DH Article: ATI's Crossfire Discussed

Zardon · May 31, 2005, 01:28 PM

Its been a long time coming but ATI have finally answered the call of Nvidia's SLI with the release of their dual card technology codenamed "Crossfire". Right now we dont have a suitable test rig to bring you figures or results but rest assured when samples are made available we will be bringing you the full rundown. For now Ill go over the information presented to me at a recent meeting and how you should expect Crossfire to improve your gaming experience. At the end of the article ill include an ATI Q&A session which will answer a good selection of questions and act as a reference.

Read here

Mort_Cinder · May 31, 2005, 01:32 PM

thanx for the article, very informative

bananaman · May 31, 2005, 02:20 PM

good article - solution doesnt seem like the most elegant, but looks like it will work ok

one thing i am liking the sound (excuse pun) is the HD Audio on AMD - does this mean DDL encoding - is this the new soundstorm!!!

nana

Asmoday · May 31, 2005, 02:40 PM

cool!

Falstaff · May 31, 2005, 02:41 PM

I can see that ATI and NVIDA will be neck and neck on this technology until a newer generation of cards will surpass this particuler approach, it can only get better, cant wait to see the benchmarkis.....

Vikingod · May 31, 2005, 03:18 PM

Cant wait for the benchmarks, great article.

knuth · May 31, 2005, 03:20 PM

A real teaser Zardon.

Im wondering what intel chipsets have been tested to work with crossfire, it sounds like it could save one from having to purchase a new (ATI) motherboard. The extreme levels of anti-aliasing are what im really curious about, with all that rendering power it makes sense that you'd need something that extreme to use it all.

riles9262 · May 31, 2005, 03:40 PM

Thanks for the article guys. This looks pretty exciting, especially if the performance is not driver dependent.

pr0digal jenius · May 31, 2005, 04:40 PM

oh I do hope it works on nForce boards....that'd be funny as hell

zamac_man · May 31, 2005, 04:49 PM

can't wait to see the benches

mike2h · May 31, 2005, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0digal jenius

oh I do hope it works on nForce boards....that'd be funny as hell

yeh it would

, but no way. different design.

bake15 · May 31, 2005, 06:27 PM

Nice preview Allan, looks like im gonna be upgrading again(a lot sooner than i thought

)

Drakon · May 31, 2005, 06:42 PM

Does that board have room for a sound card? It didn't seem so in those pictures...

Lowfat · May 31, 2005, 08:36 PM

Finally I must say. It kind of makes me angry that the Intel mobo's will have an onboard video while the AMD's will not.. and bananaman, I believe the HD audio is the same as the ones that some Intel chipsets use, the Azalia codec. Which i believe does encode Dolby Digital.

YAYitsAndrew · May 31, 2005, 08:44 PM

Crossfire, you'll get caught up in the
Crossfire
(dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun)
Crossfire...
Crossfire......
CROSSFIRE!!!!!
*explosions*
"Yeah!"

Anyone else thinking of the old board game right now?

Lelisevis · May 31, 2005, 10:18 PM

Love ATI, Love Nvidia. Dont love having a £350 AGP X800XT sitting here that will not be able to take advantage of this technology. I'd love to see a mainboard manufacturer bring out a hybrid board which would ease the already slow transition to PCI-E and allow us to combine the two technologies (agp and pci-e). Im sure there would be a massive market for this. Very much doubt that will happen though as when was the last time a major manufacturer gave something back to it's user base?
Might seem fantasy but consider the recent board that supports both intel and amd processors.
On a side note HOW MUCH HEAT WILL THIS GENERATE LOL

Vapor · Jun 1, 2005, 12:12 AM

Any word on multimonitor or widescreen compatibilty?

BWX · Jun 1, 2005, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vapor

Any word on multi-monitor or wide-screen compatibility?

I was wondering the same thing- Imagine FINALLY being able to have one main screen and one screen on each side like the Matrox card failed at (with any performance)

Imagine being able to play all your games (FPS, race sim, flight sim, etc) with 3 screens, all running fairly high resolution and AA and AF..

Also if that ever does become a reality, I think it would be great to run the main center screen at a higher resolution and different graphic settings than the two outer screens.

If you want to turn and shoot the guy you see on one of the outer screens, you just move him into the more detailed center monitor..

