[dawgXdenta]

Basically once in a while scientist/inventors create something so revolutionary that it becomes a threat to our current profit oriented economic model and it gets squashed. e.g

http://www.topsecretwriters.com/2011...d-by-industry/

From electric cars that can go 300miles on a single charge :O (invented back in 2003 ). when will the profit oriented systems we have currently fall to let science and inventions truly SHINE.

If you have heard any other such story post it here and let me know about it.

[Transk53]

American eventions... Ok

[Liqourice]

If you should invent something that is really groundbreaking and could forever change the way our world works you need to be really smart about it, otherwise you will be out manouvered in so many ways. Problem with most inventors is that they aren't generally the smartest businessmen.

[Judas]

Originally Posted by dawgXdenta

From electric cars that can go 300miles on a single charge :O (invented back in 2003 ).

sorry do you mean 1998... back when initially it ws 150-175miles on a single charge with a 10 hour recharge time.... which by 1999 and 2000 the originl battery creator had managed to double the distance with near half the recharge time.. only because of chev he isn't allowed to sell a single battery now.

[Judas]

Originally Posted by Liqourice

If you should invent something that is really groundbreaking and could forever change the way our world works you need to be really smart about it, otherwise you will be out manouvered in so many ways. Problem with most inventors is that they aren't generally the smartest businessmen.

the problem with most inventors is that they are usually surrounded and fed to the dogs repeatedly.... have their work stolen and marketed as someone elses invention, or are killed/beaten/purposely broken.

Look at Tesla... the inventor of a good majority of the devices we continue to use today, and inventor of many of the things we haven't even see yet.

Anyone else realized that tesla doesn't even have a museum placement at all? Shit his own labatory was to be destroyed... as in understand it a few good people managed to keep that from happening... but shit, there are numerous "eddison" museums.... and that son of a bitch didn't invent a fucking thing. He was a crude, rude, back stabbing asshole with nothing but dollar signs on his mind. Purposely lieing and stealing at any cost... jebus the guy purposely electricuted and killed numerous animals in a single attempt to disprove and scare the public away from AC.

If anything eddison should be thrown to the dogs and all his "non-existant" work destroyed in a blaze.

Seems many inventors however generally have no significant interest though in commercial gain.... the "inventors" that do usually come up with shit products and promote the crap out of it before it's even finished let alone a decent product.

Meanwhile we have an aging NASA... a place where many new inventions are created, and yet has a budget that is essentially non-existant. Nasa, the creator of jobs and the economy growth.... the creator of aspiring people. Driving force of a LOT of good work, can't get a budget that allows it to do anything really significant, like getting blood from a rock. Meanwhile a working capitalistic society decided it was fantastic to publically fund miss managed banks and car manufacturers.

the first... single bailout of those infrustructures EXCEEDS the entire combined budgets/costs of nasa's birth to present day.. and will continue to exceed nasas combined total budget every year for the next potential 20 years or more depending on if nasa will ever get a budget.

But nope.. unfortunately, our society has crumbled down to a rather near meaningless existance. The core of which is exchange of dollars and increase debt over time at the expensive of majority of the public and the benefit of the very few. To sell essentially shit to each other at the highest price for the lowest quality. Most of the things we don't necessarily need.

Look at north america's actual manufacturing statistics compared to that of strickly office paperwork jobs. Everything mostly exists outside of north america, and we mostly just sit at a computer punching in data and sending off the work for someone else to do. We've created a structure that has been firmly in place for a long time now, which RELIES on the make work projects we had created. Work to do work that shouldn't really exist in the first place. Quite sad.

back to tesla..

Tesla died from what they claim to be natural causes.... he died alone.... broke, not a penny in his name at all... no children.... was forced to sell off the few patents that somehow managed to make it through the patent office with his name on it.

He had his work and labatory torched what was it... twice .... each time emmediately after he had made what he thought to be a ground breaking discovery or invention.

He had his work blown up once there was word of it being potentially unlimited free energy or capabilities designed to remove the need for any consumer to have to pay anything.

This is what we do to inventors.... and when they can't show their evidence and product to the world .. under their name.... we refuse to beleive a word they say or what they had done.. and are more inclined to beleive that either a true "patent holder" had invented whatever device...

Graham bell for example.. didn't invent the damn phone...

The huge list of people that are claimed to have invented anything usually hadn't at all. as i said... stolen work.....

