Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer?

comp_ali · Oct 6, 2009, 02:04 PM

While many people stereotype geeks as only being interested in using the computer all day, the truth is that a geek is actually a person who often contemplates many of the deeper questions of the universe while busy installing the coolest new add-ons to Firefox or tweaking their mobile phone so that they can control it from their desktop. One of the universal debates many geeks have centers around an important question that involves neurobiology and the science of artificial intelligence, and that question is – Does a human think faster than a computer?
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Tyrsonswood · Oct 6, 2009, 02:18 PM

Hmmmm................ gotta ask....... Which human?

There's quite a few "286" humans running around in a quad core world.

Falstaff · Oct 6, 2009, 02:29 PM

Here we go into Cybernetics again.
can we build a machine that "thinks" or responds based on structured chemical elements?
When we have one that can do that as well or better than a human, then I would say yes.
but no, it isnt a proper question.
its still garbage in and garbage out as far as I am concerned.

**MIG-31** · Oct 6, 2009, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyrsonswood

Hmmmm................ gotta ask....... Which human?

There's quite a few "286" humans running around in a quad core world.

OmegaRED · Oct 6, 2009, 03:38 PM

Computers don't think about sex every few seconds so they will always be faster.

Matth · Oct 6, 2009, 04:49 PM

By virtue of a training process called "learning" or "education", the vast majority of humans are equipped with speech and image recognition systems, which also operate alongside a dynamic stabilization system for the unstable biped form.

I guess the key superiorities of the human are in having parallel processing, context addressable memory, and ambulatory access to offline storage.

Computers crunch numbers very quickly, their problem is that everything has to be distilled down to that.

charm_quark · Oct 6, 2009, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRED

Computers don't think about sex every few seconds so they will always be faster.

very true!

we build computers so how can they be smarter than us

Judas · Oct 6, 2009, 08:17 PM

computers are neither smart or stupid.....

they are only as powerful and intelligent as we make them..

When a viable self aware, self learning form of AI is implemented that isn't hardcoded to limits... then there is a damn good chance they'll "think" faster then us.....

Computers are only now realy starting to excersise multi threading/tasking.... most machines today.. even powerful enough ones, thrown any more then 40 critical high priority tasks while simple... slow to a crawl.

~~CitySlicker~~ · Oct 6, 2009, 10:39 PM

Actually a computer is completely stoopid and can only follow programs telling them what to do. There is no intelligence whatsoever and therefore it can't think at all.

From the neurological view the human brain is a parallel processors having data available instantly once it is learned. The computer is a serial processor which needs to lookup all information stored (since a computer can not learn).

So, the topic here is an oxymoron (no insult intended)

Judas · Oct 6, 2009, 10:43 PM

indeed city.

but you can't deny that the technology is growing at such a rate that something that can mimic the "learning" capabilities isn't to far fetched

comp_ali · Oct 6, 2009, 10:59 PM

Yes , they are trying to imitate human abilities and implement that into Computers ,Look at computer specs from just ten years it is now 1000x what it was. Though , humans still have so much things that computer can't like feelings. To be fair , creating these computer themselves is a sign of human leading.

~~CitySlicker~~ · Oct 6, 2009, 11:18 PM

Yep, Judas, you can program "learning" but there will never be an (human) "experience" factor. All you can do is feeding an "experience" database that then needs to be searched for..(cough). It's all a seriously bad mimic of human intelligence.

In my very humble opinion, there is no digital intelligence, never ever will be. Intelligence is an exclusive property of biological life forms (okay, there are dumb animals and humans but at least they do have a real brain).

Artificial intelligence is a myth - yesterday I saw Transformers here on TV... nice fiction.

Judas · Oct 6, 2009, 11:27 PM

nothing is impossible..

our biological makeup is mostly nothing more then chemical reactions and changes in energy the produce various results.... a overly complex machine by any standards.

While currently computers run off a very simplistic design that sounds complex... it's very simple... it's straight forward. There is methods that would introduce similare results of what is perseved as intelligence.... right now it's kinda hard to get a maybe out of a 0 or a 1....

