mariuscmorar

I'm working a lot with photoshop and I'm using big files and I want a fast computer. Basicaly I want to apply a filter or convert a 50mb photo and not have to wait. I want to buy a PC that I can upgrade later and I could use for at least 4 years, but I don't want to spend more than $3000. I'm trying to find the balance between CPU, Memory, Motherboard, Videocard, under $3000 and make it in such a way that I can upgrate it later. It makes no sense to get a CPU or Motherboard that won't support more memory upgrate later... you get the point.

What would be the best combination? What does photoshop use to work fast. I know it uses all mentioned above, but how much does it use of each?

Do you have any recomandation where the get the PC from? Any good place that doesn't charge a lot? And, by the way, I'm looking for a quiet one. I want to sleep in the room with it running.

Thanks a lot!!!!

MIG-31

Hi and welcome to DH

I'm not one who can help out with the specs for the price you are asking (As im in the UK) but im just letting you know i have moved this post to the forum where you will get more advice and help.

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lepel

Have you thought about building it yourself?

mariuscmorar

Yes, but I've never done it before and I'm afraid not to get parts that are imcompatible with each other. Compatibility is my biggest issue. What would be a good place to get the parts, anyway?

kris23

newegg....

tower totals at $2200

CD/DVD - LG 22X DVD Combo Drive (US) Newegg.com (UK)
Chassis - Cooler Master ACTS 840 Full Tower (US) Newegg.com (UK)
HDD - 2x OCZ Vertex 30GB SSD SATA Drive (US) Newegg.com
HDD Adapter - 2x ICY DOCK 2.5 to 3.5 HDD converter (US) Newegg.com
HDD2 - Seagate 7200.12 1TB SATA Drive (US) Newegg.com
GPU - EVGA GeForce GTX 285 (US) Newegg.com (UK)
Memory - 2x OCZ Reaper HPC 6GB (3x2GB) DDR3 CAS 9-9-9-30 2000Mhz (Triple-Channel) (US) Newegg.com
Motherboard - EVGA 132-BL-E758-TR X58 ATX Motherboard (US) Newegg.com (UK)
CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Quad Core CPU (US) Newegg.com
OS - Windows Vista Ultimate SP1 64-bit (US) Newegg.com
PSU - Corsair 1000HX 1000w ATX PSU (US) Newegg.com

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lepel

In photoshop RAM is very important and so is the CPU. GPU is of less importance.

So you might want to get 2x these: Newegg.com - CORSAIR DOMINATOR 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory - Desktop Memory

I'd certainly take a i7 CPU, don't know if it's worth the extra money to get one higher than the 920. You can overclock the difference I think if you're into that.

mariuscmorar

Thank you very much, that helps a lot!

Does it help me more if I get a Video Card with 2gb, (the difference is $100) or it's not worthed? Also if I would double the memory to 12gb, would it help me more?

Also how much a difference would it make if I would get an Intel Core i7 940?

Thanks a lot!!!

Mousey

Not Necessarily with photoshop CS4, CS4 has added GPU acceleration which helps when working with larger documents as it takes the strain off the cpu whilst working so everything's faster. Ever been working with a large document with music on and it start skipping?
CS4 aims to stop things like that

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Judas

6gb of ram for photoshop is pretty decent over all, but if we are talking BIG files.. 8-12gb would be far more appropriate..

actually if you can get more.... the better..

Obviously a i920 would be suitable,

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mariuscmorar

I've read some reviews that this
Newegg.com - CORSAIR CMPSU-1000HX 1000W ATX12V 2.2 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Modular Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply - Power Supplies
is pretty loud and I need something very quiet. Do you guys know anything about its noise? Should I get stg else if I want a silent pc?

I've read that this case
Newegg.com - COOLER MASTER ATCS 840 RC-840-KKN1-GP Black Aluminum ATX Full Tower Computer Case - Computer Cases
is preaty good at noise since it has 3 low speed fans.

Is this the best choice for a silent PC?