[Neshi]

Josef Papp's Noble gas engine... although I am not sure whether it actually worked or not.
It is now being researched again under the name of the plasmic transition process engine. quite interesting..

[Liqourice]

There has been stories about water powered engines for decades, I believe most of them are just tall stories. The amount of energy needed to split the water molecules to oxygen and hydrogen makes it really impractical, at least it has been technologically so far. Perhaps there will be some kind of technology that makes it practical in the near future and it would be a big break through. Even the oil producing nations are starting to realise that the oil will run out and they're starting to find alternative ways to fuel their economies. This will only make it possible for new ideas to really develop.

I'm also pretty sure there are tonnes of these tall stories about incredible inventions gone missing because someone didn't want them, murdered inventors and so on. Some might be true but most are just made up.

[dawgXdenta]

Originally Posted by Judas

sorry do you mean 1998... back when initially it ws 150-175miles on a single charge with a 10 hour recharge time.... which by 1999 and 2000 the originl battery creator had managed to double the distance with near half the recharge time.. only because of chev he isn't allowed to sell a single battery now.

I stand corrected, the news article i saw was from 2003 on CNN of all places.

[dawgXdenta]

@ Liqourice

Its hard to tell what is a tall story and/or a short one when the same people who give you the news are the same ones who own the oil, electronics......and whatever else can make money.
It stands to reason that people should protect their investments. Do you remember the show beyond 2000 (show back in the 80s and 90s). There were tons of inventions/ideas that were explored on the show that we wont see in life.
The simple fact is, it doesnt matter how usefull or revolutionery something is, its how much money can be made from it.
Thats why we have I phones, xboxes and playstations3s these are brilliant inventions but a far cry from revolutionary, as a matter of fact not even close.
I think we are capable of 1000 times an iphone. if profit and money wasnt involved.

[Judas]

we have the technology to cure and replace most of the illnesses out there..
but because it makes no profit .... we don't see it

[Liqourice]

Of course I know this. We could all have had completely different lives with incredible technology around us if money hadn't been an issue. All I'm saying is that even though there is some truth in some stories we hear I'm pretty sure that most of them are just stories and nothing else.

I mean, I know of a person that created a car that was driven by compressed air. It's not so far fetched at all, the tech wasn't that ground breaking and it wasn't that expensive to make either. The problems were on another scale. Range was a major issue, and the fact that as the air tank started to get empty the car lost power. Then there was that problem of refilling it. It wasn't very practical at all which was the main reason why it never led to anything. There are thousands of examples of inventions or creations that looked really promising but ended up in the bin because they weren't as practical as they seemed, it's not always because of economical reasons they fail.

[Callandor]

I want to disagree with you Liqourice and agree with Dawg and Judas, capitalism is the reason why we're many years behind what the governments of this world actually have. All the companies (which control the governments btw) of this world want is to make more and more money, they are not at all interested in the well-being of the people of this earth.

[blibbax]

I'm not quite the full conspiratorial ticket, but I do agree that our economic system has held us back technologically. They say Nicola Tesla invented a system to distribute electricity in cities wirelessley, but his backer dropped out because he had no way of forcing people to pay for it. I don't know whether that's true, but it's just the kind of thing that I can imagine happening in the world today, with our selfish and self-centred obsession with patents, profit and (non-electrical) power.

[Liqourice]

Originally Posted by Callandor

I want to disagree with you Liqourice and agree with Dawg and Judas, capitalism is the reason why we're many years behind what the governments of this world actually have. All the companies (which control the governments btw) of this world want is to make more and more money, they are not at all interested in the well-being of the people of this earth.

I don't disagree with that, I just don't believe all of those stories are true. People in general know how things work and making stories like this up is a way to show how disgusted they are with how corporations and governments do whatever they can to stay in control. I'm sure some stories are true or at least have some truth in them, I just don't think they all are.

[Liqourice]

Originally Posted by blibbax

I'm not quite the full conspiratorial ticket, but I do agree that our economic system has held us back technologically. They say Nicola Tesla invented a system to distribute electricity in cities wirelessley, but his backer dropped out because he had no way of forcing people to pay for it. I don't know whether that's true, but it's just the kind of thing that I can imagine happening in the world today, without our selfish and self-centred obsession with patents, profit and (non-electrical) power.

I've seen two different explanations to this. One was that he never really intended this to make profits for his investors so they backed out when they realised they wouldn't make any money from it. The other was that he wasn't really able to fully control the distribution of power, to much leakage was one problem and to make sure that the reciever would be able to get enough for their needs the transmitter had to emit such high yealds that it wasn't really safe for anyone to be near it.

