flame zone forum - removed or not ?

Zardon · Nov 28, 2007, 12:47 PM

ive noticed a drop in posting standards which some people have suggested may very well be due to the fact the flame zone is causing people to get annoyed, tense and to carry over "hard feelings" into other forum sections.

The flame zone was intended to let members vent, and to clear the air, while leaving the rest of the forum free from "crap."

clearly this principle which has worked reasonably effectively in the past may no longer be viable.

So shall I remove it or not ?

Reckless187 · Nov 28, 2007, 01:01 PM

No! Don't remove it! Most of the mature members know that whats said in FWZ stays in the FWZ & is nothing personal. If someone is seen to carry things over into other forums then they should be punished rather than the forum being closed down. As long as there is no racism or anything too over the top then it's all good. Saying that though, If I have or do in future upset someone I can be man enough to make an apology. I have nothing personal against any member here & anything I post in the FWZ is intended as a bit of harmless fun. I think this only startedcos of the best flamer comp tbh.

mkk · Nov 28, 2007, 01:46 PM

I wouldn't miss it but perhaps the flame zone could simply use a vacation. Like being turned off now "for the holidays" and then being evaluated for coming back up next year.

Brutality · Nov 28, 2007, 01:54 PM

It will stay

OldBuzzard · Nov 28, 2007, 02:28 PM

I've always enjoyed the FWZ, and have tried to be somewhat original and entertaining in there. It's all a game to me, and I'd miss it a bit, but that wouldn't keep me visiting DH for all the other forums.

I voted to keep it, but in the end it's your call.

Maybe you could have some sort of popup appear when folks enter the FWZ reminding them that whatever happens there stays there, and that if they are easily offended that maybe they better not enter?

cozumel · Nov 28, 2007, 02:40 PM

I also voted for FWZ to remain. The worst thing in my opinion would be for the rules to be changed where you can't say what you like anymore. It would be like other forums where there is censorship.

Still, if the current 'state of play' is causing an excessive amount amount of problems to the admin and mods then maybe it should go. It would just be a sad reflection on DH members abilty to act responsibly if that was to happen.

YAYitsAndrew · Nov 28, 2007, 03:11 PM

I don't think there's a problem with the FWZ idea itself, but I tend to notice that the people who do most of their posting there (and religious/political debate) are asshats outside as well. It kinda needs to be a sideroom that you go to, not a main attraction.

I know of a couple FWZ heavy members that I think ill of when they post in outside forums (because I think they're purposely trying to start something) but I keep it to myself out of respect for FWZ. It's hard to believe that "what happens in FWZ stays in FWZ" is really true when I have those feelings. I don't think it's possible to truly separate the area like that, but with discipline we can respect the division.

**Mousey** · Nov 28, 2007, 03:24 PM

The FWZ Is one of those awful grey areas i'm afraid to agree.

What's said in the FWZ Can't be held against anyone since it is basically a slanging forum, but threads that are posted in there often get taken too far and they start getting too personal. I'm not sensitive to being called names, you could walk right up to me and call me a cunt and i'd probably just raise one eyebrow and walk away but when people start getting personal and using things i might have opened up to them against me it really hurts my feelings.

That's why i'm afraid to open up to anyone, i'm probably afraid of being let down by somebody i put faith into. In fact i was reluctant to post my pk progression vid but i did anyway.
Perhaps we could give the FWZ A trial with more staff watching what goes on or some stricter rules?

Depends on my mood what's said by me in there really, most of the time it's just light hearted but yeah, things definately get out of hand in there.

cozumel · Nov 28, 2007, 03:32 PM

Just one other thing about posting standards (seperate from FWZ).

I personally don't agree with people using profanities on any of the forums except FWZ. I just don't think it is right. There may be a young person coming to the news forum where their is sometimes bad language or a support thread etc. I'm just suggesting a degree of self-censorship when making posts.

This is just my opinion and does not reflect on any members or DriverHeaven which continues to be the top tech site on the planet.

Vikingod · Nov 28, 2007, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldBuzzard

I've always enjoyed the FWZ, and have tried to be somewhat original and entertaining in there. It's all a game to me, and I'd miss it a bit, but that wouldn't keep me visiting DH for all the other forums.

I voted to keep it, but in the end it's your call.