You've helped me a lot! Thanks!!!

lepel

Newegg.com - SeaSonic M12D SS-850 850W ATX12V V2.3/EPS12V V2.92 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS SILVER Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply - Power Supplies

I used this list to choose it: Recommended Power Supplies | silentpcreview.com

It should be enough to cover your needs I think.

kris23

if you read the DH review, you can find that this PSU is noted as inaudible at 50% power, its cooling is very good.

http://www.hardwareheaven.com/reviews....d=592&pageid=4

just so you know, these system specs dont go near 50%

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mariuscmorar

Thanks everyone. That helps a lot!

What about a tower case with liquid cooling? Would that be a lot? I've heard the processor works much beter if it's temperature is 5C. Any ideas?

kris23

well... liquid cooling works, but is not very necessary....

and where in the world did you hear that CPUs work well at 5C?

thats FAR below ambient and would cost hundreds of dollars to equip for, the odds of your system shorting out from condensation is extremely high. just stick with a nice passive heatsink... 30C is already excellent

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mariuscmorar

So liquid is not necessary, and it's pricy too. I'll stick with your recomandations. Thanks a lot!

PS. Any good blue-ray? There are tons of them.

kris23

not sure on which ones are the best, they range from $60 to $200 and some have trouble playing movies from certain producers....

for a cooler for a beginner computer builder, i recommend the:

Hyper Z600 Newegg.com - COOLER MASTER Hyper Z600 RR-600-LBU1-GP CPU Cooler - CPU Fans & Heatsinks

with the 1366 retention kit Newegg.com - COOLER MASTER RR-ACC-1366-GP LGA 1366 Bracket Set - CPU Fans & Heatsinks

though if you want a simple yet very effective water cooler, go with the domino A.L.C. Newegg.com - CoolIT SYSTEMS Domino A.L.C Advanced Liquid Cooling - Water Cooling

cheap stuff but great!

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mariuscmorar

Does the liquid cooling system have fans too or not? I thought that liquid cooling have no fans and are dead quied and that's their big advantage.

Should I go with liquid or not? What are the pro and cons?

Thanks!!!

Zardon

Actually this is were a lot of people are getting confused. The GFX acceleration in Photoshop does not take any of the filtering or algorithm load from the CPU. it merely handles the redrawing and onscreen movements of the pixels. None of the filtering processing is handled by the GFX.

I turn it off as I work with often up to 50 files at a time and the GFX runs out of ram. With photoshop it is also important to mention that for hardcore use it is best running the 64bit version on 64bit operating system as you will suffer from 3gb-3.5 memory limitations.

Get a decent I7 CPU and 12gb of ram (and make sure you are running a 64bit operating system). It is clear from this thread that really the thread starter isn't up on system building so I wouldn't overcomplicate the build with liquid and manual overclocking. for 3k perhaps best getting a system build from a specialist retailer in the USA.

kris23

Z has spoken....

mariuscmorar, liquid cooling definitely has fans, and not all of them are very quiet. they just perform better but are a bit complicated.

like i said, its probably better if you buy the Z600 as its passive but an excellent performer...

if you find that building yourself a system is not for you, then i would just get one prebuilt from newegg... though the companies that build them dont put quite as much care into it

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swimtech

CyberpowerPC might be a good place to look - they've quite a few configurable i7 965 systems built using quality components which they make a point to describe - that way you really know what you're getting.

Edit: the configuration possibilities there are nearly endless...

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It's not so much getting your way that matters or not - what matters is how you go about getting it.

kris23

i think thats one of the companies that dont care about the systems they put together....

my cousin said his friend had one before or another similar brand... looked inside and all the cables were just sticking out like a jungle

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lepel

I think that building it yourself is rewarding in the end. And people here will be more than happy to assist you with it.

swimtech

Hmmm, well, I could understand the aversion because of shoddy workmanship if, for sure, the company was the one I mentioned - but the three reviews of Cyberpower built PCs here have been very good with mention of the very tidy interiors.

I've seen some here where I work as well, and they look great.

Just a suggestion to consider, as they build them with most of the components you recommend Kris23 (Coolermaster cases, EVGA mainboards, Corsair PSUs - and others too).

Granted, I built my own, you've built yours - its an option for those who want the quality but not necessarily the work.

BTW, you should see my wires - no wait - let's not!

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It's not so much getting your way that matters or not - what matters is how you go about getting it.

OldBuzzard

If you are going to buy a custom built system, I would HIGHLY recommend Maingear. They are about as good as it gets, for the Botique Builders. They have great support and warranties, and their build quility is second to none.

