia using dual core optimization for the drivers now.

I knew my CPU was pretty out of date, but I wasn't sure how much it was slowing me down. I'm not worried with DX10 right now, as every thing I plan on playing for the next couple years is DX9.
Ok thanks guys,
The only other thing I have to decide is to try and find a X2 4800+ (Socket 939) which AMD stopped producing, so they run at least $200, or just a X2 4200+ 939 which are $80. I'll probably end up getting the 4200+, it seems madness to spend so much more on a 600+ increase.

Matth · Sep 21, 2007, 05:58 PM

The X2 4800+ appears to be 2.4 GHz with 2x 1MB caches

Newegg.com - AMD Opteron 180 Denmark 2.4GHz 2 x 1MB L2 Cache Socket 939 Dual Core Processor - Retail - apparently the same spec, but cheaper & easier to find ??

Dyre Straits · Sep 21, 2007, 09:10 PM

The system in my profile at left works great with my X1950 Pro. I've played over 600 hours of Oblivion at 1280x1024, ultra settings.

So, I'm of the conclusion that it's your CPU holding you back, too. If you can get that X2 4800+ you should see a decent performance boost.

Also, check your RAM timings in BIOS. I found that my BIOS was defaulting the RAM to 200 MHz when it's made to run at 250 MHz. If you're just using AUTO settings, that could also be another bottleneck.

ChaosMinionX · Sep 22, 2007, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matth

The X2 4800+ appears to be 2.4 GHz with 2x 1MB caches

Newegg.com - AMD Opteron 180 Denmark 2.4GHz 2 x 1MB L2 Cache Socket 939 Dual Core Processor - Retail - apparently the same spec, but cheaper & easier to find ??

For that price your better off going Intel Core2, but if you dont have the cash for DDR2, new mobo and chip that is probably your best bet.

procupine14 · Sep 22, 2007, 03:31 PM

despite it all.....i have been sticking with the middle lol......AMD processor and Nvidia GFX

topbob · Sep 22, 2007, 07:09 PM

My mobo says it only supports X2 dual core CPU's, thats why I haven't considered a Opteron, even though it is socket 939. Did Asus just not say it supported it due to Opteron being a newer CPU, or does it really not support it you think?
And thanks Dyre, I'm ganna check my RAM timings and I'm pretty sure its on auto right now.
Asus's site for my mobo

Dyre Straits · Sep 22, 2007, 08:41 PM

I tried finding anything about support for Opteron CPUs on the AsusTek site and came up empty. But, if it's 939 configuration, it would stand to reason that it would work. Strange?

Judas · Sep 23, 2007, 08:16 AM

As far as i know, i haven't heard of anyone with a 939 opteron running into issues on 939 socket boards......

Necrosis · Sep 23, 2007, 09:37 AM

Ditto

Matth · Sep 23, 2007, 04:31 PM

A8R-MVP... http://support.asus.com/cpusupport/c...Language=en-us

According to that, the Opteron Dualcore 180 & 185 are supported by ALL PCB with BIOS from 0503 - so if planning on an opteron dual, you need BIOS 0503 (final) or 0602 (beta)

topbob · Sep 23, 2007, 09:48 PM

Thanks a lot guys, really helped me out.
I think I'll go for the 170 or 175 Opteron, after I make sure I have the correct BIOS.
edit: and yes, I have the 0602 build.
edit2: decided to go with the 180 Opteron

Sep 20, 2007, 07:26 PM	#1
topbob HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: SFBA, CA, USA Posts: 463 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Should I Crossfire Or Dump ATI/AMD? Yes, the time has already come again, for a badly needed upgrade to be done on my PC. I just bought my mobo and video card about 6 months or so ago, right when Shivering Isles came out, which runs nicely at decent settings mind you. Two new games that I want to be able to play at max settings, Team Fortress 2 and Fortress Forever, do not run very nicely on it however. I'm trying to determine what would be the best way to go about upgrading. I know I'm due for a new CPU and RAM upgrade, but I want my current mobo+RAM to last awhile longer. Heres the question. Do I go for another x1950 card (for about $160 USD) (Crossfire them), and a new AMD X2 4200 (for around $80 USD), and keep my current mobo and RAM, and if I do this, how much of a performance increase do you imagine I am looking at? Or is the performance increase not worth it, and just hold out, save up some more cash, and make the switch to Intel/nVidia? (I'm very disappointed with my x1950's performance) Thanks for any advice you can give. __________________ 12090 in 3DMarks06 on current system, 5001 on old system, 4164 on older, 1587 on oldest