Falstaff · Oct 6, 2009, 11:27 PM

you cant compare a computer to a human being, it simply cannot be done

Shatalov, Human Being and Computer: A Comparison

~~CitySlicker~~ · Oct 6, 2009, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

nothing is impossible..

our biological makeup is mostly nothing more then chemical reactions and changes in energy the produce various results.... a overly complex machine by any standards.

true, humans are chemically very simple constructions. However, not simple enough yet to be able to clone humans or even to understand their DNA system let alone the brain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judas

While currently computers run off a very simplistic design that sounds complex... it's very simple... it's straight forward. There is methods that would introduce similare results of what is perseved as intelligence.... right now it's kinda hard to get a maybe out of a 0 or a 1....

righto, the binary system - it's not more than a light switch can do...on/off that's it. Very hard to build intelligence with that one

I worked a couple of years on such a project - computational artificial intelligence. Just forget it...never going to work (in a human sense) until we have a complete understanding of quantum physics. It's the key to understand how our world works on a sub atomic level.

Falstaff · Oct 7, 2009, 01:57 AM

using organic chemistry to store information is the way, and that is not that far off.

Tyrsonswood · Oct 7, 2009, 02:34 AM

What was the question again?

~~CitySlicker~~ · Oct 7, 2009, 02:45 AM

has been answered in full

Judas · Oct 7, 2009, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CitySlicker

true, humans are chemically very simple constructions. However, not simple enough yet to be able to clone humans or even to understand their DNA system let alone the brain.

Clone? I'm pretty sure even 5 years or more ago we could have easily cloned a human fully and healthy. For all we know this might have done already. Granted yes.. alot of things we still yet don't understand or can't comprehend yet.

Quote:

righto, the binary system - it's not more than a light switch can do...on/off that's it. Very hard to build intelligence with that one

I worked a couple of years on such a project - computational artificial intelligence. Just forget it...never going to work (in a human sense) until we have a complete understanding of quantum physics. It's the key to understand how our world works on a sub atomic level.

AH, quantum computers.... that is indeed the thing to get into, when quantum computers and biological computers come about, this will easily open up the possibilities to no end.

dawgXdenta · Oct 7, 2009, 09:05 PM

i'm going to throw in a bit more on the topic, there are a few things that are rarely discussed in this: "computer better than human scenario", speed besides is a very relative term workdone per time period is a much more better relational comparison technique, computers beat people here handsdown.
Number crunching powers in computers are far superior
however in terms of artistic detail such as that the human eye can capyture
or the ability for the human to move in mathematically complex ways is something robotics hasnt quite nabbed yet. Though good progress has been made.

The main problem that I forsee in this discussion for now and the future is that of the PHOTOCOPY DELEMA.
In simple terms computers are clones of people they are "modelled" after what a human has conjured up regardless of how perfect the photocopy is, it cannot excell beyond the logical & mathematical & allegorical & algorithmic bounds of what created it in this scenario us humans.

Ok fine lets assume we give it the ability to learn such as we do, some scholars have warned that this is what may be the end of mankind as it may excell beyond our capabilities to respond and learn faster or better than us.

However mathematical principles will tell you that that bound had already been defined and designed by the human, so by virtue of the human having designed the knowledge space to accomodate such a learning ,the human had already reached such a knowledge base before the AI had the ability to learn and reach that state.

Rendering the (AI > HUMAN )argument in a rather precarious situation, meaning therefore
that human knowledge space shall always be @ least a step ahead of AI for ALL case scenarios

Can be mathematically proven , but.....

There are other arguments but that shall be sufficient for now, i've been heavily buried in assignments so you'll excuse my formal scholarly tone

Oct 6, 2009, 02:04 PM	#1
comp_ali Sniper Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Egypt Posts: 10,469 Rep Power: 339 System Specs	Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? While many people stereotype geeks as only being interested in using the computer all day, the truth is that a geek is actually a person who often contemplates many of the deeper questions of the universe while busy installing the coolest new add-ons to Firefox or tweaking their mobile phone so that they can control it from their desktop. One of the universal debates many geeks have centers around an important question that involves neurobiology and the science of artificial intelligence, and that question is – Does a human think faster than a computer? _______________________ Read full article __________________

Oct 6, 2009, 02:29 PM	#3
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? Here we go into Cybernetics again. can we build a machine that "thinks" or responds based on structured chemical elements? When we have one that can do that as well or better than a human, then I would say yes. but no, it isnt a proper question. its still garbage in and garbage out as far as I am concerned. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor." Last edited by Falstaff; Oct 6, 2009 at 11:23 PM.