Maybe you could have some sort of popup appear when folks enter the FWZ reminding them that whatever happens there stays there, and that if they are easily offended that maybe they better not enter?

I agree with Buzzard. I don't personally spend time there, but its good for a laugh every once in a while. I wouldn't probably even notice if it was gone though.

It's sad that some people take it seriously, and if it's really causing you grief, then get rid of it. Honestly, if there are people here just for the FWZ, they are probably not the type of person you'd want as members anyway.

Zardon · Nov 28, 2007, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cozumel

I personally don't agree with people using profanities on any of the forums except FWZ. I just don't think it is right. There may be a young person coming to the news forum where their is sometimes bad language or a support thread etc. I'm just suggesting a degree of self-censorship when making posts.

I agree, and I don't like swear filters, which is why it is turned off on DH. That said, I would expect people to behave properly in the forums without someone standing over their shoulder all the time. I am not going to moderate swearing, however if a user is excessive in foul language then report it.

We have a "no swearing in thread titles" rule, I wouldn't like to get anymore strict with it, otherwise the forum will feel very restrictive.

I want everyone on DH feeling free from heavy handed moderators.

**Mousey** · Nov 28, 2007, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zardon

I agree, and I don't like swear filters, which is why it is turned off on DH. That said, I would expect people to behave properly in the forums without someone standing over their shoulder all the time. I am not going to moderate swearing, however if a user is excessive in foul language then report it.

We have a "no swearing in thread titles" rule, I wouldn't like to get anymore strict with it, otherwise the forum will feel very restrictive.

I want everyone on DH feeling free from heavy handed moderators.

I don't swear constantly (unless i'm in an extremely foul mood) but i do sometimes run out of things to say so i substitute with a swear word

And yeah, they do slip out of my mouth sometimes, so it isn't just a typing thing eitheir

OmegaRED · Nov 28, 2007, 04:09 PM

If you can't stand the heat get out of the flame zone!

It's really that simple. What is slightly more difficult is dealing with the members who are dedicated flamers and only visit DH for that one section. Some people find it hard to treat them as normal member when the flamer starts posting outside of the FMZ.

It irked me that one of the big flamers on DH got muzzled because some members couldn't use the willpower to keep themselves out of the flame zone and they got upset by him. What did you expect, hugs and kisses? Don't visit that section unless you're up for some fun and don't let it get to you.

Asmoday · Nov 28, 2007, 04:13 PM

Agrees with Viking and 'buzzard...I almost never post in there but its good for a laugh now and then. I say keep it.

Billy Toaster · Nov 28, 2007, 04:53 PM

I say remove it. The original idea for the forum was great, with a no holds barred section to insult everyone in a witty way, it has turned into a forum for old and retarded people, apart from me of course. Either that or you rename it to "the slightly moist zone, free cookies and milk with every post".

Tinkerhell · Nov 28, 2007, 05:25 PM

I almost never go in unless I'm really bored or some other thread prompts me to want to post something harsher than is appropriate under a different section. I certainly wouldn't miss it. Course if it stays I wouldn't care much either. Guess I'm no help.

brutusmaximus · Nov 28, 2007, 05:59 PM

i think it should stay, i like billys posts. used to be a pastime of mine in work, to read them in teabreak and have a chuckle at everyone getting upset.

cozumel · Nov 28, 2007, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Toaster

I say remove it. The original idea for the forum was great, with a no holds barred section to insult everyone in a witty way, it has turned into a forum for old and retarded people, apart from me of course.

Never thought I'd hear you say that. I totally disagree with you Billy. Or should I say Grace, The Pink Panther, Zardon or Falstaff?

Quote:

Either that or you rename it to "the slightly moist zone, free cookies and milk with every post".

If FWZ is to remain then that is why you are needed to stop it becoming a kindergarten in which the youngsters play.

Just Learnin' · Nov 28, 2007, 06:27 PM

It's a blast! Wish I had the repertoire/gift some others seem to have, I find it very amusing. Those with issue should not read into it more than it is. No one was dragged in there, it is a conscious decision and any ill feelings should be left at the door. Those that start crying about the treatment they receive there have lost perspective as have those who take it "outside the box".

Cheers!