Sep 20, 2007, 07:34 PM	#2
ChaosMinionX USB 3 dot oh Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 1,911 Rep Power: 47 System Specs	What would you be upgrading to if you did not get another x1950pro? And not to mention its the lowest model you can get of the R580+ so I hope you didnt expect to max out graphics on games. __________________ ::Heatware:: How you can help DriverHeaven by using Digg!

Sep 21, 2007, 05:58 PM	#6
Matth Flash Banner Hater Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: UK Posts: 3,426 Rep Power: 93 System Specs	The X2 4800+ appears to be 2.4 GHz with 2x 1MB caches Newegg.com - AMD Opteron 180 Denmark 2.4GHz 2 x 1MB L2 Cache Socket 939 Dual Core Processor - Retail - apparently the same spec, but cheaper & easier to find ?? __________________ Mary had a little lamb, Her father shot it dead Now Mary takes her lamb to school, Between two crusts of bread

Sep 22, 2007, 03:31 PM	#9
procupine14 Why is it Beeping!?!?! Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA, Missouri Posts: 1,400 Rep Power: 58 System Specs	despite it all.....i have been sticking with the middle lol......AMD processor and Nvidia GFX __________________ HTPC/file server: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit - AMD Phenom x4 9850 - 4GB OCZ DDR2 800 (2x2GB) - 1TB WD Black - 4 x 1TB Hitachi DeskStar in RAID 5 - ATi TV Wonder Digital Cable Tuner - HIS Raedon 4850 512MB - ASRock N68C-S UCC mobo - OCZ ModExtreme Pro 500W PSU GF's Gaming PC: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit - AMD Phenom 9850 - 4GB OCZ DDR2 1066 - 500GB Western Digital GP - HIS Raedon 5770 1GB - ASUS M3A78-EM - Zalman 650W PSU Media Streamer: Win 7 Pro 64-bit - AMD Athlon x2 3200+ - 4GB SuperTalent DDR2 800 - 250GB SeaGate Barracuda - MSI K9N6PGM2-V2 - ASUS Raedon 5450 SILENT - FSP group 250W PSU

Sep 22, 2007, 07:09 PM	Thread Starter #10
topbob HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: SFBA, CA, USA Posts: 463 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	My mobo says it only supports X2 dual core CPU's, thats why I haven't considered a Opteron, even though it is socket 939. Did Asus just not say it supported it due to Opteron being a newer CPU, or does it really not support it you think? And thanks Dyre, I'm ganna check my RAM timings and I'm pretty sure its on auto right now. Asus's site for my mobo __________________ 12090 in 3DMarks06 on current system, 5001 on old system, 4164 on older, 1587 on oldest

Sep 23, 2007, 09:37 AM	#13
Necrosis HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,838 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	Ditto

Sep 23, 2007, 04:31 PM	#14
Matth Flash Banner Hater Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: UK Posts: 3,426 Rep Power: 93 System Specs	A8R-MVP... http://support.asus.com/cpusupport/c...Language=en-us According to that, the Opteron Dualcore 180 & 185 are supported by ALL PCB with BIOS from 0503 - so if planning on an opteron dual, you need BIOS 0503 (final) or 0602 (beta) __________________ Mary had a little lamb, Her father shot it dead Now Mary takes her lamb to school, Between two crusts of bread

Sep 23, 2007, 09:48 PM	Thread Starter #15
topbob HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: SFBA, CA, USA Posts: 463 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Thanks a lot guys, really helped me out. I think I'll go for the 170 or 175 Opteron, after I make sure I have the correct BIOS. edit: and yes, I have the 0602 build. edit2: decided to go with the 180 Opteron __________________ 12090 in 3DMarks06 on current system, 5001 on old system, 4164 on older, 1587 on oldest Last edited by topbob; Sep 24, 2007 at 03:13 AM.