nv running a scam?

mike2h · Feb 24, 2009, 07:45 AM

of course you have to take the source into account as they have posted bs before, but...
Nvidia cuts out reviewers for the GTS250 - The Inquirer

Zardon · Feb 24, 2009, 09:24 AM

This is not really worthy of front page and the reasons are that we have a GTS 250 and nvidia have put absolutely no constraints on what we post, how we test it, what games we can use, or the partnering hardware involved.

I am certainly not defending them in any way but I can only state my own findings on this matter. Nvidia are actually very like ATI in regards to reviews and testing. They send us the hardware, get us the drivers and we do everything else. If that ever changed we wouldn't accept the hardware in the first place.

clanman · Feb 24, 2009, 09:28 AM

Thanks for being so open Zardon. I know Kyle at Hardocp posted something really negative about Nvidia and they aren't sending him a 250 now, well so he said on the forums. how do you feel about hardocp posting stuff like that in their forums? Also are you saying that Nvidia have gave no restrictions at all on what you guys can test on the 250 GTS? Surely they give you a set of rules to follow?

Zardon · Feb 24, 2009, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clanman

Thanks for being so open Zardon. I know Kyle at Hardocp posted something really negative about Nvidia and they aren't sending him a 250 now, well so he said on the forums. how do you feel about hardocp posting stuff like that in their forums? Also are you saying that Nvidia have gave no restrictions at all on what you guys can test on the 250 GTS? Surely they give you a set of rules to follow?

I am always open, we are here to service you guys with indepth reviews and unbiased reviews.

Nvidia put no restraints on us and neither do ATI. They phone me to tell us there is a card being released, they organise a sample normally via a partner and we get the card(s), drivers. Thats basically it, we know exactly how to test the hardware and frequently miss NDA's to ensure we cover everything we can.

There really is no story here as far as im concerned and I certainly do not want to start commenting on Hardocp or anyone else. If Nvidia play politics with them well I am sorry to hear it, but they are always extremely ethical in their dealings with us. I can say exactly the same about ATI as well.

Erroneus · Feb 24, 2009, 09:42 AM

Rebranding of older cards is a scam imo :P

brutusmaximus · Feb 24, 2009, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erroneus

Rebranding of older cards is a scam imo :P

Is there some new virus on the net that is giving everyone a dose of niavity lately? ALL companies do this to a certain extent, its how they maximise their money on their products. Even Intel and AMD do it regularly with the CPUS, by cranking the core speed slightly or increasing clock speeds. The 250 GTS uses NEW memory.

This whole thing is being blown out of proportion and is just the latest tirade from charlie D. at the inquirier who without a doubt has a personal issue with nvidia as its all he is writing about and has been for the last year.

Thanks for the info Zardon, this is the only site I trust for honest answers, I gave up on Kyle at hardocp a long time ago, his ego is way too big for him to be honest.

Alex · Feb 24, 2009, 10:02 AM

Good to hear Zardon. I read that sites posting reviews on the 250 GTS are now "up nvidias ass", which I think is ridiculous. I think basically that translates to sites that have been cut off due to egomanical owners. I look forward to the DH review because the card is right in my price range and I hear it has 1gb of ram which will be very useful at high resolutions. I trust this site to be honest and say the card sucks, if it does!

Cow_160483 · Feb 24, 2009, 10:02 AM

Here is what one of the readers thought and i tend to agree with him

Quote:

I quite like these articles to be honest. Its quite amusing seeing Charlie getting his panties in a wad with everything that nvidia do. It all started when Slyvie did a spy cam over Derek Perez's shoulder, then Charlie let rip into everything they do. Whats the most amusing part is that Charlie is actually wrong quite often. With this article however im sure its right, but its the fact that Charlie thinks it is somehow breaking news rather than something that has been going on for years and years from AMD, Nvidia, Intel and every other "corporation" out there. I look forward to reading the reviews because im guessing that while the theory is that sites who will publish are "up nvidias ass" equally so, im guessing those sites don't act like spoilt little girls and start bitching on their own forums about a company and taking it all personally (like Kyle Bennett frequently seems to do). Id rather read reviews on the products from established sites that conduct themselves in a professional manner rather than read the rantings of childish and stupid people like Charlie (and to a lesser extent Kyle). if the product isn't good, then review it, say its not, but you have a responsibility to your readers not your own egos. Grow up

BlueMak · Feb 24, 2009, 10:48 AM

Interesting article. The rebranding of the 9xxx is nothing new, though I am a bit surprised they would do it again with the same cards, IF it is correct that is.

I would also love some, any, FACTS/proof to back the claims, not just about the card, but about the behind the scenes operations. Why isn't there a letter or email anywhere?

Tipstaff · Feb 24, 2009, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brutusmaximus

Is there some new virus on the net that is giving everyone a dose of niavity lately? ALL companies do this to a certain extent, its how they maximise their money on their products. Even Intel and AMD do it regularly with the CPUS, by cranking the core speed slightly or increasing clock speeds. The 250 GTS uses NEW memory.