**Mousey** · Nov 28, 2007, 07:17 PM

I really can't decide if i want it to stay or go, i'm sitting on the fence with this one

Falstaff · Nov 28, 2007, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mousey

I really can't decide if i want it to stay or go, i'm sitting on the fence with this one

your still young and impressionable..LOL
stay on the fence..
least you know what is poking you in the butt..LOL

Billy Toaster · Nov 28, 2007, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mousey

I really can't decide if i want it to stay or go, i'm sitting on the fence with this one

Well i could say it must be a hell of a wide fence you are sitting on but you would take offense and report me

Seriously though, if it does stay I think new rules need to be in place otherwise people get offended, start crying and go to mummy with the clown face and nicotene teeth. I guess the forum could be split up into two subsections?

Have a normal zone and a "Little bitch zone" for all the pussies in here.

Falstaff · Nov 28, 2007, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Toaster

Well i could say it must be a hell of a wide fence you are sitting on but you would take offense and report me

Seriously though, if it does stay I think new rules need to be in place otherwise people get offended, start crying and go to mummy with the clown face and nicotene teeth. I guess the forum could be split up into two subsections?

Have a normal zone and a "Little bitch zone" for all the pussies in here.

hey...
who's got a clown face with nicotine teeth here?

**Mousey** · Nov 28, 2007, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Toaster

Well i could say it must be a hell of a wide fence you are sitting on but you would take offense and report me

Too late, you just did say it -_-

cozumel · Nov 28, 2007, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Toaster

Have a normal zone and a "Little bitch zone" for all the pussies in here.

Not a bad idea....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Toaster

Well i could say it must be a hell of a wide fence you are sitting on but you would take offense and report me

That's a bit of a bum joke

I just reckon everyone should relax and enjoy the craik

Have a Guiness and a shot or two of Jamiesen, take a few deep breathes and let the stress ease. Chill

Falstaff · Nov 28, 2007, 07:44 PM

so your saying we should have a whining vagina forum and a FWZ?

reno · Nov 28, 2007, 10:19 PM

I haven't really been active that much in the past years, but the Flame Warzone used to be pretty fun to blow off some steam in. I understand wanting to protect the rest of the forums from flaming "bleed through," but fear that removing them completely would only aggravate that.

Sure, there's always weird people that come in and ruin things, and they get banned or whatnot, but for regulars or "normal" posters I think the Flame Warzone is a fun time to just make a dolt out of yourself and others - and I certainly never take anything seriously there, and would hope that NO one does.

So I don't know if you can really argue about the "quality" of a place intended to be indecent, nor judge its merits accordingly. I guess it really comes down to Democracy (the vote that is

)!

Judas · Nov 28, 2007, 10:21 PM

i like the stereotype, racial, international, bodily, brutal and bloody, outright nasty comments and slurs, slangs, swear combos used.... frankly anyone that gets panties in a twist after reading something that offends the living shit outa you, shouldn't even be in there..

don't like it? GTFO....

anyone that reports someone after getting owned in the FWZ should be banned.... even just for a short while....

reporting a FWZ poster.... how lame is that?

mike2h · Nov 28, 2007, 10:39 PM

i agree 100% judas. cant beleive anyone is crying about being insulted in the fwz. how pathetic. fkn sissy la-la's.

OmegaRED · Nov 28, 2007, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

anyone that reports someone after getting owned in the FWZ should be banned.... even just for a short while....

reporting a FWZ poster.... how lame is that?

I'd support a one week suspension for anyone who rats out a flamer who isn't breaking any rules.

View Poll Results: flame zone forum - removed or not ?
Yes I want it gone, its a terrible section	6	9.52%
No, I like it, it lets me clear the air with people or have a laugh	57	90.48%
Voters: 63. This poll is closed

Nov 28, 2007, 12:47 PM	#1
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	flame zone forum - removed or not ? ive noticed a drop in posting standards which some people have suggested may very well be due to the fact the flame zone is causing people to get annoyed, tense and to carry over "hard feelings" into other forum sections. The flame zone was intended to let members vent, and to clear the air, while leaving the rest of the forum free from "crap." clearly this principle which has worked reasonably effectively in the past may no longer be viable. So shall I remove it or not ?

