DH Review: Radeon HD2900XT (Asus and Sapphire)

kulmegil · May 14, 2007, 09:58 PM

I'm looking at this review... and although ATI doesn't look winner it's not that bad. The differances aren't that big and there are a few points where ati is ahead

Clearly better pricing and taking some time to improve might help (personally I don't really see the reason to rush shopping).

Anyway since I lost my entire beatiful rig (ecxept for monitor, keyboard and such - got it stolen damn it) I had a silent hope for a card competition – hope the review won't scare ATI away from dropping some card from time to time

Da_Jewish_Fonzy · May 14, 2007, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brutusmaximus

one sale to the dude in the batman suit I think. well at least the $400 will help driver development.

lmao

I'm an ATI fanboy but geez I know how to recognize performance numbers, price and power consumption. I might switch to Nvidia based solely upon the posts of other ATI fans. Face it people ATI fucked up.

mike2h · May 14, 2007, 11:39 PM

thx for great review & good work guys!
anybody that buys an rx600 before die shrink is an idiot imo. that should clear up some issues plus give them a little time t odo another 1900 'fix'.
unless they just screwed the pooch i would not hold my breath on the wonder drivers saving the day. taking the delay into account they have had more than enough time t ocome out with a 'good' set of drivers.
i beleive ati has something else coming down the pipe, as this rollout is going to do some harm to the companies bottom line. they nedded a gpu that beat nv silly & be in similar price range to justify yet another delayed release. so far that aint happening. wich is why i think this release is a stepping stone to their 'real' release. that or ati/amd is turning into an 'also ran' company. wich is something i definetly dont want to see again.

X1800XTTOP · May 15, 2007, 12:15 AM

Well i wouldnt go as far as calling people idiots. Some (few, like me) are without any gpu at all and waiting 2 months (or whatever) is not an option.

Besides, the HD2900XT shows that in some places it actually even outperforms an 8800GTX (e.g. the dx10 tests in call of juarez, and oblivion). And, at least in sweden, the price is after all almost below the GTS640mb model.

Im not saying the HD2900 is without problems, its just that i dont think its 'idiotic' as such to buy this card, as i do believe drivers will yeild big performance increases. I bought my X1800 as soon as possible - with 2-3 drivers released i got 3-40% increases in all games and about 600points (from 4400 to 5100). Eg. the X1800 went from trying to beat the 7800GTX256 to actually beat the 7800GTX512 (as seen in one driverheaven review).

And the x1800 was late aswell, so there is still a chance that the hd2900 might end up close to an GTX and at this price, that is great non-the-less. Of course this is just speculating, but im saying that it isnt possible, its happend before. And i doubt ATi will leave the HD2900XT perform less than a X1950XTX.

Asmoday · May 15, 2007, 12:19 AM

I for one won't run out picking one up thats for sure.

Sonata · May 15, 2007, 12:48 AM

Sounds like something is up with the drivers. Image quality should be superior, but I still wouldn't buy a HD2900 due to noise and power consumption (a die shrink and a different cooler might fix this). At least they ATI/AMD have released a new vid card, all that remains now is to hopefully improve upon it. I would have liked to see an actual rating from DriverHeaven for this card, even if it was something like negative infinity.

caqde · May 15, 2007, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Sounds like something is up with the drivers. Image quality should be superior, but I still wouldn't buy a HD2900 due to noise and power consumption (a die shrink and a different cooler might fix this). At least they ATI/AMD have released a new vid card, all that remains now is to hopefully improve upon it. I would have liked to see an actual rating from DriverHeaven for this card, even if it was something like negative infinity.

Well with AMD owning ATI I hope future ATI cards will implement some of their power saving features and be more power efficient while still being fast. Think HD2950XT with seperate power plains (cool and quiet barcelona style) + 65nm

NAZ2222 · May 15, 2007, 01:15 AM

I'm aiming more for the XL or Pro model!!

