Skulltrail - XFX GTX 280 XXX 3-Way SLi /4870X2 CFx

Zardon · Aug 17, 2008, 11:02 AM

Read the article Here
_________________________

Even though comparisons will be made, our intention is not to directly compare ATI against Nvidia in this article, but more to see how both leading ultimate solutions will run on a system which should in theory be less CPU bound than most. To further downplay the side effects of the two Quad processors affecting the results, we have watercooled both CPU's and overclocked them to 4.4ghz (a 1.2ghz overclock @ 400x11). This will let both graphics solutions stretch their legs as much as possible at the highest resolutions.

Liqourice · Aug 17, 2008, 11:13 AM

First notice.

How can the AVG be higher than the MAX?

Race Driver and WIC

Zardon · Aug 17, 2008, 11:39 AM

it cant be, they are transposed in flash, ill correct that. sorry, long night !

Chaos · Aug 17, 2008, 11:58 AM

interesting read Z, i guess the beta bios and drivers from Nvidia came a long way since i thought that SLI with the 280 was not doable until recently on Skulltrail

Zardon · Aug 17, 2008, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaos

interesting read Z, i guess the beta bios and drivers from Nvidia came a long way since i thought that SLI with the 280 was not doable until recently on Skulltrail

Yeah. the good thing is, the bios was just released publically as well, which should help the.... erm.... 30 people who have it ?

Both solutions work well really considering the limited market Skulltrail has. The cost really is hard to justify overall however. a really high end Quad core enthusiast system overclocked is much better value for money. Still I thought it was intereresting to tackle.

BlueMak · Aug 17, 2008, 12:42 PM

Very interesting and a tough choise to make, if you have the money. Go for the ATI cards that have way too high temperatures to feel comfortable, or go for the Nvidia cards that though can run cooler they recently have some bad rep regarding how the handle heat.
I wonder if the fans on the ATI cards actualy run at 100% at any point.

The system looks like the best reason to get watercooling even without any overclocking.

It also shows, in my view, how bad Crysis is. By bad i don't mean good.

Good review once again.

Zardon · Aug 17, 2008, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueMak

I wonder if the fans on the ATI cards actualy run at 100% at any point.

Actually we have been in talks with ATI about the poor fan management (ask Spyre). The tool I linked on the last page allows for manual fan adjustments and its a wise idea to crank the fans a little to lower the temps.

Alex · Aug 17, 2008, 01:23 PM

I am well impressed with both sets of results. Not sure any average joe could afford either, although ive read on a few forums that the people who want skulltrail cant even get the motherboards or processors anyway.

macbiter · Aug 17, 2008, 01:33 PM

I would love this system. I cant get the motherboard or processors anywhere. the graphics cards are easy enough. ive been trying to get skulltrail for months now

**kris23** · Aug 17, 2008, 05:47 PM

so you DID get it out today, sweet....

**kris23** · Aug 17, 2008, 05:54 PM

holy lord Jesus thats alot of FPS......

Resurrection · Aug 17, 2008, 06:36 PM

Dear Zardon,

Would you consider lifting your multi-GPU-testing-skirts and giving us a gander at some of the saucy data underneath ?

Specifically, I was wondering if there is a graph [COLOR=orange](uber-Zardon-Flash-enabled or regular JPG)[/COLOR]...

...which shows the scalability of moving from 1 to 2 to 3 to 4 ATI 4870 Cores...

...and - separately - the same thing for 1-2-3 GTX cores

That'd REALLY be the kind of authoratative 'should we shouldn't we' upgrade info for many customer - and we'd luv ya for it

Zardon · Aug 17, 2008, 06:42 PM

Ah what I would do with another 24 hours everyday

Good idea just not feasible on a time basis right now. maybe one for a future project........ although I hear Intel are bringing out something new *cough* and smokin shortly so maybe best waiting for that .........

DJ BIG T · Aug 17, 2008, 06:55 PM

good work z!!!! i wish i could get me a skulltrail but couldnt afford that..

Necrosis · Aug 17, 2008, 07:03 PM

Imagine a tri 280 x2 setup!

RobertBruce · Aug 17, 2008, 10:05 PM

Jesus that is freakin amazing. The requirement for buffered memory is just strange. You'd think they'd KNOW that'll slow down everything else.

humonous · Aug 17, 2008, 11:27 PM

I just knew before I went into this review that I was going to hate it, but not quite as much as I ended up hating it

I feel humbled, I just managed to get my system running crysis at 1290x960 at all high settings, I read this and this system is hammering mine at 1920x1200 all very high.

