Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV

Randomletters · Oct 24, 2010, 04:18 AM

Which would you prefer to use full time as a PC monitor 27" or 32" Im going from dual Monitors (22 and 19) to one large display, And not sure weither a 32 would be too large to use as a standard full time monitor.

It will be doubling as my sole television, so on that note a 32 would be better, but its in my bedroom/soon to be studio apartment so 27" will also suit me fine

simonw · Oct 24, 2010, 04:38 AM

If it helps, I have a 32" TV, and I watch it from about 6-7 feet away which seems to be a good distance for both watching TV and using a PC with wireless keyboard/mouse.

However, if the monitor and keyboard are on the same desk with my face about 2 feet from the screen, then I feel a 32" would be way too big, so I would probably go for the 27".

Randomletters · Oct 24, 2010, 04:39 AM

yea im practically going to be always a few feet away i think im going to go with a 27

Jac · Oct 24, 2010, 11:13 AM

I would think a 32" would be too big if you're gonna use it on your desk.

Takaharu · Oct 24, 2010, 12:05 PM

I have a 32" TV in my bedroom and I'd have to sit on the other side of the room if I wanted to use it for my PC (which is about 3.5m, taking into account where I'd be sitting compared to where it is).
How far away are you from your screen?

BlueMak · Oct 24, 2010, 12:19 PM

If you are going to use it for a desk pc usage, the smaller the better. This of course is very subjective, but there are times I find even my 24" too big.

CJLMTLCA · Oct 24, 2010, 02:29 PM

I concur that 32 might be too close, but out of curiosity what resolution is the 32?

Randomletters · Oct 24, 2010, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CJLMTLCA

I concur that 32 might be too close, but out of curiosity what resolution is the 32?

No idea Im not really going to be specially hand picking a certian model # just going to hit up a few retail stores with about $280 and see what I get.

Randomletters · Oct 25, 2010, 03:51 AM

Well Bestbuy has a 32" on sale for 280.... so if all goes well I might just have to "suffer" with the larger one

BlueMak · Oct 25, 2010, 07:19 AM

If you are going to buy what is the biggest for the buck, then you might end up suffering.

Get the best quality for your budget, not the biggest or most impressive. But that is just me.

Takaharu · Oct 25, 2010, 10:05 AM

A lot of cheap, large TVs lately have the capability to display HD at 1080 (p or i, one of those) but the screen resolution is 1366x768, which is a heck of a lot smaller of a screen resolution compared to 1920x1080 as it should be displayed.
I have a TV round a friend's house that can display full HD, which worked fine when I used to use it with my PS3 but my PC, even through HDMI, could only display at 1680x1050. This didn't really bother me as it was an upgrade from dual 17" screens and I was more interested in the fact that it could display my PS3 and PC.

So yeah, be wary of large screens with small resolutions.

Randomletters · Oct 25, 2010, 07:50 PM

Thanks maybe ill be a bit more subjective with my choices, I think what ever I get though Ill be happy with. I'm going from a 22"/19" Dual monitor, I figured I wanted to get something that was practically the area of both combined.

I didnt take into account which resolutions tvs would be able to display, as that would impact desktop space...

Maybe ill just end up with a single 24" PC LCD monitor.

nicnik · Oct 25, 2010, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simonw

However, if the monitor and keyboard are on the same desk with my face about 2 feet from the screen, then I feel a 32" would be way too big, so I would probably go for the 27".

That's my thoughts exactly. I tried the Desk + 32 inch before. it doesn't work. Unless u have a huge long desk. I prefer to stick to 22-24 monitor + the TV jus for films + surfing wireless.

I think in his situation would be best going with a 27 and keeping it on the desk.

Judas · Oct 26, 2010, 04:57 PM

considering i've used a 52/55 inch as a full size monitor and sat about 3 feet or less from it...

they are GREAT monitors..

what i DO know is that anything larger then 32/37 @ 1360x768 is not pleasant..

but if your running 1920x1080, 52/55 inch is great..

BlueMak · Oct 26, 2010, 06:18 PM

What Judas forgets to mention is that he has 67 points of myopia.
I can't think of another reason how anyone would truthfully say that a 52/55 inch monitor at 3 feet or less is a great size for the job.

**MIG-31** · Oct 26, 2010, 06:27 PM

Im for one who agrees with most of the comments abot the 32" screen being used as a Desktop monitor...

My 22" Samsung is big enough for my use... But bare in mind that my desktop is a corner unit.... anything bigger wild start to bring it much closer... This is currently around 3 feet away.. So a 32" would be much closer..

If my desk were against a flat wall a 32" would still be to big imo...

