Article:Ati Drivers Put To The Test

tdd · Oct 20, 2003, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gremel
So what driver should I be using now for Flight Sim performance? The existing dirver that came with the 8250 Dell series computer or the 3.8 drivers?? I'm really confused...Regards, gremel

I used have an 8250 w/ a 9700 TX and most stable drivers I had were the Cat. 3.4's. Never played Flight Sim but you may want to try them.

Zardon · Oct 20, 2003, 04:05 PM

The 3.4 drivers were a good set overall but there have been alot of bug fixes since then, I think its worth trying the 3.7s or 3.8s

Dyre Straits · Oct 20, 2003, 04:12 PM

The 3.4 drivers were the last set before the 3.8 that allowed me to reboot my system without having to unplug the Video Out connection. Otherwise, I'd get an 'invalid sync' on my monitor and constant reboots or a system recovery message.

So far, my 8500 is working quite well with the Omega 'b' set. I have had CTD's, though, with Max Payne 2.

MaTT01 · Oct 20, 2003, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by WaltC
So your support does not involve code-level driver changes--only Terry and ATi can do that.

Yep and thats really too bad. I would be one happy camper if Omega had access to the source! LOL

Vengeance · Oct 20, 2003, 04:28 PM

Drivers, drivers, drivers

I don't know what to believe/think right now.
All I know is my PC is one stable, Rock solid P.O.S (piece of shit) COMPAQ!!!
That almost never crashes! (believe it or not, I don't care)
And the "Almost" part is usually my fault, like leaving my virus scanner running

But when I installed the Cat 3.8's I started to get lock-ups Hard ones

The new COD demo would freeze up and leave my desk top white washed looking.
3Dmark 2003 caused a Hard lock.......never did before.
I read somewhere that Omega's "new driver set" fixed it. So I tried them, Same thing!
So I went back to the Cat 3.7, And all is good

And "No" I didn't do it because of the COD demo, I had beat it a long time ago.
But I don't like having my PC lock up on me with anything. And it seems 100% more stable with the 3.7's.
I really liked the 3.8's too, they have a lot of new features, that are really nice, but I'm sure they will still be in the 3.9's.

WaltC, your post's once again are very well written and very informative, You seem like a very very smart man!
But you have to realize that what Omega does, he does for the community in general. And his work is very appreciated.
Here in DH and R3D as well. And he does give very good support on his driver sets.
I loved his set based on the 3.6 cats, I play a lot of MOH/SH and the Cat 3.6's had a lot of fps drops and crashes.
His release fixed this problem. How? I don't know nor do I care. All I know is they worked.
And thats whats important to me.

So can any of you very very smart gentlemen tell me why the Cat 3.8's would make my PC crash in 3DMark 2003 and with the COD demo?
And see another thing that I don't understand is at the time I installed the 3.8's I was still playing Splinter Cell.
And it ran great under the 3.8's, just as it did with the 3.7's.

Omegadrive · Oct 20, 2003, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by WaltC
Heh... Looks like I stepped on some ego here. Sorry, man....did not intend to do that...

My comments were strictly based on the findings NC presented here, that's all. To that end, I wasn't speculating, but just assuming that his data was correct--which shows that the 3.8.5's--at least as configured in the current Omegas--were causing a temp spike. If I was speculating it was in trying to imagine why a set of drivers would cause a temperature spike like the ones he reported, when the stock ATi 3.8's did not. Dell OEM ATi hardware *is* different from retail ATi hardware, so the theory is as good as any other I've heard. This point may or may not have validity as to this issue, I really couldn't say.

I notice that you have yet to formulate a theory of your own--what do you think might be responsible, assuming NC's data is correct?

I've been a beta tester myself for several pieces of software (mostly 3d fractal landscape generators) over the years, and so I'm not sure about the importance you ascribe to "beta testing" in general, since it doesn't involve making changes at the code level. That's what I meant about "support"; it's one thing to "beta test", it is quite another to fix problems in the driver code itself, which neither your or I can do. So your support does not involve code-level driver changes--only Terry and ATi can do that.