**kris23** · May 15, 2007, 02:20 AM

you know, this card...on paper....looks like it will be able to top everything around if the drivers were just designed specifically for that card. i might actually get one if someone like Gigabyte stick some fancy silent cooler on it.......

that is....if i build anytime soon. but i will mostlikely builld at Christmas time.

ChaosMinionX · May 15, 2007, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asmoday

I for one won't run out picking one up thats for sure.

Yep, lets hope Q3 has a light at the end of the 9month waiting road.......

*cough R650*

EDIT: Im really at a loss for a video card atm...

Do I continue to play the ATI waiting game in hopes that Q3 brings something that brings Nvidia to its knees as well as outperforms the X2900XT by a large margin? Granted thats what everyone said, myself included about the R600 that it was going to be the card to have.....Or I could buy a 8800GTX, since the only real games out for now are DX9 titles.....And the fact that I will probably have to upgrade in a year or so with new DX10 titles surpassing the capabilities of the R600/G80.....Is anyone else in this same predicament?

Vampyromaniac · May 15, 2007, 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Necrosis

Joy, I love reading fan boy remarks on release day.

You don't see the truth!!

Nvidiaheaven!!! Nvidiaheaven!!!

|2A|N · May 15, 2007, 06:40 AM

The extra power consumption is enough to turn me off the card without seing any benchmarks, sorry but i will stick with my MSI 8600GTS OC it does just fine for me in all my games.

BWX · May 15, 2007, 12:35 PM

Wow, Nvidia is STOMPING ATI/AMD (whatever they are)... Looks like My next card will be the next Nvidia card.

me972 · May 15, 2007, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brutusmaximus

So, the card is slower than a 8800 GTS, has less memory, a higher power consumption (215w!) and costs £30-£40 more while needing awkward power connectors?

Ouch indeed.

I second the OUCH!! sounds so sad... but I hope AMD manages to get back on the hores so the prices go down for all of us.. cause Nvidia likes high prices when shes up there all alone..

and If this goes on.. I might have to buy my new rig with Nvidia!!!!

***Veridian3*** · May 15, 2007, 12:42 PM

Quick comment on DX10 benchmarks...

COJ/lost planet are being pushed out by ATI/Nvidia. One currently favours one company... the other favours the other company... amazingly each favours the company who is "promoting" it.

This isnt a design issue on which card is better. In the case of these 2 "demos" its a PR stunt on both sides where they know there are issues to be resolved by each driver team.

JohnDoe47 · May 15, 2007, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brutusmaximus

So let me get this clear, you are calling me stupid, then stating that you want a review up on the 14th of May 2007 on a well respected tech site to use Nvidia drivers of say September 2006 while ATI drivers in the testing should be those posted today? Do I really need to explain in a post why this is utterly useless to anyone except Michael J Fox?

You cannot "balance" hardware and drivers that enthusiasts can use today by forcing those on nvidia cards to run 9-12 month old drivers. This is ridiculous and I hope if you get your head out of your a$$ and think about it you will come back and say "you know, im talking crap, sorry guys".

Let's quote a theorectical scenario here. Guy walks into a store.

Guy "i would like to purchase a video card please for £250".
Salesman "sure sir, would you like this Nvidia GTS or the new Radeon 2900?"
Guy "erm, im not sure, which is faster?"
Salesman "the GTS, well apart from 3dmark that is"
Guy "ok so is 3dmark a game?"
Salesman "no its a benchmark to see how fast your graphics card is"
Guy "ok when you say faster, do you mean it shows how much faster it is in every game I will buy?"
Salesman "no, not at all, in fact quite the opposite is true"
Guy **stratches head** "ok, so what about noise levels I like to watch HD movies"
Salesman "Well the 2900 is pretty loud will that annoy you?"
Guy "yeah I guess it would, what about my power supply, its only a 350w?"
Salesman "well the 2900 will use about 200 of that on its own."
Guy "well really this is a no brainer, is the GTS more expensive?"
Salesman "no its about the same price but I don't recommend you buy it"
Guy "why? what you have told me the GTS is a superior card"
Salesman "yes but you should run nvidia drivers from September of 2006 to make it fairer"
Guy "dude wtf are you smoking, why?"
Salesman "I don't know really, I read on the net that some guys on forums said that to make it fairer, you should run year old drivers on the GTS, then performance should be closer".