This is the first time I think I've seen anyone mention this. Certain sites (and I won't name names here) have specifically said that manufacturers were told that nothing is different with the cards except the rebranding, done via the bios. It's then up to manufacturers to produce the cards with their personal branding. Also, Nvidia intends to rebrand the 9800GT to the GTS 240, again with no changes to the card except bios rebranding.

The problem here isn't Nvidias rebranding of cards, it's the way they are doing it, and how much the are charging for it. If it was cheaper people wouldn't be bitching, but the expected price is going to be more than current 9800GT/GTX+ cards. How is that not dirty business? If an LCD manufacturer took a montitor, renamed it, and then sold if for more money based on the premise that it was a new, different monitor just because they changed the name, would that be ok with you? No. We'd be up in arms over it just as we are with this. That's the real issue here.. at least that's the issue I have with them in this case.

humonous · Feb 24, 2009, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tipstaff

This is the first time I think I've seen anyone mention this. Certain sites (and I won't name names here) have specifically said that manufacturers were told that nothing is different with the cards except the rebranding, done via the bios. It's then up to manufacturers to produce the cards with their personal branding. Also, Nvidia intends to rebrand the 9800GT to the GTS 240, again with no changes to the card except bios rebranding.

The problem here isn't Nvidias rebranding of cards, it's the way they are doing it, and how much the are charging for it. If it was cheaper people wouldn't be bitching, but the expected price is going to be more than current 9800GT/GTX+ cards. How is that not dirty business? If an LCD manufacturer took a montitor, renamed it, and then sold if for more money based on the premise that it was a new, different monitor just because they changed the name, would that be ok with you? No. We'd be up in arms over it just as we are with this. That's the real issue here.. at least that's the issue I have with them in this case.

Have you used one? I know you own a store right?

Just curious, im hearing mixed reports on the cards and that the memory is new compared to the 9800 series. I also hear they are cheaper and faster. not sure the big deal here if that is the case. Just shows the power the inquirer have if that is the case to instigate a worldwide scandal and to sucker people into believing everything they say.

Again im not saying this is the case, but it sure looks like a lot of people are commenting on something they don't have actually have in hand.

Zardon · Feb 24, 2009, 12:58 PM

Guys,

Let me clarify this pricing debate and im going on what ive been told by Nvidia and their partners. most of the 1024mb 250 GTS cards are going to be retailing for between 140-150 pounds which is inclusive of vat. When the 9800 GTX was released they were between 180-200 ish and are now around the same price as the 250 GTS, these are for 512mb models bear in mind.

I really am not going into the whole "refreshes are evil" debate mind you, we will address the product and any selling points and shortcomings in our review.

Vikingod · Feb 24, 2009, 01:41 PM

Hey folks, I moved the thread from the submit news forum to here. Good discussion and it's great to get an honest response from Allan. Can't wait for the review.

Erroneus · Feb 24, 2009, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brutusmaximus

ALL companies do this to a certain extent, its how they maximise their money on their products. Even Intel and AMD do it regularly with the CPUS, by cranking the core speed slightly or increasing clock speeds. The 250 GTS uses NEW memory.

Just because everybody does it and it has been done before, does not make it right...

If the cards really are faster and priced at the same level or slighty above, then fine, but if not, then it's only confusing for the enduser.

mike2h · Feb 24, 2009, 06:04 PM

answers to this & other tantalising questions are forthcoming in the upcoming dh review...

actually, z's response was what i was hoping for when i op'd this. figured dh would clear this up for us. the review wiil do just that!

procupine14 · Feb 25, 2009, 07:49 PM

Yeah im very interested about the up and coming review. We shall see what comes withe the new name. ROFL the Inquirer they are some crazy cats.

zxions · Feb 26, 2009, 06:00 AM

I kinda feel sorry for nvidia, remember what happened to all those defected video cards?
NVIDIA says "significant quantities" of laptop GPUs are defective, stock tumbles - Engadget

I'm guessing they're doing whatever they can now just to stay in business...even if it means re-releasing the same products with generally the same tech. ever few months

mike2h · Feb 26, 2009, 07:02 AM

that was quite a while back & they have already abosrbed the cost of that & gone on with their business.

Feb 24, 2009, 07:45 AM	#1
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	nv running a scam? of course you have to take the source into account as they have posted bs before, but... Nvidia cuts out reviewers for the GTS250 - The Inquirer __________________

Feb 24, 2009, 09:24 AM	#2
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	Re: nv running a scam? This is not really worthy of front page and the reasons are that we have a GTS 250 and nvidia have put absolutely no constraints on what we post, how we test it, what games we can use, or the partnering hardware involved. I am certainly not defending them in any way but I can only state my own findings on this matter. Nvidia are actually very like ATI in regards to reviews and testing. They send us the hardware, get us the drivers and we do everything else. If that ever changed we wouldn't accept the hardware in the first place.

Feb 24, 2009, 09:28 AM	#3
clanman DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 152 Rep Power: 33	Re: nv running a scam? Thanks for being so open Zardon. I know Kyle at Hardocp posted something really negative about Nvidia and they aren't sending him a 250 now, well so he said on the forums. how do you feel about hardocp posting stuff like that in their forums? Also are you saying that Nvidia have gave no restrictions at all on what you guys can test on the 250 GTS? Surely they give you a set of rules to follow?