Nov 28, 2007, 02:28 PM	#5
OldBuzzard DH's oldest Geek Join Date: May 2003 Location: Oberlin, OH Posts: 2,783 Rep Power: 145 System Specs	I've always enjoyed the FWZ, and have tried to be somewhat original and entertaining in there. It's all a game to me, and I'd miss it a bit, but that wouldn't keep me visiting DH for all the other forums. I voted to keep it, but in the end it's your call. Maybe you could have some sort of popup appear when folks enter the FWZ reminding them that whatever happens there stays there, and that if they are easily offended that maybe they better not enter? __________________ When looking for a reason as to why things go wrong, never rule out sheer STUPIDITY Last edited by OldBuzzard; Nov 28, 2007 at 02:35 PM.

Nov 28, 2007, 02:40 PM	#6
cozumel I'm dangerous but cute... Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Under the waves... Posts: 3,577 Rep Power: 60 System Specs	I also voted for FWZ to remain. The worst thing in my opinion would be for the rules to be changed where you can't say what you like anymore. It would be like other forums where there is censorship. Still, if the current 'state of play' is causing an excessive amount amount of problems to the admin and mods then maybe it should go. It would just be a sad reflection on DH members abilty to act responsibly if that was to happen. __________________ Don't worry about money - Be a beach bum! Scuba Rocks

Nov 28, 2007, 03:11 PM	#7
YAYitsAndrew Anti-Piracy Poster Boy Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NJ Posts: 2,605 Rep Power: 79 System Specs	I don't think there's a problem with the FWZ idea itself, but I tend to notice that the people who do most of their posting there (and religious/political debate) are asshats outside as well. It kinda needs to be a sideroom that you go to, not a main attraction. I know of a couple FWZ heavy members that I think ill of when they post in outside forums (because I think they're purposely trying to start something) but I keep it to myself out of respect for FWZ. It's hard to believe that "what happens in FWZ stays in FWZ" is really true when I have those feelings. I don't think it's possible to truly separate the area like that, but with discipline we can respect the division. __________________ "It is because the resistance to paying for copyrighted material, although often characterized as arising from a supposed technical burden or principled concern for the public interest, arises rather from exactly the same segment of the brain that is dominant in shoplifters." - Mark Helprin, Digital Barbarism In other words, it's never okay to steal even if you think you have a good reason! www.yayitsandrew.com

Nov 28, 2007, 01:01 PM	#2
Reckless187 HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: UK Posts: 731 Rep Power: 57 System Specs	No! Don't remove it! Most of the mature members know that whats said in FWZ stays in the FWZ & is nothing personal. If someone is seen to carry things over into other forums then they should be punished rather than the forum being closed down. As long as there is no racism or anything too over the top then it's all good. Saying that though, If I have or do in future upset someone I can be man enough to make an apology. I have nothing personal against any member here & anything I post in the FWZ is intended as a bit of harmless fun. I think this only startedcos of the best flamer comp tbh.

Nov 28, 2007, 01:46 PM	#3
mkk Cthulhu/Dagon 2012 Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Gefle, Sweden Posts: 4,495 Rep Power: 132 System Specs	I wouldn't miss it but perhaps the flame zone could simply use a vacation. Like being turned off now "for the holidays" and then being evaluated for coming back up next year.

Nov 28, 2007, 01:54 PM	#4
Brutality DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Estonia Posts: 887 Rep Power: 0	It will stay

Nov 28, 2007, 03:24 PM	#8
Mousey Synth's Long Lost Bro Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Web Design Hell Posts: 7,189 Rep Power: 245 System Specs	The FWZ Is one of those awful grey areas i'm afraid to agree. What's said in the FWZ Can't be held against anyone since it is basically a slanging forum, but threads that are posted in there often get taken too far and they start getting too personal. I'm not sensitive to being called names, you could walk right up to me and call me a cunt and i'd probably just raise one eyebrow and walk away but when people start getting personal and using things i might have opened up to them against me it really hurts my feelings. That's why i'm afraid to open up to anyone, i'm probably afraid of being let down by somebody i put faith into. In fact i was reluctant to post my pk progression vid but i did anyway. Perhaps we could give the FWZ A trial with more staff watching what goes on or some stricter rules? Depends on my mood what's said by me in there really, most of the time it's just light hearted but yeah, things definately get out of hand in there. __________________

Nov 28, 2007, 03:32 PM	#9
cozumel I'm dangerous but cute... Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Under the waves... Posts: 3,577 Rep Power: 60 System Specs	Just one other thing about posting standards (seperate from FWZ). I personally don't agree with people using profanities on any of the forums except FWZ. I just don't think it is right. There may be a young person coming to the news forum where their is sometimes bad language or a support thread etc. I'm just suggesting a degree of self-censorship when making posts. This is just my opinion and does not reflect on any members or DriverHeaven which continues to be the top tech site on the planet. __________________ Don't worry about money - Be a beach bum! Scuba Rocks Last edited by cozumel; Nov 28, 2007 at 03:38 PM.