Guy walks out of store and goes to purchase a shotgun.

yeh alrite brain surgeon, find me a quote somewhere where i called you stupid? hmm...no didn't think so. talk about write up a story that nobody is going to read. How many books have you made so far geek?

Zardon · May 15, 2007, 03:00 PM

Guys, do you think we could keep this on track please, a few of these posts are more personal bickering rather than discussing the product.

Has anyone ordered the card yet? id love to hear some personal views from our members experience with the hardware.

X1800XTTOP · May 15, 2007, 05:32 PM

Ive ordered mine, and hopefully ill get it tomorrow or something. It ended up cheaper than i thought, so i am basiclygetting this card for "free" (still have to pay a little myself) and that for breaking my first card.

I do hope that someone releases some quiet cooling for this card because i think i´ll be needing that. My TOP was dead silent, in 2d and 3d (the fan was made to run 100% in both 2d and 3d so..). And judging by the review here, and on many other places - this thing is LOUD.

Anyone know if any thirdparty cooling will be released anytime soon? I havent heard anything but Sapphire releasing a TOXIC (watercooling) version of the card - but i want to stick to aircooling.

Hopefully ill be able to post some impressions here pretty soon.

GeneralClaymore · May 15, 2007, 05:44 PM

Give it time, they need to work on there drivers for the card. oncve they get the drivers right it should run better then what it is now.

just give it a month or 2 for the drivers to have the problems iron out.

Judas · May 15, 2007, 06:43 PM

i could care less about what a card gets in 3dmark... However, it's worth noting that 3Dmark probably (well recently) follows the DirectX guidelines to the tee, so long as any other games don't break the rules, they should see the same/similare result.. unfortunely i've yet to see this really come true.

Either way you look at it, i can't see the drivers NOT being mature, but missing critical MAJOR features, performing overall the poorly, drawing that MUCH power, i'd have to say that the Silon revision they decided to go with wasn't ready, shouldn't have been used.

However, i'd be thoroughly interested to see how well a fully DX10 compliant game reacts to the hardware, until i see that, i'll be sitting on the fence for awhile for sure.

Maybe AMD can pull a fast one, try and move these models out ASAP, then get the refresh out perhaps by mid summer start of fall..... and the refresh better then hell fix some serious issues.

Judas · May 15, 2007, 06:47 PM

btw..

while drivers could seriously improve, i don't think that anyone should hold thier breath..

cozumel · May 15, 2007, 08:07 PM

Quite an interesting thread below on the 2900XT fps rate comparing old and updated drivers with oblivion and fear.

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33890940

Vengeance · May 15, 2007, 08:32 PM

I have to give kudos to DH for this review! I will say I never thought I would see the day!

Judas · May 15, 2007, 08:34 PM

those are indeed interesting

ronnn · May 16, 2007, 03:37 AM

Ati seems to be having problems with aa. If driver problem, this card will rock - if hardware issue - will take a refresh to fix it. Strange how it tends to beat the 8800 line at 2560 x 1600, not sure what that means. Maybe driver bug by nv. Either way this card will likely best the 640mb gts as drivers mature. So is more effiicient with memory, but less efficient with power. I think this review was somewhat limited and well off the mark, but enjoyable reading non-the-less.

**kris23** · May 16, 2007, 05:18 AM

you know.....i said i would laugh so hard if the nVidia 8 series cards took a crap on the HD 2900XTs......

but now i feel sad, lol they company spent so much time and money to work out kinks, and the card is absolute junk after all that. massive heat output, crappy drivers, high power consumption, loud, use of 8 pin connectors, and overpriced.

but those updated drivers seem like a ray of hope for the cards and company, and card owners.....

