Thinking of going Intel....couple questions.

Rayder

We're thinking of getting into an Intel PC. We've always used AMD systems over the years, but want to try something different. We figure after 10+ years with AMD, it's time for a change, since we're gonna be forced to change just about everything in a new rig anyway (AGP to PCI express, PATA to SATA, etc.)

Currently, we ("we" being my brother and I) are looking at an Intel D925 Presler 3ghz 2X2MB L2 cache LGA775 processor.

What would be a decent full size ATX motherboard to go with that? We figure it's best to go with a Intel chipset.....but which one? There are so many. One with DDR2 800mhz support is preferred.

It won't be so much for gaming, but more for general all-around purposes, so it doesn't need to be the most expensive board, just a reliable one.

We plan to put a WindowsXP-based OS in it to keep maximum compatibility with all our other PC's and peripherals.

Any pointers that would send us in the right direction would be appreciated.

kris23

dont buy Presler/Pentium D based chips.... they are a thing of the past. go for the Core architecture. Intel came out with a whole line of bareframe, budget and mainstream chips that cover all necessary tasks with awesome performance.

Newegg.com - Intel Dual-Core E2140 Allendale 1.6GHz 1MB L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail

thats my budget recommendation CPU

my motherboard recommendation would be anything with a G33 northbridge and ICH9R Southbridge

if you give me a price-point i can probably show you something better and more specific

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Rayder

Thanks for the head-up on the Pentium D CPUs. We'll avoid those then.

Targeting a possible next-month purchase through Newegg.

You gave us some great pointers. What we actually end up with will be based on what is available at that time, but getting information on what we DON'T want is very helpful to say the least. Your info on CPU's and the chipset is exactly the kind of info we were looking for and has been put on our list for consideration. Thanks!

Plus rep for you.

Judas

i'll vouch for the E2180 ... they are very little more $ for a significant speed increase over the E2140's.... Course if your strapped for thatm uch cash.... the E2140 is much better then anything else.

Get the Asus P5K-SE motherboard, with Intel's newer P35 chipset and the Realtek ALC883 onboard audio solution.... it's a pretty damn decent board..... course it lacks alot of option (bios tweakability) the dollar value on it is pretty damn great.

The stock heatsink that comes with the E2180 or E2140 is more than enough for general purpose use, definitely not for overclocking in any way.... but i highly recommend removing the already supplied thermal paste with some much better.

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Judas

oh.... if your looking for an intergrated video solution (erg) i can't recommend any motherboard currently, as the onboard intel graphics chipsets are just terrible.

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kris23

i recommend a P35 chipset with an X1300 video card if you can get them. the x1300 now is around 20-30 dollars

like i said before, if you give us a price range, we can get something better.

i shop and browse newegg extremely often so i know the stock well..

the Pentium Dual-Core E2140, E2160, E2180 are all awesome performers for those strapped on cash.

if you want great power with good overclocking potiential, get an E6550 but that is more in the 175 dollar range and more than twice the Pentiums price

will you be building a whole brand new setup or will you be upgrading the components of your present set up.

the cooler master 690 case is in the 70 dollar range and offers THE BEST COOLING i seen in that price range, only thing that rivals it is its big brothers the stacker 830 series .

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kris23

if you want, i can put together lists from the egg of possible systems ranging from budget to souped up.

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Judas

hey how are you liking the 500gb seagate 7200.11s?

i've got another set order on it's way..

6x500gb in raid 0 on the ICH9R controller should be a fun riot...

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Rayder

Thanks for all the responses.

Mainly, the system will be used for video recording/editing and general purpose use. For a video card, we plan to have at least an x1900 or better and a separate tuner card. Games are not ruled out, but won't be its primary function. We figure that for the most part, onboard audio would be sufficient, but we won't rule out adding a sound card sometime down the line. We intend to make it our first HD video system.

While we don't really get into using raid arrays, it will have lots of storage space for recorded video. We have some hard drives already that could go in it at this point, ranging from 250gig to 500gig, but of course we plan to stuff it to capacity with drives over time. We already have a few terrabytes of external storage space.

We're targeting $500 for motherboard, processor and RAM. After that, we figure about $700 more will be spent on the essential base system. We already have an aluminum case to put it in. Things such as keyboards, monitors, DVD drives, card readers, etc. are not not part of the above figures stated. We have stuff like that already to put in it.

We want to have a solid base for startup so we don't run into stupid problems because we bought crap. We went down that road with AMD systems in the past and have learned a lot about those, but we're completely ignorant when it comes to Intel rigs.

We don't want it to be a system that gets excessively hot since it may be on for weeks at a time, but we want it to be as quiet as possible when running without going into anything like liquid cooling. We have no plans for any kind of overclocking. We were hoping to stay with an XP based OS (MCE) for the time being, but fear we may be forced to go Vista to have the system operate correctly.

For the CPU, my bro is looking at the E4600 Allendale 2.4ghz. Reviews are saying it runs very cool. Based on what people are telling us and what's showing as available at newegg, this is about middle of the road for its class and sounds about like we want to start with.