**kris23** · Oct 26, 2010, 10:08 PM

i actually use a 32" vizio LCD as my monitor, its 1080p and yes this thing took alot of getting used to and alot of tweaking in order to not ruin my eyes...

right now my face is about...2 feet from it, i like it but thats just me.

just be careful... AN LCD TV HAS BRIGHTNESS LEVELS THAT WERE MEANT FOR VIEWING FROM SEVERAL FEET AWAY, USING AN LCD AT FULL BRIGHTNESS WITHIN A COUPLE OF FEET IS A VERY QUICK WAY TO GO BLIND....

Trust me i know... the first few days i used the TV, i noticed everything go fuzzy... once i realized this, i tweaked all the settings for low brightness and now im fine.

Judas · Oct 27, 2010, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kris23

just be careful... AN LCD TV HAS BRIGHTNESS LEVELS THAT WERE MEANT FOR VIEWING FROM SEVERAL FEET AWAY, USING AN LCD AT FULL BRIGHTNESS WITHIN A COUPLE OF FEET IS A VERY QUICK WAY TO GO BLIND....

Trust me i know... the first few days i used the TV, i noticed everything go fuzzy... once i realized this, i tweaked all the settings for low brightness and now im fine.

i call BS...

sorry... but light that you were designed to look at will not cause blindness.

Fuzziness or anything of the sort would be due to eyestrain YES, caused by your own tolerances for these situations...

Obviously anyone that gets any monitor of any style, will have to determine their own comfortable settings..

People have extra wide viewing angles, some are extremely narrow.. some cannot take the light others can't get it bright enough....

These factors can be discussed for eons... but in the end.... asking these questions isn't going to really get any answers until whomever it is sits down and uses something for a decent duration.

I know that i had used a 32inch for quite some time and thought wow.. it's huge.. specially jumping from a 19"..... thought it might be to much, but after using it... it was great.. loved it... jump to a 40" 720p and while i liked it.. i found i just didn't enjoy it.... however the same size in the 1080p seemed to resolve this... i think it mainly was down to seeing the large tv up close and seeing each pixel clearly and how blocky it was made me quite unhappy with the quality up close..... 1080p resolving this..

i don't think i'd go larger then 52/55 until 2160p is made available...

Randomletters · Oct 29, 2010, 03:16 AM

Ive got a few more days before I Decide. Hittin up craigslist daily I came across a
Samsung LN26C450. If its still available I Really want it, not sure what resolutions itll support though.

simonw · Oct 29, 2010, 04:42 AM

26" 720p LCD TV Series 4 | Samsung LN26C450 - LCD TVs

This is only 720P and 1366 x 768 res.

Randomletters · Oct 29, 2010, 04:52 AM

So they wont just accept a range of resolutions

What if it advertises 1080i

Neshi · Oct 29, 2010, 05:00 AM

i'd advice to hit up some stores and check the monitors out personally so you can see what resolution you feel comfortable with.
1366x768 is extremely low, especially on a 26" screen.

Randomletters · Oct 29, 2010, 05:01 AM

yea I would not be comfortable with that. Im also looking at a westinghouse which lists 1080i, So that would mean it will do 1920x1080?

Neshi · Oct 29, 2010, 05:03 AM

it implies a screensize of 1920x1080, yes.

Randomletters · Oct 29, 2010, 05:08 AM

Sorry for the nubness I never looked into doing this and assumed i would have a range of resolutions to chose from

Neshi · Oct 29, 2010, 05:17 AM

you do have a range of resolutions. However, the resolution that is advertised is the maximum resolution. smaller resolutions are always available.
I wouldn't skimp on a monitor though, better to get a better quality small screen, rather than having a big one with lots of backlight bleeding, pixels failing etc. as it will annoy you in the long run.

Randomletters · Oct 29, 2010, 05:31 AM

Im probibly going to end up with Westinghouse SK26H630S 26 inch 1080i LCD HDTV (Refurbished) | Overstock.com

He says hes only used it 6 months, says its like new, and Im only paying 150 for it! So I feel like I cant lose with this deal Im getting exactly what I want and still have a few bucks left. ( Money will probably go towards celebratory chicken wings! )

simonw · Oct 29, 2010, 07:13 AM

I wasn't able to find the full specs on the Westinghouse SK26H630S, but they have a newer 26" model (SK-26H640G) on their website, and the res is still only 1366 x 768.

26″ LCD TV SK-26H640G | WDE

Be careful with that, the cheaper 1080i units will not be able to display 1920x1080.

Neshi · Oct 29, 2010, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simonw

Be careful with that, the cheaper 1080i units will not be able to display 1920x1080.

exactly, that's why I said it implies.
Always check up on it, ask for confirmation so you have a basis to fall back on when you receive it and it doesn't do 1920x1080.

Normally 1080i or 1080p means it will display this resolution, but indeed cheaper models do not and it is kind of deceiving advertisement.