As far as I can determine, Terry's remarks concerning ATI's findings relative to the temperature readings concerned only the official 3.8 Catalyst release. If Terry was even looking at the 3.8.5 Dell's, he did not mention it in his statement. Yet NC's findings here seem to indicate the phenomenon is restricted to the Omegas based on the Dell 3.8.5's when they are used with retail ATi hardware. I didn't post the info in this thread so it's difficult to see why you might be "mad" with me for simply speculating on what might have caused the differences in temperatures as reported by NC in this thread when running Omegas based on the Dell 3.8.5's. People using your driver package who are reading this thread might appreciate your input here, as well.

Sorry about that bud, I had a really bad day and when I saw your comments, that did it...

If you see the new tests that NC did (a few posts later), you will see that the Dell drivers and my set have almost exactly the same temps, so, it's not my fault, the drivers are HOT and my drivers based on them should be too, but at least this set fixes a lot of problems present in the Cat 3.8 drivers for many people, that's why I used it. Remeber that these are BETA drivers, they where not made for the end user, and some features may be disabled or added for testing purposes only.
Also, the Dell hardware may be different, but the software IS the same, if not, then Dell users couldn't use the normal Catalyst drivers.

As for comenting on the heat issues, I can't say much, I'm under NDA and since the Dell drivers are basically the same beta drivers we test I can't comment until the Cat 3.9 are out.

The beta testers have an important roll on this since we are the bridge between the users and the software engineers, we look around in differnt forums and see the problems people have, we try to reproduce the problem in our PCs if we can, and if there is an bug, we report it, and as you may know a BETA tester report is more important than an user reporting the error, only when there are a LOT of reports from users, then the issue, if it is not reported by a beta tester (maybe because he/she doesn't have the game or can't reproduce the error), will have an impact. For example, many people reported problems with Morrowind using the Cat 3.8 and my 2.4.96b drivers, but I run Morrowind at home (full version with Tribunal and Bloodmoon + latest patch) and it works perfectly, no graphics corruption like the users mention, so I can't submit a bug I can't replicate.

Terry didn't comented on the Dell set because he is NOT allowed to talk about unsupported software, or worse, leaked beta software, "if" this issue continues with the release of the Cat 3.9, then he will comment about it. Also remember, may people here OC their cards and heat problems are more apparent that way, if they where running at stock speed, the heat isuue, crashes and dammaged cards would not exist, if people OC, they should be aware of the risks involved.

Chaos · Oct 20, 2003, 06:14 PM

If I do some temperature testing when I get home, what sets do you recommend....Cat 3.7, 3.8 and the Dell 3.8.5 Beta's

Zardon · Oct 20, 2003, 07:30 PM

[size=36px]ATIs official statement[/size]

Chaos · Oct 20, 2003, 07:39 PM

Well I guess there is no real point in running any tests after reading their official response.....I am gonna keep it in mind when the next set of Catalyst drivers appear and see if the issue is mentioned again.....

Mac Daddy · Oct 21, 2003, 02:04 AM

Omega .. WaltC .......... Thank you my brothers.

WaltC you seem like a friendly and kindhearted .. helpful sort of guy

Omega your reputation speaks for itself

Glad to see you guys Gel .. like both of you

As for NDA's and Beta testing .. I love testing Beta's!!
On the subject of ATI it's not a public BETA ..
Spent some time testing Mozilla BETAS .. cool stuff ..

Was a public BETA
Just my two cents

PPS: Read the official statement

DefaultUser · Oct 21, 2003, 11:53 PM

Nice work, but you really should straighten that picture and the wall

Mac Daddy · Oct 22, 2003, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DefaultUser
Nice work, but you really should straighten that picture and the wall

Now that is an observation that certainly hasn't been mentioned on this thread yet

Neon get your arse in gear and straighten that picture out

(kidding as always BRO

)

WELL .. it is crooked

This is just too funny

The_Neon_Cowboy · Oct 22, 2003, 02:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mac Daddy
Now that is an observation that certainly hasn't been mentioned on this thread yet

Neon get your arse in gear and straighten that picture out
(kidding as always BRO )

WELL .. it is crooked
This is just too funny

this whole aparment needs to be strightened up!

~~tenndevil~~ · Oct 22, 2003, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Why are you accusing? What do you mean we will deny? Do you think that if we really had ANY customer calls or any OEM's notifying of this that we (or me personally) would deny it? You sure dont know our business ethics very well do you?