We will probably never get the right answer to this question, all we know that he had this idea but that he failed somehow to realise his dream and it broke him down.

[Judas]

Originally Posted by blibbax

I'm not quite the full conspiratorial ticket, but I do agree that our economic system has held us back technologically. They say Nicola Tesla invented a system to distribute electricity in cities wirelessley, but his backer dropped out because he had no way of forcing people to pay for it. I don't know whether that's true, but it's just the kind of thing that I can imagine happening in the world today, with our selfish and self-centred obsession with patents, profit and (non-electrical) power.

companies and businesses absalutely HATE for the public to be self sufficient and off the grid.

Reason they continue to enforce in north america and numerous other places around the world the collective interest of central zones or places in which everyone must buy/sell/be provided from/to.

Example, Across canada there used to be an elevator in nearly every town, trains criscrossed the entire country making certain to be able to visit each one, this meant very fuel effiecent, large capacity hauling, it also guaranteed work, and made it possible for farmers to sell their crops pretty much as they harvested it if they so choosed to do so. This is back when the amount that could be harvested was significantly lower too. Farmers didn't require huge amounts of storage or large trucks to get the job done.

Meanwhile there were small stores in many of these towns that contained even the most unique products, special ordering was easy, and typically you could receive it nearly guaranteed within a 12-24 hour period depending on the products overall availability. It wasn't uncommon to order a part at even 6pm and have it in your hands by 8 or 9pm.... 2 to 3 hours and AFTER hours i might add. Best of all, Values of the products were nearly if not the same as "city" pricing, in fact there were numerous times in which the identical product could be gotten cheaper from a small store in some random town then what was up in the city.

And this was when there wasn't multiple "versions" of the same product available, What you bought was what it was. There weren't multiple versions of something, example being a drill that contained Steel cogs and parts vs one that looks IDENTICAL in every way, has the same model and product part number, as one that has nylon cogs/gears/parts, just different price. Leaving modern customers to bitch about one retailers price vs walmarts price (walmart of course being lower due to having a product with nylon gears rather than steel therefore shitty quality product)

Small businesses flourished.

Farmers/ranchers could milk cows, and sell it to people around the country. They could also provide entire pigs/cows/chickens and sell them directly off the farm, hell even butcher and prep/pack the meat themselves. Selling eggs off the farm was also a sinch.


However now... it's all hugely regulated and controlled, as well as centralized.

Farms are now forced hold onto their product, sometimes for years, which requires expensive land consuming storage, they are also then forced to pay truckers to ship it vast distances to these "main" terminals. And in Western canada, farmers are charged an insane amount (ilegally but somehow unwinable) for product shipped from the facility that has "bought" the product and then decides to ship it themselves to whatever destination (how the fuck does that make sense, people would be utterly pissed off if they received a bill for shipping something they didn't even own from a place they don't live or work, to a destination they don't even know anything about). Sometimes their product never touches the tracks and is shipped directly to a buyer that runs a production facility right there, but someone they still managed to be charged freight out to vancouver and back via rail. (again another attempted persued legal case, lost due to the crushing legal might of a huge corp having lawyers able to blockade progress in those cases)

So we have thousands of semi trucks DESTROYING our local roads, costing our government more money while they are force into feeding the people/corps that caused the problem in the first place big dollars to keep doing it.

Small stores, such as mine, the local grocery, etc are being blockaded from being able to obtain product, and anything we can get, basically forced to pay retail price and then additional shipping charges on top of it just to receive it. Top it off the warranty starts nearly the moment we purchase it, NOT when we sell it. Also we sometimes have to wait weeks for something so simple. Most of the product is only available from super warehouses located in usually one or 2 major cities of canada, or 1 major one per state in the united states. They dictate everything and purposely have set it up that in order to get a product, either buy massive huge quantities of the product which means tens of thousands of dollars for a single item, in order to get the real wholesale value.

I tried to buy a router, my cost was 100 bucks.... did a bit of research and found out i could get the product for 26-28 dollars each... holy jebus shit, almost 1/4 the price. But 10,000 minimum quantity purchases, Futureshop or bestbuy pick these up for 25-28 bucks and sell them for 60-80 dollars "as a sale item" but during non sale time sell at 100. People think they are saving so much with a 30% "sale" value when they are still getting royally screwed.

The consumer system is a total royal rape fest. What's worse is people think they are getting the deals.