Kind of like the way our own vision works- peripheral vision is not nearly as detailed as the inner 30 degrees or so, so in a system like that, the outer screens could be made just to see whats going on around you (if you want it like that)..

Maybe they could use the main master-card to render the main screen, and the slave card to run the two outer screens, or something like that. It seems like it would be possible with all that horsepower under the hood.

Maybe I am just dreaming like Lelisevis who wants a mobo to support crossfire in AGP and PCI-e at the same time. But features like this would be really cool. So close, yet so far...

BWX · Jun 1, 2005, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0digal jenius

oh I do hope it works on nForce boards....that'd be funny as hell

Quote:

As some of you had already expected you will need a new motherboard, this will be based on a new ATI Chipset codenamed RD and RS480, for Amd and Intel solutions.

Fraid not!

Vapor · Jun 1, 2005, 01:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWX

I was wondering the same thing- Imagine FINALLY being able to have one main screen and one screen on each side like the Matrox card failed at (with any performance)

Imagine being able to play all your games (FPS, race sim, flight sim, etc) with 3 screens, all running fairly high resolution and AA and AF..

Also if that ever does become a reality, I think it would be great to run the main center screen at a higher resolution and different graphic settings than the two outer screens.

If you want to turn and shoot the guy you see on one of the outer screens, you just move him into the more detailed center monitor..

Kind of like the way our own vision works- peripheral vision is not nearly as detailed as the inner 30 degrees or so, so in a system like that, the outer screens could be made just to see whats going on around you (if you want it like that)..

Maybe they could use the main master-card to render the main screen, and the slave card to run the two outer screens, or something like that. It seems like it would be possible with all that horsepower under the hood.

Maybe I am just dreaming like Lelisevis who wants a mobo to support crossfire in AGP and PCI-e at the same time. But features like this would be really cool. So close, yet so far...

Wasn't quite thinking about games, per se (but the prospect of multimonitor gaming with actual performance is interesting, to say the least), but rather just regular old multimonitor and widescreen support that is lacking in SLI right now.

Necrosis · Jun 1, 2005, 01:59 AM

Still not quite sure why you would need a special motherboard since the master card and dongle does all the communication, and setup for rendering?

BWX · Jun 1, 2005, 02:21 AM

Yeah - but they have two PCI-e x 8 slots. And some of the info passes through the slots right?

Necrosis · Jun 1, 2005, 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BWX

Yeah - but they have two PCI-e x 8 slots. And some of the info passes through the slots right?

I have two 16x slots but I don't have an SLI board, it's little brother to be exact. I wonder if it's possible to mod an nforce 4 board to do 16x(2)? 8x would be slower of course but I suppose nvidia pci-e boards are also supposed to work too. What I mean is a single nvidia GPU should work. Over all I don't seem all that impressed with it so far. I would love to get my hands on some schematics for both boards. Also note ATI said they may look at nforce 4 boards later on so who knows. I think it would be a great idea on ATI's behalf to make this also work with nforce 4 boards. It would be funny, and a great business tactic.

somekindazombie · Jun 1, 2005, 05:22 AM

Assuming we can't get ATI's Crossfire working on an nforce 4 mobo then I must say I have to hold off to hear more about ATI's new mobos before I get too excited about this. I don't know about you guys but I believe a mobo is a pretty important part of any system. ATI's current mobo isn't up to par with nvidia's offerings, and it would make sence since it was their first attempt in the market. Nvidia has proven that they can make solid mobos with incredible performance and features. If ATI's second generation of mobos have the performance, feature set, and price to equal or even out do the incredible nforce 4 family of chipsets then count me onboard for this Crossfire stuff.

Sandok · Jun 1, 2005, 01:14 PM

wow a really interesting topic I just found... Seems there is a better way to have two X850XTs running without the need of the real crossfire...

http://www.techreport.com/onearticle.x/8390

I'd rather go DFI way than the dongle way!

Falstaff · Jun 1, 2005, 01:35 PM

yes, this will usher interest for specific boards that can handle either card....for a little while...I dont see either Nvidia or ATI approach lasting more than a year or so...

bug77 · Jun 1, 2005, 03:13 PM

Boasting Supertiling and saying that a 16 pipes has to use only 12 to match a 12 pipes card... Fishy.

Zardon · Jun 1, 2005, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bug77

Boasting Supertiling and saying that a 16 pipes has to use only 12 to match a 12 pipes card... Fishy.