Nov 28, 2007, 04:09 PM	#13
OmegaRED Relapsed Gamer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Ottawa , Canada Posts: 5,688 Rep Power: 173 System Specs	If you can't stand the heat get out of the flame zone! It's really that simple. What is slightly more difficult is dealing with the members who are dedicated flamers and only visit DH for that one section. Some people find it hard to treat them as normal member when the flamer starts posting outside of the FMZ. It irked me that one of the big flamers on DH got muzzled because some members couldn't use the willpower to keep themselves out of the flame zone and they got upset by him. What did you expect, hugs and kisses? Don't visit that section unless you're up for some fun and don't let it get to you. __________________ E Penis Specs: <------------- See System Specs

Nov 28, 2007, 04:13 PM	#14
Asmoday Demonic Join Date: May 2002 Location: In the cold, dark north... Posts: 5,198 Rep Power: 92 System Specs	Agrees with Viking and 'buzzard...I almost never post in there but its good for a laugh now and then. I say keep it. __________________ How You can help Hardwareheaven by using Digg

Nov 28, 2007, 04:53 PM	#15
Billy Toaster f(*k you Join Date: May 2004 Location: hell Posts: 293 Rep Power: 0	I say remove it. The original idea for the forum was great, with a no holds barred section to insult everyone in a witty way, it has turned into a forum for old and retarded people, apart from me of course. Either that or you rename it to "the slightly moist zone, free cookies and milk with every post".

Nov 28, 2007, 05:25 PM	#16
Tinkerhell Not all fairies are nice. Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 989 Rep Power: 44	I almost never go in unless I'm really bored or some other thread prompts me to want to post something harsher than is appropriate under a different section. I certainly wouldn't miss it. Course if it stays I wouldn't care much either. Guess I'm no help. __________________ Stupidity should be painful if not terminal. Darwin for Sainthood!!

Nov 28, 2007, 05:59 PM	#17
brutusmaximus DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 520 Rep Power: 76	i think it should stay, i like billys posts. used to be a pastime of mine in work, to read them in teabreak and have a chuckle at everyone getting upset. __________________

Nov 28, 2007, 06:27 PM	#19
Just Learnin' HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Posts: 1,414 Rep Power: 56 System Specs	It's a blast! Wish I had the repertoire/gift some others seem to have, I find it very amusing. Those with issue should not read into it more than it is. No one was dragged in there, it is a conscious decision and any ill feelings should be left at the door. Those that start crying about the treatment they receive there have lost perspective as have those who take it "outside the box". Cheers!

Nov 28, 2007, 07:17 PM	#20
Mousey Synth's Long Lost Bro Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Web Design Hell Posts: 7,189 Rep Power: 245 System Specs	I really can't decide if i want it to stay or go, i'm sitting on the fence with this one __________________

Nov 28, 2007, 07:44 PM	#26
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	so your saying we should have a whining vagina forum and a FWZ? __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Nov 28, 2007, 10:19 PM	#27
reno Painlord of Ichor Join Date: May 2002 Location: bloinkin! Posts: 1,610 Rep Power: 0	I haven't really been active that much in the past years, but the Flame Warzone used to be pretty fun to blow off some steam in. I understand wanting to protect the rest of the forums from flaming "bleed through," but fear that removing them completely would only aggravate that. Sure, there's always weird people that come in and ruin things, and they get banned or whatnot, but for regulars or "normal" posters I think the Flame Warzone is a fun time to just make a dolt out of yourself and others - and I certainly never take anything seriously there, and would hope that NO one does. So I don't know if you can really argue about the "quality" of a place intended to be indecent, nor judge its merits accordingly. I guess it really comes down to Democracy (the vote that is )!

Nov 28, 2007, 10:39 PM	#29
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	i agree 100% judas. cant beleive anyone is crying about being insulted in the fwz. how pathetic. fkn sissy la-la's. __________________