Newegg has always been our primary source for PC components. We've never gotten burned by using them.

It doesn't need to be an uber-system, just a solid reliable one.

Our current best system is an Athlon 64 3400 system with an X1600 video card (AGP)....just to give you an idea of where we are right now. We expect just about anything in a dual core CPU and PCI express video to whoop it.


Everyone with helpful replies is getting rep'd.

kris23

damn dude u crazy..... SIX 500GB 7200.11 DRIVES!?!?!?!?

currently im only using them as storage for my laptop but they will be pumping at RAID 0 for my main rig when its done

looking at getting a Maximus Extreme X38 board sincew its only a bit more expensive than the P5E3 with some interesting features,



to Rayder: Newegg is the best, i know. shop there too

now that i see where you are, i think you would do best with a Core 2 Duo E6550, it is a Conroe based processor that is the fastest Dual-Core variety that Intel makes.

just because its 0.07GHz lower doesnt mean its slower, its faster by a considerable amount.

Newegg.com - Intel Core 2 Duo E6550 Conroe 2.33GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail

there is also the intel Quad-Cores that are extremely powerful multitasking giants. it packs more than DOUBLE the force of the E6550.

Newegg.com - Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 Kentsfield 2.4GHz 2 x 4MB L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail

now for your video card, since you are coming from a X1600 and want power of a 1900, which is a pretty muscular card, i'll show you one of ATi's current flagship cards.

Newegg.com - HIS Hightech H385F256NP Radeon HD 3850 256MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail

the HD 3850 is a very powerful card at the budget range, though it cant take something like like a Nvidia 8800GT, it is still a lot more powerful than an X1900.

if you want, you can get an 8800GT also as it has superior HD capabilities, you can play HD content and have it exclusively rendered by the graphics processor and leave the CPU's processes to a minimum.

the HD 3850 also has this feature but now with all the force.

the 8800GT is fastest here (its even faster than the 8800GTS cards just so you know)

Newegg.com - XFX PVT88PYDD4 GeForce 8800GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card - Retail

next is the motherboard, i recommend that you go with an P35 based board or an X38 based motherboard, X38 being the best of them.

Newegg.com - Foxconn MARS LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

despite looking funny, most of Foxconn's boards are extremely powerful and can compete wiith some of ASUS's best.


Newegg.com - Foxconn X38A LGA 775 Intel X38 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail

the RAM, well theres DDR3 and DDR2 but DDR3 is way to expensive for the average user.

Crucial memory is the only sure answer i recommend.... its the best
Newegg.com - Crucial Ballistix Tracer 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail

lastly the hard disk i recommend is Seagates 7200.11 series...
Newegg.com - Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 ST3500320AS 500GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM

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Judas

could i suggest perhaps looking at the HD2600xt for the video card.

considering that x1900 doesn't have HDCP support and a number of other specific abilities that could drastically upset the purpose of the system.

the HD2600xt has the hardware HD decoders built right in and considerable improvements to it over x1900. The speed isn't ALL that much different from a x1900... sure a x1900 is roughly 15-25% faster in games.... but the extra features present on the hd2600xt makes it much more worth it (and should be a little cheaper as well) then the x1900 for what your building the machine for.

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kris23

i already recommended the HD 3850 which is almost double the force of the 2600XT, at the similar price, with all the features you are talking about judas.

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Rayder

That 3850 looks tasty.....the 2600 will also be considered though.

When I said a X1900, that was just an off the top of the head type of thing. Didn't realize HD compatibility was so dependent on the video card....figured that an HD tuner card would have been enough for that. Thanks for the info on that point.

Will definitely look into those motherboards. That Foxconn MARS LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard is looking REALLY good.

The 500gig Seagate's are a no-brainer. Those were already on our list.

One thing that's not a consideration for us is running dual videocards. One will be enough for our purposes.

We were also wanting to go with 4gigs of RAM, but realize that might force us to go to Vista when we already have a couple MCE disks lying around. Isn't it true that XP OS's don't see 4gigs properly? Because if that's the case, we'll go with 2gigs now and move to 4gigs once we actually upgrade to Vista.


I would add more rep to you guys, but it says I have to spread it around more.

kris23

i seriously recommend just going with vista, it is a good, stable OS and its fast.

the X38 board also supports DDR3 which is a good upgrade once the stuff gets cheaper.

dual video cards is nice, but the PCI-E 2.0 spec of the X38 boards eliminates the bandwidth problem that may occur in the future.

but both are good choices.

the thought that all XP OSes dont see 4GB RAM properly is incorrect, all 32-bit operating systems dont see 4GB of memory properly.

have you noticed everyone running around with Vista Ultimate x64 in their profiles? thats mainly because they passed the 4GB limit.

when you measure maximum memory you include videocard memory, just not system RAM

32-bit OSes have a max of 4GB. 4 sticks of 1GB memory already hits it. if you add something like Dual 2900XT 1GB cards, the memory is 6GB then. far beyond the max

in 64-bit OSes, the maximum is a whopping 32GB, for now, we are not even approaching that limit. in desktop computing anyway.... it is hit in server computing....