Yeah, we can all justify the cost, and say "wow I wouldnt pay that", but you know if I had a few grand burning a hole in my pocket I would. Thats how much I love my games.

LukeK · Aug 17, 2008, 11:29 PM

A few grand? lol, the processors in that system ALONE are a few grand. then another £400 for the motherboard, £600 for the ram, £600 for the hard drives, £1100 for the graphics cards, £130 for the PSU, £300 for the watercooling.

Yeah its a few grand alright, just not maybe the 2k you were thinking

humonous · Aug 17, 2008, 11:41 PM

**kris23** · Aug 17, 2008, 11:43 PM

you can always use Xeons in skulltrail...

Nutlink · Aug 18, 2008, 04:14 AM

I'd like to make a minor correction on this. On the page about GRAW 2, it states that "The Unreal 3 engine is normally capped to approximately 62/63 frames per second by default, but this is not the case for GRAW 2." It makes it sound like GRAW 2 is powered by UE3, but it is actually powered by the Diesel engine, an in-house engine developed by Grin.

ChaosMinionX · Aug 18, 2008, 04:44 AM

BRILLIANT!

That really took me by surprise... I would of never thought to see someone doing a followup on Skulltrail.

Excellent article, and well done Allan

Zardon · Aug 18, 2008, 10:40 AM

A few people have asked me which power supply we used for this. I only could get one that handled it (I had one die and one just say "no thanks ill pass").

This is the baby - The Corsair HX1000W http://www.hardwareheaven.com/reviews.php?reviewid=592 - passed with flying colours.

Falstaff · Aug 18, 2008, 11:39 AM

I cant wait till the next Skulltrail review.
Can you imagine a DH version of Skull Trail

sammorris · Aug 18, 2008, 12:16 PM

I have one small favour to ask - can you get a 2560x1600 benchmark of Crysis on this? :P

Zardon · Aug 18, 2008, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammorris

I have one small favour to ask - can you get a 2560x1600 benchmark of Crysis on this? :P

Which platform?

Zardon · Aug 18, 2008, 12:40 PM

for those interested, here are 3dmark results for vertex and shader operations.

Firstly 4870 X2 x 2 in CFx

And 280 GTX in Slix3

Zardon · Aug 18, 2008, 01:49 PM

For those of you on tighter budgets, recent pricing updates to Nvidia products (£244 for leadtek GTX280) means that 3 way Sli is now available for around the £750 mark, however the cores will be slower than the XFX XXX models on test today at 602mhz, that said with manual overclocking the performance differential would be lessened.

Leadtek GeForce GTX 280 1024MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) - Retail

sammorris · Aug 18, 2008, 07:44 PM

DX9 all high and if you can DX9 all high with AA - yes, AA at 2560. I'm curious to see if setups like these make it possible.

Zardon · Aug 18, 2008, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sammorris

DX9 all high and if you can DX9 all high with AA - yes, AA at 2560. I'm curious to see if setups like these make it possible.

4870 X2 CFx all very high at 2560, avg around 33, dips into the 10fps zone from time to time.

280 GTX slix3 all very high at 2560 avg around 53 dips into the 28-30fps zone in firefights from time to time.

thats DX10. Slix3 is playable, 4870 X2 cfx isnt really. ATI need to work on optimising for this game. scaling is poor.

Haven't had to chance to try DX9 yet.

Aug 17, 2008, 11:02 AM	#1
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	Skulltrail - XFX GTX 280 XXX 3-Way SLi /4870X2 CFx Read the article Here _________________________ Even though comparisons will be made, our intention is not to directly compare ATI against Nvidia in this article, but more to see how both leading ultimate solutions will run on a system which should in theory be less CPU bound than most. To further downplay the side effects of the two Quad processors affecting the results, we have watercooled both CPU's and overclocked them to 4.4ghz (a 1.2ghz overclock @ 400x11). This will let both graphics solutions stretch their legs as much as possible at the highest resolutions.