Oct 6, 2009, 03:38 PM	#5
OmegaRED Relapsed Gamer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Ottawa , Canada Posts: 5,688 Rep Power: 173 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? Computers don't think about sex every few seconds so they will always be faster. __________________ E Penis Specs: <------------- See System Specs

Oct 6, 2009, 04:49 PM	#6
Matth Flash Banner Hater Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: UK Posts: 3,426 Rep Power: 93 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? By virtue of a training process called "learning" or "education", the vast majority of humans are equipped with speech and image recognition systems, which also operate alongside a dynamic stabilization system for the unstable biped form. I guess the key superiorities of the human are in having parallel processing, context addressable memory, and ambulatory access to offline storage. Computers crunch numbers very quickly, their problem is that everything has to be distilled down to that. __________________ Mary had a little lamb, Her father shot it dead Now Mary takes her lamb to school, Between two crusts of bread

Oct 6, 2009, 10:39 PM	#9
~~CitySlicker~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Brisbane Australia Posts: 183 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? Actually a computer is completely stoopid and can only follow programs telling them what to do. There is no intelligence whatsoever and therefore it can't think at all. From the neurological view the human brain is a parallel processors having data available instantly once it is learned. The computer is a serial processor which needs to lookup all information stored (since a computer can not learn). So, the topic here is an oxymoron (no insult intended)

Oct 6, 2009, 10:59 PM	Thread Starter #11
comp_ali Sniper Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Egypt Posts: 10,469 Rep Power: 339 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? Yes , they are trying to imitate human abilities and implement that into Computers ,Look at computer specs from just ten years it is now 1000x what it was. Though , humans still have so much things that computer can't like feelings. To be fair , creating these computer themselves is a sign of human leading. __________________

Oct 6, 2009, 11:18 PM	#12
~~CitySlicker~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Brisbane Australia Posts: 183 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? Yep, Judas, you can program "learning" but there will never be an (human) "experience" factor. All you can do is feeding an "experience" database that then needs to be searched for..(cough). It's all a seriously bad mimic of human intelligence. In my very humble opinion, there is no digital intelligence, never ever will be. Intelligence is an exclusive property of biological life forms (okay, there are dumb animals and humans but at least they do have a real brain). Artificial intelligence is a myth - yesterday I saw Transformers here on TV... nice fiction.

Oct 6, 2009, 11:27 PM	#14
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? you cant compare a computer to a human being, it simply cannot be done Shatalov, Human Being and Computer: A Comparison __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Oct 7, 2009, 01:57 AM	#16
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? using organic chemistry to store information is the way, and that is not that far off. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Oct 7, 2009, 02:45 AM	#18
~~CitySlicker~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Brisbane Australia Posts: 183 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? has been answered in full

Oct 7, 2009, 09:05 PM	#20
dawgXdenta HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Gabz Posts: 1,995 Rep Power: 135 System Specs	Re: Does a Human Think Faster Than a Computer? i'm going to throw in a bit more on the topic, there are a few things that are rarely discussed in this: "computer better than human scenario", speed besides is a very relative term workdone per time period is a much more better relational comparison technique, computers beat people here handsdown. Number crunching powers in computers are far superior however in terms of artistic detail such as that the human eye can capyture or the ability for the human to move in mathematically complex ways is something robotics hasnt quite nabbed yet. Though good progress has been made. The main problem that I forsee in this discussion for now and the future is that of the PHOTOCOPY DELEMA. In simple terms computers are clones of people they are "modelled" after what a human has conjured up regardless of how perfect the photocopy is, it cannot excell beyond the logical & mathematical & allegorical & algorithmic bounds of what created it in this scenario us humans. Ok fine lets assume we give it the ability to learn such as we do, some scholars have warned that this is what may be the end of mankind as it may excell beyond our capabilities to respond and learn faster or better than us. However mathematical principles will tell you that that bound had already been defined and designed by the human, so by virtue of the human having designed the knowledge space to accomodate such a learning ,the human had already reached such a knowledge base before the AI had the ability to learn and reach that state. Rendering the (AI > HUMAN )argument in a rather precarious situation, meaning therefore that human knowledge space shall always be @ least a step ahead of AI for ALL case scenarios Can be mathematically proven , but..... There are other arguments but that shall be sufficient for now, i've been heavily buried in assignments so you'll excuse my formal scholarly tone __________________ Today's world is of public opinion and the fates of nations are determined through its pressure. Once the tools for building public opinion are obtained, everything that you asked for can be done. --- Osama bin Laden when relating how global media has the minds of the masses. ______________________________________ http://dawgxdenta.deviantart.com/gallery/ Last edited by dawgXdenta; Oct 7, 2009 at 09:14 PM.