So you think having a broken monitor and thinking it is our fault, and reporting it either via phone or email is a waste of time? Hmmmm.... ok then

"ATI supposedly receiving alot of RMA's right now, I dont know for sure"? ... Well if you dont know for sure I would recommend you stop speculating or talking about information which you are NOT privvy to. And for the record NO we are not facing alot of RMA's now

Why dont you PM me the name of the beta tester that only has counterstrike and quake III? Come on prove you have some insight that the rest of us lack. I hand pick the beta testers myself and I GUARANTEE that they all have and test at least 10 games each. Some of the beta testers have 100's of games. Want me to call them in here to attest to it? Wait maybe the DH moderators and site owners that are beta testers can come in here and speak to how many games they beta test.

Point of my post: STOP SPREADING RUMOURS WITHOUT FACTS. please?

#1: I am not accusing you of anything I am just reading and summarizing find a new punching bag, you are not all that and neither is ATI why should we believe your business (ATI's) ethics are better than anyone else?
#2: You sure didn't jump to quick to say why support emails aren't answered and why it costs 1.25 for support now did you?
#3: no problem, have to take your word for it.
#4 ahh now the pm's I have pmed you twice and like support emails, they went unanswered so whats the use?
I do alot of beta testing it is no easy task to do it right I don't need justification I have my own and know how I do it:
Dungeon Seige
Unreal 2
UT2003
NeverWinter Nights
SeriouSam TSE
Diablo2
Diablo2 Expansion
Devastaion
American Mcgee's Alice
Quake3
Quake 3 "Team Arena"
StarWars Jedi Knight 2
Return to Castle Wolfenstein
Grand Theft Auto 3
Warcraft 3
WarCraft 3 "Frozen Throne"
Half Life
Half-Life "Blue Shift"
Half-Life "Opposing Force"
Half-Life "Counter-Strike"
Aliens versus Predators
Aliens versus Predators 2
Aliens versus Predators 2 "Primal Hunt"
007 Nightfire
MorrowWind
RavenShield
Age Of Mythology
Divine Divinity
Soldiers of Anarchy
Sin
Sin "Wages of Sin"
Force 21
Urban Chaos
Quake 2
Soldier of Fortune 2 "Double Helix"
Delta Force "Black Hawk Down"
Serious Sam TFE
Daikatana
KISS "Psycho Circus"
Unreal
Unreal Tournement
Unreal "Return to NaPali"
Blood II "The Chosen"
Blood II The Chosen "Nightmare Levels"
Iron Storm
Star Wars Galactic BattleGrounds
Star Wars Galagtic BattleGrounds "The Clone Campaigns"
Viet Cong
I.G.I. 2 "Covert Strike"
Ghost Recon
Ghost Recon "Desert Siege"
Ghost Recon "Island Thunder"
Medal of Honor Allied Assault
Medal of Honor Allied Assault "SpearHead"
Medal of Honor Allied Assault "BrealThrough"
BattleField 1942
BattleField 1942 "The Road to Rome"
BattleField 1942 "Secret Weapons of World War II"
Delta Force "Task Force Dagger"
Global Operations
Delta Force 2
Soldier of Fortune
Clive Barkers "Undying"
Sim City 4
Sim City 4 "Rush Hour"
StarCraft
StarCraft "BroodWar"
Tribes 2
WarCraft II
GunMan Chronicals
Need for Speed HP2
Sum of All Fears
Heavy Metal F.A.K.K. II
Red Faction
Gore
Freelancer
Chaser
Will Rock
Max Payne 2

These are only the Games I have installed there are plenty more older ones packed in a box.
Plus the games I currently beta test but are covered by NDA.
I own an 9700 Pro AIW and have not been plagued and have not spread any rumors, just what I've seen here has basically stayed here, evidently you don't know my ethics, so that sword cuts both ways'.
I know this post will get deleted and I'll probably be banned, but I guess that would be too bad because CM won't get to see it and the answers to his questions.

You have it made here CM you can be as rude as you want and they protect you, but heaven forbid anyone put you to task.