BlueMak · Oct 29, 2010, 10:22 AM

I haven't seen a screen advertised as 1080i (not p) and be able to accurately show proper 1920x1080. Usually they go at 1366x768 or 1650x1050 or something other, but not full HD.
If you want 1920x1080, get a FULL HD one with 1080p not 1080i

Oct 24, 2010, 04:18 AM	#1
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Which would you prefer to use full time as a PC monitor 27" or 32" Im going from dual Monitors (22 and 19) to one large display, And not sure weither a 32 would be too large to use as a standard full time monitor. It will be doubling as my sole television, so on that note a 32 would be better, but its in my bedroom/soon to be studio apartment so 27" will also suit me fine __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 24, 2010, 04:38 AM	#2
simonw HardwareHeaven Addict Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: HK Posts: 312 Rep Power: 43 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV If it helps, I have a 32" TV, and I watch it from about 6-7 feet away which seems to be a good distance for both watching TV and using a PC with wireless keyboard/mouse. However, if the monitor and keyboard are on the same desk with my face about 2 feet from the screen, then I feel a 32" would be way too big, so I would probably go for the 27".

Oct 24, 2010, 04:39 AM	Thread Starter #3
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV yea im practically going to be always a few feet away i think im going to go with a 27 __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 24, 2010, 11:13 AM	#4
Jac HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: England Posts: 761 Rep Power: 51 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV I would think a 32" would be too big if you're gonna use it on your desk.

Oct 24, 2010, 12:05 PM	#5
Takaharu I can fart in 7 languages Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: England, UK Posts: 1,847 Rep Power: 110 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV I have a 32" TV in my bedroom and I'd have to sit on the other side of the room if I wanted to use it for my PC (which is about 3.5m, taking into account where I'd be sitting compared to where it is). How far away are you from your screen? __________________ I don't get paid to know the answer, therefore I'm far more likely to give you a straight and honest answer. Mods Rig, Box Mods Rig, Folding details

Oct 24, 2010, 12:19 PM	#6
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,465 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV If you are going to use it for a desk pc usage, the smaller the better. This of course is very subjective, but there are times I find even my 24" too big. __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*

Oct 24, 2010, 02:29 PM	#7
CJLMTLCA 14X Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 633 Rep Power: 63 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV I concur that 32 might be too close, but out of curiosity what resolution is the 32? __________________

Oct 25, 2010, 03:51 AM	Thread Starter #9
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Well Bestbuy has a 32" on sale for 280.... so if all goes well I might just have to "suffer" with the larger one __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left. Last edited by Randomletters; Oct 25, 2010 at 03:57 AM.

Oct 25, 2010, 07:19 AM	#10
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,465 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV If you are going to buy what is the biggest for the buck, then you might end up suffering. Get the best quality for your budget, not the biggest or most impressive. But that is just me. __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*

Oct 25, 2010, 10:05 AM	#11
Takaharu I can fart in 7 languages Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: England, UK Posts: 1,847 Rep Power: 110 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV A lot of cheap, large TVs lately have the capability to display HD at 1080 (p or i, one of those) but the screen resolution is 1366x768, which is a heck of a lot smaller of a screen resolution compared to 1920x1080 as it should be displayed. I have a TV round a friend's house that can display full HD, which worked fine when I used to use it with my PS3 but my PC, even through HDMI, could only display at 1680x1050. This didn't really bother me as it was an upgrade from dual 17" screens and I was more interested in the fact that it could display my PS3 and PC. So yeah, be wary of large screens with small resolutions. __________________ I don't get paid to know the answer, therefore I'm far more likely to give you a straight and honest answer. Mods Rig, Box Mods Rig, Folding details

Oct 25, 2010, 07:50 PM	Thread Starter #12
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Thanks maybe ill be a bit more subjective with my choices, I think what ever I get though Ill be happy with. I'm going from a 22"/19" Dual monitor, I figured I wanted to get something that was practically the area of both combined. I didnt take into account which resolutions tvs would be able to display, as that would impact desktop space... Maybe ill just end up with a single 24" PC LCD monitor. __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 26, 2010, 06:18 PM	#15
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,465 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV What Judas forgets to mention is that he has 67 points of myopia. I can't think of another reason how anyone would truthfully say that a 52/55 inch monitor at 3 feet or less is a great size for the job. __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*

Oct 26, 2010, 06:27 PM	#16
MIG-31 HardwareHeaven News Mod Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Nottingham,UK Posts: 56,821 Rep Power: 471 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Im for one who agrees with most of the comments abot the 32" screen being used as a Desktop monitor... My 22" Samsung is big enough for my use... But bare in mind that my desktop is a corner unit.... anything bigger wild start to bring it much closer... This is currently around 3 feet away.. So a 32" would be much closer.. If my desk were against a flat wall a 32" would still be to big imo... __________________ Please Post Your News Submissions Here