Aug 17, 2008, 12:42 PM	#6
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,464 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	Very interesting and a tough choise to make, if you have the money. Go for the ATI cards that have way too high temperatures to feel comfortable, or go for the Nvidia cards that though can run cooler they recently have some bad rep regarding how the handle heat. I wonder if the fans on the ATI cards actualy run at 100% at any point. The system looks like the best reason to get watercooling even without any overclocking. It also shows, in my view, how bad Crysis is. By bad i don't mean good. Good review once again. __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*

Aug 17, 2008, 05:47 PM	#10
kris23 Going Insane..... Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,017 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	so you DID get it out today, sweet.... __________________ Hardwareheaven Super-Moderator Building a new computer system and not sure where to start? Click Here! last updated (5/18/11) Rosewill FUTURE case replaces CM 690 II with its greater interior length. Building a PC: Step by Step Guide Written by Kristopher Pedemonte and Nathan Marks-Forder Edited by Allan Campbell Questions or Comments? feel free to post them in the forums!

Aug 17, 2008, 05:54 PM	#11
kris23 Going Insane..... Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,017 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	holy lord Jesus thats alot of FPS...... __________________ Hardwareheaven Super-Moderator Building a new computer system and not sure where to start? Click Here! last updated (5/18/11) Rosewill FUTURE case replaces CM 690 II with its greater interior length. Building a PC: Step by Step Guide Written by Kristopher Pedemonte and Nathan Marks-Forder Edited by Allan Campbell Questions or Comments? feel free to post them in the forums!

Aug 17, 2008, 06:36 PM	#12
Resurrection DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: London, UK Posts: 10 Rep Power: 0	Dear Zardon, Would you consider lifting your multi-GPU-testing-skirts and giving us a gander at some of the saucy data underneath ? Specifically, I was wondering if there is a graph [COLOR=orange](uber-Zardon-Flash-enabled or regular JPG)[/COLOR]... ...which shows the scalability of moving from 1 to 2 to 3 to 4 ATI 4870 Cores... ...and - separately - the same thing for 1-2-3 GTX cores That'd REALLY be the kind of authoratative 'should we shouldn't we' upgrade info for many customer - and we'd luv ya for it __________________ ____________________________________ If you're in London - during daytime hours - come down to 30 Windmill Street, W1T 2JL and have a look round the TASTIEST TECH SWEETIE STORE inside the M25 !!!

Aug 17, 2008, 11:13 AM	#2
Liqourice HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Stockholm Posts: 1,696 Rep Power: 98 System Specs	First notice. How can the AVG be higher than the MAX? Race Driver and WIC

Aug 17, 2008, 11:39 AM	Thread Starter #3
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	it cant be, they are transposed in flash, ill correct that. sorry, long night !

Aug 17, 2008, 11:58 AM	#4
Chaos Number Nine Join Date: May 2002 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 5,268 Rep Power: 167 System Specs	interesting read Z, i guess the beta bios and drivers from Nvidia came a long way since i thought that SLI with the 280 was not doable until recently on Skulltrail

Aug 17, 2008, 01:23 PM	#8
Alex Driverheaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 260 Rep Power: 45	I am well impressed with both sets of results. Not sure any average joe could afford either, although ive read on a few forums that the people who want skulltrail cant even get the motherboards or processors anyway.

Aug 17, 2008, 01:33 PM	#9
macbiter DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 81 Rep Power: 0	I would love this system. I cant get the motherboard or processors anywhere. the graphics cards are easy enough. ive been trying to get skulltrail for months now

Aug 17, 2008, 06:42 PM	Thread Starter #13
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	Ah what I would do with another 24 hours everyday Good idea just not feasible on a time basis right now. maybe one for a future project........ although I hear Intel are bringing out something new cough and smokin shortly so maybe best waiting for that .........

Aug 17, 2008, 06:55 PM	#14
DJ BIG T DH FaN BoY Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: ORLANDO,FL Posts: 930 Rep Power: 69 System Specs	good work z!!!! i wish i could get me a skulltrail but couldnt afford that.. __________________

Aug 17, 2008, 07:03 PM	#15
Necrosis HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,838 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	Imagine a tri 280 x2 setup!

Aug 17, 2008, 10:05 PM	#16
RobertBruce HardwareHeaven Addict Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 259 Rep Power: 46 System Specs	Jesus that is freakin amazing. The requirement for buffered memory is just strange. You'd think they'd KNOW that'll slow down everything else.

Aug 17, 2008, 11:27 PM	#17
humonous DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 164 Rep Power: 0	I just knew before I went into this review that I was going to hate it, but not quite as much as I ended up hating it I feel humbled, I just managed to get my system running crysis at 1290x960 at all high settings, I read this and this system is hammering mine at 1920x1200 all very high. Yeah, we can all justify the cost, and say "wow I wouldnt pay that", but you know if I had a few grand burning a hole in my pocket I would. Thats how much I love my games.