ARE THERE ANY ADVANTAGES AT ALL TO THESE CARDS? video playback, HDCP support, general features? some that might make them worth buying?
can HDCP run on 2560x1600 displays?

ChaosMinionX · May 16, 2007, 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kris23

you know.....i said i would laugh so hard if the nVidia 8 series cards took a crap on the HD 2900XTs......

but now i feel sad, lol they company spent so much time and money to work out kinks, and the card is absolute junk after all that. massive heat output, crappy drivers, high power consumption, loud, use of 8 pin connectors, and overpriced.

but those updated drivers seem like a ray of hope for the cards and company, and card owners.....

ARE THERE ANY ADVANTAGES AT ALL TO THESE CARDS? video playback, HDCP support, general features? some that might make them worth buying?
can HDCP run on 2560x1600 displays?

Well your 3dMarks will be heavily optimized

Vampyromaniac · May 16, 2007, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ronnn

Ati seems to be having problems with aa. If driver problem, this card will rock - if hardware issue - will take a refresh to fix it.

R600's AA runs differently than G80's due to a different hardware implementation, so no software fix unfortunately.

Having looked at a few reviews now, I'll be getting a 320MB GTS. Firstly, there's no ATI model in the $300 range (big gap in the line-up from $200 to $400.) Then looking at the power and performance of the 2900XT, it's hard to imagine that when ATI does have a $300 part, that it would be better than the 320MB GTS in either performance or power... and definitely not in both! And finally I'm in the market now, not in who-knows-how-long till they have a $300 part.

JohnDoe47 · May 16, 2007, 02:05 PM

I already know that the mid-range x2xxx series will be based on pci-e 2.0 but will this version be?

riles9262 · May 16, 2007, 05:45 PM

I think that there's a lot of potential in this new line. Lots of power and some nice new features, and I think the card is far from tapped. However, it definitely needs a revision or two. I hope that the (upper) midrange cards perform well, since if done right there is quite a performance hole that they could fill.

Nice review too, thanks dh.

May 14, 2007, 09:58 PM	#61
kulmegil DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 65 Rep Power: 0	I'm looking at this review... and although ATI doesn't look winner it's not that bad. The differances aren't that big and there are a few points where ati is ahead Clearly better pricing and taking some time to improve might help (personally I don't really see the reason to rush shopping). Anyway since I lost my entire beatiful rig (ecxept for monitor, keyboard and such - got it stolen damn it) I had a silent hope for a card competition – hope the review won't scare ATI away from dropping some card from time to time __________________ life goes on...

May 14, 2007, 11:39 PM	#63
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 89 System Specs	thx for great review & good work guys! anybody that buys an rx600 before die shrink is an idiot imo. that should clear up some issues plus give them a little time t odo another 1900 'fix'. unless they just screwed the pooch i would not hold my breath on the wonder drivers saving the day. taking the delay into account they have had more than enough time t ocome out with a 'good' set of drivers. i beleive ati has something else coming down the pipe, as this rollout is going to do some harm to the companies bottom line. they nedded a gpu that beat nv silly & be in similar price range to justify yet another delayed release. so far that aint happening. wich is why i think this release is a stepping stone to their 'real' release. that or ati/amd is turning into an 'also ran' company. wich is something i definetly dont want to see again. __________________

May 15, 2007, 01:15 AM	#68
NAZ2222 HardwareHeaven Addict Join Date: May 2005 Location: Portugal Posts: 396 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	I'm aiming more for the XL or Pro model!! __________________ Why do we fall? So that we learn how to pick our self's up.