Farmers/ranchers in most places can no longer sell eggs/milk/meat off the farm.. they have to be certified and licensed by officials. At which point so much as even trying to give the milk away is now considered a criminal offense as "it's a health hazard"... Granted you got buy meat from a farmer that knows what the hell he's doing or else your going to get real sick.

What has to be done for meat is send an entire animal up to be slaughtered and packed by a corporation that can do it.

A farmer could get licensed and certified.... sure at a hefty huge cost and with hardcore inspections that exceed the level of perfection required to opperate vs the shitty inspection jobs and regulations requried to run an actual corp owned facility.

It's not at all hard to see how this is working out.. what's happening.

They are FORCING while also "tricking" and mindfucking people into having to go to a central place to buy, use, sell, etc. everything. Purposely putting small businesses and making as difficult as possible for entrepenuers to get started let alone attempt to survive unless they are "allowed" to in those areas. They don't want small towns, they don't want people out in the country, The basic freedoms are being squashed, they want to make certain you have to spend enough to just do some of these relatively easy and what was considered nearly free if not free tasks.

It's rather sad, as the worst part is, the people that actually live in these small towns, mostly the baby boomers and younger aren't even aware of the distruction they have caused themselves and continue to harm themselves through passive aggressive nature of the big guys that are as responcible for it all. "Your more expensive than walmart, i'm driving to the city for the same product" ... at which point these same people bitch and moan about how the small towns are dieing and falling away.... they miss the streets filled with vehicles and multiple stores.. yet they insist on continueing to make certain that cash flow inside the community is stopped and instead funneled into the major cities that certainly don't need it.

One of my suppliers (if you can even call them that) was very confused because one recent fall they were busy beyond reason, they couldn't figure it out as the city at the time was having some major finicial issues and people had been laid off for years and moved away even. Business was unexpectedly booming and they couldn't figure it out.

What they didn't realize is the famers had a good crop year, GREAT crop year in fact, not only was the production amount good, quality good, but the prices were up closer to a fairer value.

When farmers have money, other people get money. Production level jobs that have good years, make certain EVERYONE else has a good year to. It's the actual proper flow of cash. Not bailouts and idiotic temp loans and crap.

Famers have money and typically start puchasing as a whole, billions of dollars worth of stuff, which then funds whom they buy to further employ people to meet the demand and increase wages and benefits which then in turn feeds the ability to purchase more product and supplies from others. It's the true domino system that provides the near expontential growth and well being.

IT's also the common reason for while past civilizations fall, Social discourse, sudden failure in farmland/famers due to usually political or class differentials (superiority complexes in which farmers suddenly get classed as the lowest form of person, or people that actually do the source manufacturing). Crops fail/production of necessities are poor quality and in low availability, Chaos ensues shortly and people start dropping, leaving the kings and the rich scratching their heads as to "why" it even happened in the first place and why they are starving now.

Today people move away for work (if they have any form of intelligence imo) When shit hits the fan, find a place where it hasn't yet or preferably won't. And with our entire world society so large as it is, BAD things like this can takes YEARS for the real effects to be felt , but also takes ages for good things to swing around as well.

Either way, in the end, the entire goal regardless of them actually admitting it or realizing it or not is total consolidation of everything.

they want everyone in major cities
they want to own everything
they want everyone to NEED them to even survive
and they want to make certain no one ever gets the chance to be a threat to them.

It's all about total absalute power and control. And it's clearly absalutely corrupting.

And as i have said in the past, nothing is worse than people actually believing this is a good thing, and needs to be defended/protected at all costs.

[blibbax]

Judas, I don't mean to be rude, but if you can cut that down to less than 100 words I'll read it. Sorry.

[Judas]

lol... i could do 100 words 17 times if you like.

[blibbax]

No, it's ok

[Callandor]

I read the whole thing and I think I aged 1 year while doing so.

[blibbax]

Originally Posted by Callandor

I read the whole thing and I think I aged 1 year while doing so.

You realise it's 2017? We all thought you were dead!

Did you know about all those defective clocks and laptop-bios-clocks sold in Canada in the early 2000s?

[Transk53]

Wonder if the Babbage engine may have brought computing forward had it succeeded.

[Callandor]

Originally Posted by blibbax

You realise it's 2017? We all thought you were dead!

Did you know about all those defective clocks and laptop-bios-clocks sold in Canada in the early 2000s?

Haha! Good one.

[Andrewebyy]

I think Babbage engine might have succeeded.