Oct 26, 2010, 10:08 PM	#17
kris23 Going Insane..... Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,018 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV i actually use a 32" vizio LCD as my monitor, its 1080p and yes this thing took alot of getting used to and alot of tweaking in order to not ruin my eyes... right now my face is about...2 feet from it, i like it but thats just me. just be careful... AN LCD TV HAS BRIGHTNESS LEVELS THAT WERE MEANT FOR VIEWING FROM SEVERAL FEET AWAY, USING AN LCD AT FULL BRIGHTNESS WITHIN A COUPLE OF FEET IS A VERY QUICK WAY TO GO BLIND.... Trust me i know... the first few days i used the TV, i noticed everything go fuzzy... once i realized this, i tweaked all the settings for low brightness and now im fine. __________________ Hardwareheaven Super-Moderator Building a new computer system and not sure where to start? Click Here! last updated (5/18/11) Rosewill FUTURE case replaces CM 690 II with its greater interior length. Building a PC: Step by Step Guide Written by Kristopher Pedemonte and Nathan Marks-Forder Edited by Allan Campbell Questions or Comments? feel free to post them in the forums!

Oct 29, 2010, 03:16 AM	Thread Starter #19
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Ive got a few more days before I Decide. Hittin up craigslist daily I came across a Samsung LN26C450. If its still available I Really want it, not sure what resolutions itll support though. __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 29, 2010, 04:42 AM	#20
simonw HardwareHeaven Addict Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: HK Posts: 312 Rep Power: 43 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV 26" 720p LCD TV Series 4 \| Samsung LN26C450 - LCD TVs This is only 720P and 1366 x 768 res.

Oct 29, 2010, 04:52 AM	Thread Starter #21
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV So they wont just accept a range of resolutions What if it advertises 1080i __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 29, 2010, 05:00 AM	#22
Neshi S.N.A.F.U. Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Wellington, NZ Posts: 3,378 Rep Power: 177 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV i'd advice to hit up some stores and check the monitors out personally so you can see what resolution you feel comfortable with. 1366x768 is extremely low, especially on a 26" screen. __________________ If one does not attach himself to people and desire, never shall his heart be broken. But then, does he ever truly live? Life is just too damn short for if's and maybe's

Oct 29, 2010, 05:01 AM	Thread Starter #23
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV yea I would not be comfortable with that. Im also looking at a westinghouse which lists 1080i, So that would mean it will do 1920x1080? __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 29, 2010, 05:03 AM	#24
Neshi S.N.A.F.U. Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Wellington, NZ Posts: 3,378 Rep Power: 177 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV it implies a screensize of 1920x1080, yes. __________________ If one does not attach himself to people and desire, never shall his heart be broken. But then, does he ever truly live? Life is just too damn short for if's and maybe's

Oct 29, 2010, 05:08 AM	Thread Starter #25
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Sorry for the nubness I never looked into doing this and assumed i would have a range of resolutions to chose from __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 29, 2010, 05:17 AM	#26
Neshi S.N.A.F.U. Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Wellington, NZ Posts: 3,378 Rep Power: 177 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV you do have a range of resolutions. However, the resolution that is advertised is the maximum resolution. smaller resolutions are always available. I wouldn't skimp on a monitor though, better to get a better quality small screen, rather than having a big one with lots of backlight bleeding, pixels failing etc. as it will annoy you in the long run. __________________ If one does not attach himself to people and desire, never shall his heart be broken. But then, does he ever truly live? Life is just too damn short for if's and maybe's

Oct 29, 2010, 05:31 AM	Thread Starter #27
Randomletters ))<>(( Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,418 Rep Power: 54	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV Im probibly going to end up with Westinghouse SK26H630S 26 inch 1080i LCD HDTV (Refurbished) \| Overstock.com He says hes only used it 6 months, says its like new, and Im only paying 150 for it! So I feel like I cant lose with this deal Im getting exactly what I want and still have a few bucks left. ( Money will probably go towards celebratory chicken wings! ) __________________ <----------- Sexy Budget Rig stats to the left.

Oct 29, 2010, 07:13 AM	#28
simonw HardwareHeaven Addict Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: HK Posts: 312 Rep Power: 43 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV I wasn't able to find the full specs on the Westinghouse SK26H630S, but they have a newer 26" model (SK-26H640G) on their website, and the res is still only 1366 x 768. 26″ LCD TV SK-26H640G \| WDE Be careful with that, the cheaper 1080i units will not be able to display 1920x1080.

Oct 29, 2010, 10:22 AM	#30
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,465 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	Re: Which would you prefer for full time use, 27" or 32" PC Monitor/TV I haven't seen a screen advertised as 1080i (not p) and be able to accurately show proper 1920x1080. Usually they go at 1366x768 or 1650x1050 or something other, but not full HD. If you want 1920x1080, get a FULL HD one with 1080p not 1080i __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*