Quote:

As for comenting on the heat issues, I can't say much, I'm under NDA and since the Dell drivers are basically the same beta drivers we test I can't comment until the Cat 3.9 are out

This would explain why the beta testers are so quiet, they have to be ATI has seen to it. As is standard practice for beta testers of anything.

johndoe74 · Nov 9, 2003, 02:31 PM

are we going to see some numbers on the now released 3.9 CATs ?

Zardon · Nov 9, 2003, 03:07 PM

over here

Oct 20, 2003, 04:28 PM	#95
Vengeance DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: Fort Worth TX Posts: 643 Rep Power: 0	Drivers, drivers, drivers I don't know what to believe/think right now. All I know is my PC is one stable, Rock solid P.O.S (piece of shit) COMPAQ!!! That almost never crashes! (believe it or not, I don't care) And the "Almost" part is usually my fault, like leaving my virus scanner running But when I installed the Cat 3.8's I started to get lock-ups Hard ones The new COD demo would freeze up and leave my desk top white washed looking. 3Dmark 2003 caused a Hard lock.......never did before. I read somewhere that Omega's "new driver set" fixed it. So I tried them, Same thing! So I went back to the Cat 3.7, And all is good And "No" I didn't do it because of the COD demo, I had beat it a long time ago. But I don't like having my PC lock up on me with anything. And it seems 100% more stable with the 3.7's. I really liked the 3.8's too, they have a lot of new features, that are really nice, but I'm sure they will still be in the 3.9's. WaltC, your post's once again are very well written and very informative, You seem like a very very smart man! But you have to realize that what Omega does, he does for the community in general. And his work is very appreciated. Here in DH and R3D as well. And he does give very good support on his driver sets. I loved his set based on the 3.6 cats, I play a lot of MOH/SH and the Cat 3.6's had a lot of fps drops and crashes. His release fixed this problem. How? I don't know nor do I care. All I know is they worked. And thats whats important to me. So can any of you very very smart gentlemen tell me why the Cat 3.8's would make my PC crash in 3DMark 2003 and with the COD demo? And see another thing that I don't understand is at the time I installed the 3.8's I was still playing Splinter Cell. And it ran great under the 3.8's, just as it did with the 3.7's. __________________ [color=red]Rage3D Super Moderator[/color] [color=red]BFG 6800 GT [/color]

Oct 20, 2003, 06:14 PM	#97
Chaos Number Nine Join Date: May 2002 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 5,268 Rep Power: 167 System Specs	If I do some temperature testing when I get home, what sets do you recommend....Cat 3.7, 3.8 and the Dell 3.8.5 Beta's __________________

Oct 20, 2003, 07:39 PM	#99
Chaos Number Nine Join Date: May 2002 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 5,268 Rep Power: 167 System Specs	Well I guess there is no real point in running any tests after reading their official response.....I am gonna keep it in mind when the next set of Catalyst drivers appear and see if the issue is mentioned again..... __________________

Oct 21, 2003, 02:04 AM	#100
Mac Daddy DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 7,950 Rep Power: 80 System Specs	Whew !!!! Omega .. WaltC .......... Thank you my brothers. WaltC you seem like a friendly and kindhearted .. helpful sort of guy Omega your reputation speaks for itself Glad to see you guys Gel .. like both of you As for NDA's and Beta testing .. I love testing Beta's!! On the subject of ATI it's not a public BETA .. Spent some time testing Mozilla BETAS .. cool stuff .. Was a public BETA Just my two cents PPS: Read the official statement __________________ "My mom said the only reason men are alive is for lawn care and vehicle maintenance." - Tim Allen

Oct 20, 2003, 04:05 PM	#92
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	The 3.4 drivers were a good set overall but there have been alot of bug fixes since then, I think its worth trying the 3.7s or 3.8s

Oct 20, 2003, 07:30 PM	#98
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	[size=36px]ATIs official statement[/size]

Oct 21, 2003, 11:53 PM	#101
DefaultUser DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 1 Rep Power: 0	Nice work, but you really should straighten that picture and the wall

Nov 9, 2003, 02:31 PM	#105
johndoe74 DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 25 Rep Power: 0	are we going to see some numbers on the now released 3.9 CATs ?

Nov 9, 2003, 03:07 PM	#106
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 179	over here