Well im not sure "fishy" is fair. the cards need to have matching pipes to render the scenes correctly. If you think about it, if you had a 16 pipe crossfire card and a 12 pipe X800 pro running together at their native pipeline configuration you would be presented with massive issues in regards to rendering differences.

I agree its not ideal but there really is no other way to do it. Think about NV's SLI - not only do you need to have the pipes the same on purchase you need the same manufacturers cards and bioses !

Sandok · Jun 1, 2005, 03:24 PM

ya very true... I read that NV pdf and it was really just quite sucky... I mean, yes we need a mother card but then ANY card works... Unlike SLI

mike2h · Jun 1, 2005, 06:27 PM

by 'any card' i assume you mean same series but differnet manafacturer, not literally any card.

May 31, 2005, 01:28 PM	#1
Zardon DriverHeaven Founder Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 32,480 Rep Power: 177	DH Article: ATI's Crossfire Discussed Its been a long time coming but ATI have finally answered the call of Nvidia's SLI with the release of their dual card technology codenamed "Crossfire". Right now we dont have a suitable test rig to bring you figures or results but rest assured when samples are made available we will be bringing you the full rundown. For now Ill go over the information presented to me at a recent meeting and how you should expect Crossfire to improve your gaming experience. At the end of the article ill include an ATI Q&A session which will answer a good selection of questions and act as a reference. Read here

May 31, 2005, 02:20 PM	#3
bananaman banana muncher Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: London Posts: 1,254 Rep Power: 59	good article - solution doesnt seem like the most elegant, but looks like it will work ok one thing i am liking the sound (excuse pun) is the HD Audio on AMD - does this mean DDL encoding - is this the new soundstorm!!! nana __________________

May 31, 2005, 02:40 PM	#4
Asmoday Demonic Join Date: May 2002 Location: In the cold, dark north... Posts: 5,198 Rep Power: 90 System Specs	cool! __________________ How You can help Hardwareheaven by using Digg

May 31, 2005, 02:41 PM	#5
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,047 Rep Power: 206	I can see that ATI and NVIDA will be neck and neck on this technology until a newer generation of cards will surpass this particuler approach, it can only get better, cant wait to see the benchmarkis..... __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 31, 2005, 03:18 PM	#6
Vikingod Int'l Fish Liaison Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: By the light of lamp I sit and type... Posts: 16,187 Rep Power: 109 System Specs	Cant wait for the benchmarks, great article. __________________ *How You Can Help DriverHeaven By Using Digg*

May 31, 2005, 01:32 PM	#2
Mort_Cinder I want some ATI lovin' Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: MK, UK Posts: 1,034 Rep Power: 0	thanx for the article, very informative

May 31, 2005, 03:20 PM	#7
knuth DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Johannesburg, South Africa Posts: 73 Rep Power: 0	A real teaser Zardon. Im wondering what intel chipsets have been tested to work with crossfire, it sounds like it could save one from having to purchase a new (ATI) motherboard. The extreme levels of anti-aliasing are what im really curious about, with all that rendering power it makes sense that you'd need something that extreme to use it all.

May 31, 2005, 03:40 PM	#8
riles9262 Driverheaven brewmaster Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: British Columbia, Canada Posts: 4,842 Rep Power: 70 System Specs	Thanks for the article guys. This looks pretty exciting, especially if the performance is not driver dependent. __________________ A beer a day keeps the doctor away.

May 31, 2005, 04:40 PM	#9
pr0digal jenius Delete Me Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 14,648 Rep Power: 0	oh I do hope it works on nForce boards....that'd be funny as hell

May 31, 2005, 04:49 PM	#10
zamac_man DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 63 Rep Power: 0	can't wait to see the benches

May 31, 2005, 06:27 PM	#12
bake15 DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wigan,UK Posts: 582 Rep Power: 0	Nice preview Allan, looks like im gonna be upgrading again(a lot sooner than i thought )

May 31, 2005, 06:42 PM	#13
Drakon DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Floatin'... Posts: 4,957 Rep Power: 56	Does that board have room for a sound card? It didn't seem so in those pictures...