Feb 24, 2009, 09:42 AM	#5
Erroneus Get off my lawn! Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Denmark Posts: 13,417 Rep Power: 119 System Specs	Re: nv running a scam? Rebranding of older cards is a scam imo :P __________________

Feb 24, 2009, 10:02 AM	#7
Alex Driverheaven Lover Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 260 Rep Power: 45	Re: nv running a scam? Good to hear Zardon. I read that sites posting reviews on the 250 GTS are now "up nvidias ass", which I think is ridiculous. I think basically that translates to sites that have been cut off due to egomanical owners. I look forward to the DH review because the card is right in my price range and I hear it has 1gb of ram which will be very useful at high resolutions. I trust this site to be honest and say the card sucks, if it does!

Feb 24, 2009, 10:48 AM	#9
BlueMak HH's Asteroids' Dominator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Hellas->Macedonia->Thessaloniki Posts: 13,465 Rep Power: 349 System Specs	Re: nv running a scam? Interesting article. The rebranding of the 9xxx is nothing new, though I am a bit surprised they would do it again with the same cards, IF it is correct that is. I would also love some, any, FACTS/proof to back the claims, not just about the card, but about the behind the scenes operations. Why isn't there a letter or email anywhere? __________________ The people who are regarded as moral luminaries are those who forego ordinary pleasures themselves and find compensation in interfering with the pleasures of others(Bertrand Russell)"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil,You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them." - Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis This is slavery, not to speak one's thought. [Euripides-The Phoenician Women (c.411-409 B.C.)] http://www.macedonia.info/FALLACIESANDFACTS.htm *Sic semper tyrannis.*

Feb 24, 2009, 12:58 PM	#12
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	Re: nv running a scam? Guys, Let me clarify this pricing debate and im going on what ive been told by Nvidia and their partners. most of the 1024mb 250 GTS cards are going to be retailing for between 140-150 pounds which is inclusive of vat. When the 9800 GTX was released they were between 180-200 ish and are now around the same price as the 250 GTS, these are for 512mb models bear in mind. I really am not going into the whole "refreshes are evil" debate mind you, we will address the product and any selling points and shortcomings in our review.

Feb 24, 2009, 01:41 PM	#13
Vikingod Int'l Fish Liaison Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: By the light of lamp I sit and type... Posts: 16,197 Rep Power: 112 System Specs	Re: nv running a scam? Hey folks, I moved the thread from the submit news forum to here. Good discussion and it's great to get an honest response from Allan. Can't wait for the review.

Feb 24, 2009, 06:04 PM	Thread Starter #15
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	Re: nv running a scam? answers to this & other tantalising questions are forthcoming in the upcoming dh review... actually, z's response was what i was hoping for when i op'd this. figured dh would clear this up for us. the review wiil do just that! __________________

Feb 25, 2009, 07:49 PM	#16
procupine14 Why is it Beeping!?!?! Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: USA, Missouri Posts: 1,400 Rep Power: 58 System Specs	Re: nv running a scam? Yeah im very interested about the up and coming review. We shall see what comes withe the new name. ROFL the Inquirer they are some crazy cats. __________________ HTPC/file server: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit - AMD Phenom x4 9850 - 4GB OCZ DDR2 800 (2x2GB) - 1TB WD Black - 4 x 1TB Hitachi DeskStar in RAID 5 - ATi TV Wonder Digital Cable Tuner - HIS Raedon 4850 512MB - ASRock N68C-S UCC mobo - OCZ ModExtreme Pro 500W PSU GF's Gaming PC: Windows 7 Ultimate 64-bit - AMD Phenom 9850 - 4GB OCZ DDR2 1066 - 500GB Western Digital GP - HIS Raedon 5770 1GB - ASUS M3A78-EM - Zalman 650W PSU Media Streamer: Win 7 Pro 64-bit - AMD Athlon x2 3200+ - 4GB SuperTalent DDR2 800 - 250GB SeaGate Barracuda - MSI K9N6PGM2-V2 - ASUS Raedon 5450 SILENT - FSP group 250W PSU

Feb 26, 2009, 06:00 AM	#17
zxions DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 26 Rep Power: 0	Re: nv running a scam? I kinda feel sorry for nvidia, remember what happened to all those defected video cards? NVIDIA says "significant quantities" of laptop GPUs are defective, stock tumbles - Engadget I'm guessing they're doing whatever they can now just to stay in business...even if it means re-releasing the same products with generally the same tech. ever few months __________________ GA-EP45-DS3L \| Intel C2D E7300 @ 3.39 gHz EVGA Geforece 9800 GTX+ \| OCZ 2x2GB SLI RAM RAIDMAX AURORA 600W \| Rosewill RS605 Vista64 SP1 \| Mac OSX 10.5.5 \| 320GB WD IDE

Feb 26, 2009, 07:02 AM	Thread Starter #18
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	Re: nv running a scam? that was quite a while back & they have already abosrbed the cost of that & gone on with their business. __________________