Aug 18, 2008, 12:16 PM	#25
sammorris HardwareHeaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Brentwood or York, UK Posts: 178 Rep Power: 26 System Specs	I have one small favour to ask - can you get a 2560x1600 benchmark of Crysis on this? :P __________________ Speakers: Logitech Z-2300 & Philips MC-70 [homebrew surround via ATEN CS1782 KVAM] for HTPC. Logitech Z-5500 for gaming PC. I/O: Razer Diamondback Magma, MS Intellimouse Optical, MS Sidewinder X6, Saitek Eclipse II, Pertelian X2040 USB Display DVD: As little as Possible (LG GH20NS15) Networking: Netgear GS105, GS605, GS608, WRN2000, Linksys WRT54GL [Tomato], DrayTek Vigor 120, yards of CAT6

Aug 17, 2008, 11:29 PM	#18
LukeK DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 158 Rep Power: 61	A few grand? lol, the processors in that system ALONE are a few grand. then another £400 for the motherboard, £600 for the ram, £600 for the hard drives, £1100 for the graphics cards, £130 for the PSU, £300 for the watercooling. Yeah its a few grand alright, just not maybe the 2k you were thinking

Aug 17, 2008, 11:41 PM	#19
humonous DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 164 Rep Power: 0

Aug 17, 2008, 11:43 PM	#20
kris23 Going Insane..... Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 6,017 Rep Power: 131 System Specs	you can always use Xeons in skulltrail... __________________ Hardwareheaven Super-Moderator Building a new computer system and not sure where to start? Click Here! last updated (5/18/11) Rosewill FUTURE case replaces CM 690 II with its greater interior length. Building a PC: Step by Step Guide Written by Kristopher Pedemonte and Nathan Marks-Forder Edited by Allan Campbell Questions or Comments? feel free to post them in the forums!

Aug 18, 2008, 04:14 AM	#21
Nutlink DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1 Rep Power: 0	I'd like to make a minor correction on this. On the page about GRAW 2, it states that "The Unreal 3 engine is normally capped to approximately 62/63 frames per second by default, but this is not the case for GRAW 2." It makes it sound like GRAW 2 is powered by UE3, but it is actually powered by the Diesel engine, an in-house engine developed by Grin.

Aug 18, 2008, 04:44 AM	#22
ChaosMinionX USB 3 dot oh Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 1,911 Rep Power: 47 System Specs	BRILLIANT! That really took me by surprise... I would of never thought to see someone doing a followup on Skulltrail. Excellent article, and well done Allan __________________ ::Heatware:: How you can help DriverHeaven by using Digg!

Aug 18, 2008, 10:40 AM	Thread Starter #23
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	A few people have asked me which power supply we used for this. I only could get one that handled it (I had one die and one just say "no thanks ill pass"). This is the baby - The Corsair HX1000W http://www.hardwareheaven.com/reviews.php?reviewid=592 - passed with flying colours.

Aug 18, 2008, 11:39 AM	#24
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	I cant wait till the next Skulltrail review. Can you imagine a DH version of Skull Trail __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Aug 18, 2008, 12:40 PM	Thread Starter #27
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	for those interested, here are 3dmark results for vertex and shader operations. Firstly 4870 X2 x 2 in CFx And 280 GTX in Slix3

Aug 18, 2008, 01:49 PM	Thread Starter #28
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	For those of you on tighter budgets, recent pricing updates to Nvidia products (£244 for leadtek GTX280) means that 3 way Sli is now available for around the £750 mark, however the cores will be slower than the XFX XXX models on test today at 602mhz, that said with manual overclocking the performance differential would be lessened. Leadtek GeForce GTX 280 1024MB GDDR3 TV-Out/Dual DVI (PCI-Express) - Retail

Aug 18, 2008, 07:44 PM	#29
sammorris HardwareHeaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Brentwood or York, UK Posts: 178 Rep Power: 26 System Specs	DX9 all high and if you can DX9 all high with AA - yes, AA at 2560. I'm curious to see if setups like these make it possible. __________________ Speakers: Logitech Z-2300 & Philips MC-70 [homebrew surround via ATEN CS1782 KVAM] for HTPC. Logitech Z-5500 for gaming PC. I/O: Razer Diamondback Magma, MS Intellimouse Optical, MS Sidewinder X6, Saitek Eclipse II, Pertelian X2040 USB Display DVD: As little as Possible (LG GH20NS15) Networking: Netgear GS105, GS605, GS608, WRN2000, Linksys WRT54GL [Tomato], DrayTek Vigor 120, yards of CAT6