May 15, 2007, 02:20 AM	#69
kris23 Going Insane..... Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 5,990 Rep Power: 121 System Specs	you know, this card...on paper....looks like it will be able to top everything around if the drivers were just designed specifically for that card. i might actually get one if someone like Gigabyte stick some fancy silent cooler on it....... that is....if i build anytime soon. but i will mostlikely builld at Christmas time. __________________ Hardwareheaven Super-Moderator Building a new computer system and not sure where to start? Click Here! last updated (5/18/11) Rosewill FUTURE case replaces CM 690 II with its greater interior length. Building a PC: Step by Step Guide Written by Kristopher Pedemonte and Nathan Marks-Forder Edited by Allan Campbell Questions or Comments? feel free to post them in the forums!

May 15, 2007, 12:35 PM	#73
BWX unplugged Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: USNY Posts: 19,665 Rep Power: 109 System Specs	Wow, Nvidia is STOMPING ATI/AMD (whatever they are)... Looks like My next card will be the next Nvidia card. __________________

May 15, 2007, 12:15 AM	#64
X1800XTTOP DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 316 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Well i wouldnt go as far as calling people idiots. Some (few, like me) are without any gpu at all and waiting 2 months (or whatever) is not an option. Besides, the HD2900XT shows that in some places it actually even outperforms an 8800GTX (e.g. the dx10 tests in call of juarez, and oblivion). And, at least in sweden, the price is after all almost below the GTS640mb model. Im not saying the HD2900 is without problems, its just that i dont think its 'idiotic' as such to buy this card, as i do believe drivers will yeild big performance increases. I bought my X1800 as soon as possible - with 2-3 drivers released i got 3-40% increases in all games and about 600points (from 4400 to 5100). Eg. the X1800 went from trying to beat the 7800GTX256 to actually beat the 7800GTX512 (as seen in one driverheaven review). And the x1800 was late aswell, so there is still a chance that the hd2900 might end up close to an GTX and at this price, that is great non-the-less. Of course this is just speculating, but im saying that it isnt possible, its happend before. And i doubt ATi will leave the HD2900XT perform less than a X1950XTX.

May 15, 2007, 12:19 AM	#65
Asmoday Demonic Join Date: May 2002 Location: In the cold, dark north... Posts: 5,198 Rep Power: 90 System Specs	I for one won't run out picking one up thats for sure.

May 15, 2007, 12:48 AM	#66
Sonata DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Hot as hell in summer Posts: 284 Rep Power: 0	Sounds like something is up with the drivers. Image quality should be superior, but I still wouldn't buy a HD2900 due to noise and power consumption (a die shrink and a different cooler might fix this). At least they ATI/AMD have released a new vid card, all that remains now is to hopefully improve upon it. I would have liked to see an actual rating from DriverHeaven for this card, even if it was something like negative infinity.

May 15, 2007, 06:40 AM	#72
\|2A\|N SE7EN57 Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 353 Rep Power: 71 System Specs	The extra power consumption is enough to turn me off the card without seing any benchmarks, sorry but i will stick with my MSI 8600GTS OC it does just fine for me in all my games.

May 15, 2007, 12:42 PM	#75
*Veridian3* Administrator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Cloaked Posts: 4,834 Rep Power: 174	Quick comment on DX10 benchmarks... COJ/lost planet are being pushed out by ATI/Nvidia. One currently favours one company... the other favours the other company... amazingly each favours the company who is "promoting" it. This isnt a design issue on which card is better. In the case of these 2 "demos" its a PR stunt on both sides where they know there are issues to be resolved by each driver team.

May 15, 2007, 03:00 PM	Thread Starter #77
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 177	Guys, do you think we could keep this on track please, a few of these posts are more personal bickering rather than discussing the product. Has anyone ordered the card yet? id love to hear some personal views from our members experience with the hardware.