Take a look at their F131 system. You can pick and choose from a lot of options, and at the $3K range you can go with an i7-940, 12GB RAM, 1 500 HDD and 1 1TB HDD, and a high end video card. OH, that's with "Arctic X20 Liquid Cooling " for the CPU as well.

Maingear PC | Custom Computers and Gaming PCs by MAINGEAR Computers

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Tipstaff

I don't know if going with an OCZ Vertex setup would be wise at the moment. I would rather see a setup that would include a couple 15k SAS drives, or even a couple Velociraptor drives in RAID 0. Yes, the OCZ Vertex drives are nice, and bloody damn fast, but the setup and maintenance of those drives takes a bit of work, even for those in the know. Setting up the alignment, having to run the trim tool manually (which doesn't always work, especially on some x64 Vista setups where it could, in fact, corrupt the install), and having to disable a bunch of services/tools (such as prefetch, defrag, and so fourth)... that might be a lot of work for this guy to handle.

Until they mature, and/or when Windows 7 comes out which will have native support for SSDs (which when you install it on an SSD automatically turns off all the necessary things, and also supports TRIM natively), I'd recommend staying away from them, at least in the thread starters case.

Edit:
My choice for a board would be the Asus P6T WS Pro. It's almost the same as the P6T Deluxe, except that it doesn't support Tri-SLI or 3-Way Crossfire (useless in an editing system anyways). It still comes with 2 PCIE graphics slots, as well as 2 onboard SAS ports, but instead of a PATA port you get 2 more SATA, bringing you up to a total of 6 SATA and 2 SAS. You'll have to go all SATA for everything, including optical drives, but the great thing about this is that it tidys everything up cable wise (simplifies it really), gives you more ports for more drives, and more options in the way of RAID configurations.

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swimtech

Had never heard of them before but they sure do have a classy presentation. Great components too.

And agree totally with Tip on that workstation board - much more suited to task - and built to be reliable. Asus has good history on the workstation series boards too.

Edit: Tipstaff, I thought about it for a few moments and thought it wise to ask you, and for the sake of the OP. What might be the differences between the Asus board you've pointed out, and the comparable Intel board - knowing of your familiarity with Intel boards in general...

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It's not so much getting your way that matters or not - what matters is how you go about getting it.

Mousey

Ah right thanks a lot for the info Z, i haven't actually had chance to play about with CS4 yet been getting everything i want out of CS3.

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Tipstaff

3 main differences: the Intel board only has 4 memory slots (so right now you're limited as to how much RAM you can buy), doesn't have PCI-X slots (not PCI Express for those that don't know), and no SAS ports. One thing I've learned when building editing machines is that PCI-X slots are really damn handy for things like encoding boards, or expanding your storage capabilities. In this case, say you'd want to increase your SAS use, or eSATA or SATA ports. PCI-X controllers that do this sort of thing kick the snot out of any comparible PCI card, and usually have way more configuration options (not to mention that they are usually are far more reliable too).

I guess what I'm saying is that getting the Asus P6T WS Pro board allows you to look at buying hardware usually only seen in servers, while Intel expects you to buy their other more expensive stuff in order to get that option.

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blibbax

I'd strongly reccoend building yourself if you can - it's far more rewarding and you get exactly what you want. As long as you avoid complex ideas like watercooling you should be fine.

I'm no expert on such things, but would that 3k budget push to a dual CPU system? Just a thought.

Also, about what Zardon was saying - does that mean that a powerful GPU (like a 285) is overkill but that lots of memory is essential?

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Zardon

Its not that its overkill, but for Photoshop it makes very little difference in real world terms. The GFX handles the movement of the images on the screen so you find that scrolling and zooming in and out is enhanced. Personally I don't rate the GFX acceleration at all because it needs to be coded to use the processing power of the GPU to handle filters and algorithms to be truly classed as "acceleration". The more memory you have on the GFX however the more images (or bigger images) you can load into memory. People will notice if they open a ton of images that an alert will show saying the GFX has run out of memory and it will turn itself off.

Considering Adobe can barely get more than 2 cores at 100% load for most filtering processes i would say that true GFX acceleration is a long time coming.