Zardon here has 16GB ram with an 8800Ultra his V8 system wouldve been severely crippled if he used a 32 but OS

also, you never selected a processor, will you geet the E6550, Q6600, or E4600?

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temeteus82

Actually in Ultimate 64-bit it's 128GB+

And I recomend Q6600 (Stepping=G0)

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Rayder

We're considering Vista (Media Center capable version) but we're confused by all the fud being spread around the net about it. Would that be Vista Home Premium that we would want?

Is it really all that flaky about drivers?

Is it really less compatible with USB devices....I mean like actually recognizing them properly without needing drivers like XP is? We have lots and lots of little USB gadgets and don't want to lose compatibility with them.

How flaky is it about seeing our older systems on the home network? We heard about turning off Norton anti-virus to fix such problems with connecting to older OS's, but beyond that, we've never even seen a Vista machine in action besides a couple closed-ended ones at work.

How good is the backwards compatibility with older software. What types of software should we be expecting to just NOT work in Vista?

You guys have been invaluable with the info, keep it coming!

kris23

many people say vista sucks because they expect to be able to run it on a system from 04-05 without a hitch with a 5 year old printer, their old anti-virus and crappy webcam.

that is optimistic, ignorant, and many people that do that are either stingy, stubborn or lazy.

software backwards compatibility is NOT that great.... but if it was, it would just be some shiny verson of XP with all the old bugs really.......

thats why theres drivers for nearly every piece of equipment for vista

and theres the nifty autosearch for drivers for all hardware thats plugged into the system. nearly everything i plugged in automatically had vista optimized downloaded for the device.

also, dont use Norton anti-virus it sucks and blocks off a lot of ports even if disabled it seems.

i dont know too much about home networking, never had a use for it, but i think the problem you had there was more with the anti-virus than the actual OS. im using ButDefender Total Security 2008 and it runs great on vista. you may need to tweak it to allow external connections though....

all vista versions besides Business (and i think enterprise?) include Windows Media Center.

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kris23

honestly, i just recommend torrenting vista and saving it to a disk to try it out for your particular set up. it will only last for 30 days if you dont have a Cd key, but that should be more than enough to take it for a spin.

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kris23

dang thats alot of RAM....

and yea a G0 stepping Q6600 is the best thing you can buy right now man. i recommend it if you can afford it. but that 500 dollar limit is alittle low

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kris23

Newegg.com - SAPPHIRE 100216L Radeon HD 3850 256MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail
Newegg.com - CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX ATX12V / EPS12V 750W Power Supply 100 - 240 V UL, CE, CB, TUV, FCC, CCC - Retail
Newegg.com - OCZ Platinum 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Micron D7 Chip Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Retail
Newegg.com - Foxconn MARS LGA 775 Intel P35 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
Newegg.com - Intel Core 2 Duo E6550 Conroe 2.33GHz 4M shared L2 Cache LGA 775 Processor - Retail
Newegg.com - OCZ OCZTXTCC Memory Cooler For both DDR1 & DDR2 - Retail
Newegg.com - Thermalright HR-01 PLUS CPU Heatsink - Retail

these are my recommendations for the system. it look good?

i decided to include my recommended cooling as thats what you would need to let it run for weeks with no stress.

what kind of case do you have?

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Judas

64bit is almost an absalute must at this point..

i can successfully run vista very effiencelty on much older hardware.


home premium is what you'll want though.... it doesn't have core/cpu limits/ ram limitations and a number of other specific things


btw... if you can find anyone that may have a windows vista disk that you can borrow.. doesn't matter which one... just don't use a cd key...

pop it in, boot from it... uncheck the auto activation and don't punch in a cd key and pick your version you want to try out..... use it for 30 days (or using the cmd reset command to use it up to nearly 4 months or more to trial) It's worth doing it this way that way you can thoroughly try out vista to make sure it's fully capable and then you can make a purchase and tie to the key to the system once your confident.

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kris23

what he said, the software is catching up and the hardware is being beefed up to meet 64-bit specs...

2GB sticks of ram are becoming more and more common at high speeds. 1GB of GDDR3/4 is becoming the normal high end of graphics cards.

one can easily build a system with 8 gigs of high speed RAM, dual or even quad graphics with up to 2 gigs max

that there is some high performing stuff man.

add in a quad-core or 2 with 4 GPU cores and you got a system with no equal.....

namely, buy a QX9650 Quad-Core Yorkfield, 4 sticks of Corsair XMS3 DHX 1600MHz DDR3, dual HD 3870 X2 1GB GDDR4 graphics cards and put it all on an ASUS Maximus Extreme X38 board with six 7200.11 500GB drives (lol Judas)

so the bank was just smashed with that explanation... thats the price of the best.

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Rayder

The recommendations that Kris23 came up with look VERY good at this point. Will definitely be looking into all of that. Bummer that the heatsink doesn't come with a fan already on it though.

The motherboard, CPU and videocard seem to be a definite at this point. Some of the other things may vary a bit.

Right now, we're heading out to our sister's house for Thanksgiving dinner.

kris23

happy thanksgiving man!

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