May 15, 2007, 05:32 PM	#78
X1800XTTOP DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 316 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Ive ordered mine, and hopefully ill get it tomorrow or something. It ended up cheaper than i thought, so i am basiclygetting this card for "free" (still have to pay a little myself) and that for breaking my first card. I do hope that someone releases some quiet cooling for this card because i think i´ll be needing that. My TOP was dead silent, in 2d and 3d (the fan was made to run 100% in both 2d and 3d so..). And judging by the review here, and on many other places - this thing is LOUD. Anyone know if any thirdparty cooling will be released anytime soon? I havent heard anything but Sapphire releasing a TOXIC (watercooling) version of the card - but i want to stick to aircooling. Hopefully ill be able to post some impressions here pretty soon.

May 15, 2007, 05:44 PM	#79
GeneralClaymore HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: MI Posts: 431 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Give it time, they need to work on there drivers for the card. oncve they get the drivers right it should run better then what it is now. just give it a month or 2 for the drivers to have the problems iron out. __________________ Source: x-fi titanium hd 2x LME49720NA + 2x LME49710NA > Fiio E9(OPA2111AM)> DT880 pro 250ohm

May 15, 2007, 08:07 PM	#82
cozumel I'm dangerous but cute... Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Under the waves... Posts: 3,577 Rep Power: 58 System Specs	Quite an interesting thread below on the 2900XT fps rate comparing old and updated drivers with oblivion and fear. http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33890940 __________________ Don't worry about money - Be a beach bum! Scuba Rocks Last edited by cozumel; May 15, 2007 at 08:15 PM.

May 15, 2007, 08:32 PM	#83
Vengeance DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Fort Worth TX Posts: 643 Rep Power: 0	I have to give kudos to DH for this review! I will say I never thought I would see the day! __________________ [color=red]Rage3D Super Moderator[/color] [color=red]BFG 6800 GT [/color]

May 16, 2007, 03:37 AM	#85
ronnn DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 617 Rep Power: 0	Ati seems to be having problems with aa. If driver problem, this card will rock - if hardware issue - will take a refresh to fix it. Strange how it tends to beat the 8800 line at 2560 x 1600, not sure what that means. Maybe driver bug by nv. Either way this card will likely best the 640mb gts as drivers mature. So is more effiicient with memory, but less efficient with power. I think this review was somewhat limited and well off the mark, but enjoyable reading non-the-less.

May 16, 2007, 05:18 AM	#86
kris23 Going Insane..... Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 5,990 Rep Power: 121 System Specs	you know.....i said i would laugh so hard if the nVidia 8 series cards took a crap on the HD 2900XTs...... but now i feel sad, lol they company spent so much time and money to work out kinks, and the card is absolute junk after all that. massive heat output, crappy drivers, high power consumption, loud, use of 8 pin connectors, and overpriced. but those updated drivers seem like a ray of hope for the cards and company, and card owners..... ARE THERE ANY ADVANTAGES AT ALL TO THESE CARDS? video playback, HDCP support, general features? some that might make them worth buying? can HDCP run on 2560x1600 displays? __________________ Hardwareheaven Super-Moderator Building a new computer system and not sure where to start? Click Here! last updated (5/18/11) Rosewill FUTURE case replaces CM 690 II with its greater interior length. Building a PC: Step by Step Guide Written by Kristopher Pedemonte and Nathan Marks-Forder Edited by Allan Campbell Questions or Comments? feel free to post them in the forums!

May 16, 2007, 02:05 PM	#89
JohnDoe47 HardwareHeaven Addict Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 319 Rep Power: 0	I already know that the mid-range x2xxx series will be based on pci-e 2.0 but will this version be?

May 16, 2007, 05:45 PM	#90
riles9262 Driverheaven brewmaster Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 4,842 Rep Power: 70 System Specs	I think that there's a lot of potential in this new line. Lots of power and some nice new features, and I think the card is far from tapped. However, it definitely needs a revision or two. I hope that the (upper) midrange cards perform well, since if done right there is quite a performance hole that they could fill. Nice review too, thanks dh. __________________ A beer a day keeps the doctor away.