May 31, 2005, 08:36 PM	#14
Lowfat Xtreme Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Grande Prairie, AB, Can Posts: 4,251 Rep Power: 99	Finally I must say. It kind of makes me angry that the Intel mobo's will have an onboard video while the AMD's will not.. and bananaman, I believe the HD audio is the same as the ones that some Intel chipsets use, the Azalia codec. Which i believe does encode Dolby Digital. __________________ 27" iMac: i5 750 * 80GB X25-M G1 * 4GB DDR3 * HD4850 Stacker: 2600k * P8P67 Pro * 4GB DDR3 * 80GB ioXtreme * 30GB X25-E * (2) HD6950 * Asus D2 * Enermax Revo85+ HWD: (2) Xeon E5649 * EVGA SR-2 * 6GB DDR3 * 8800GTS * 1000W Antec FT01BW: (2) Xeon E5645 * EVGA SR-2 * 6GB DDR3 * GTS210 * Gigabyte 800W Odin GT Storage: (2) Sans Digital TR8M-B * 29TB

May 31, 2005, 08:44 PM	#15
YAYitsAndrew Anti-Piracy Poster Boy Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NJ Posts: 2,605 Rep Power: 77 System Specs	Crossfire, you'll get caught up in the Crossfire (dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun) Crossfire... Crossfire...... CROSSFIRE!!!!! explosions "Yeah!" Anyone else thinking of the old board game right now? __________________ "It is because the resistance to paying for copyrighted material, although often characterized as arising from a supposed technical burden or principled concern for the public interest, arises rather from exactly the same segment of the brain that is dominant in shoplifters." - Mark Helprin, Digital Barbarism In other words, it's never okay to steal even if you think you have a good reason! www.yayitsandrew.com

May 31, 2005, 10:18 PM	#16
Lelisevis Howlin at the moon Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,663 Rep Power: 0	Love ATI, Love Nvidia. Dont love having a £350 AGP X800XT sitting here that will not be able to take advantage of this technology. I'd love to see a mainboard manufacturer bring out a hybrid board which would ease the already slow transition to PCI-E and allow us to combine the two technologies (agp and pci-e). Im sure there would be a massive market for this. Very much doubt that will happen though as when was the last time a major manufacturer gave something back to it's user base? Might seem fantasy but consider the recent board that supports both intel and amd processors. On a side note HOW MUCH HEAT WILL THIS GENERATE LOL

Jun 1, 2005, 12:12 AM	#17
Vapor DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: CT and UMich Posts: 85 Rep Power: 0	Any word on multimonitor or widescreen compatibilty? __________________

Jun 1, 2005, 01:59 AM	#21
Necrosis HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,838 Rep Power: 129 System Specs	Still not quite sure why you would need a special motherboard since the master card and dongle does all the communication, and setup for rendering?

Jun 1, 2005, 02:21 AM	#22
BWX unplugged Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: USNY Posts: 19,665 Rep Power: 109 System Specs	Yeah - but they have two PCI-e x 8 slots. And some of the info passes through the slots right? __________________

Jun 1, 2005, 05:22 AM	#24
somekindazombie DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 11 Rep Power: 0	Assuming we can't get ATI's Crossfire working on an nforce 4 mobo then I must say I have to hold off to hear more about ATI's new mobos before I get too excited about this. I don't know about you guys but I believe a mobo is a pretty important part of any system. ATI's current mobo isn't up to par with nvidia's offerings, and it would make sence since it was their first attempt in the market. Nvidia has proven that they can make solid mobos with incredible performance and features. If ATI's second generation of mobos have the performance, feature set, and price to equal or even out do the incredible nforce 4 family of chipsets then count me onboard for this Crossfire stuff.

Jun 1, 2005, 01:14 PM	#25
Sandok DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 9,472 Rep Power: 66	wow a really interesting topic I just found... Seems there is a better way to have two X850XTs running without the need of the real crossfire... http://www.techreport.com/onearticle.x/8390 I'd rather go DFI way than the dongle way!

Jun 1, 2005, 01:35 PM	#26
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,047 Rep Power: 206	yes, this will usher interest for specific boards that can handle either card....for a little while...I dont see either Nvidia or ATI approach lasting more than a year or so... __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Jun 1, 2005, 03:13 PM	#27
bug77 DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: around Posts: 792 Rep Power: 0	Boasting Supertiling and saying that a 16 pipes has to use only 12 to match a 12 pipes card... Fishy.

Jun 1, 2005, 03:24 PM	#29
Sandok DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 9,472 Rep Power: 66	ya very true... I read that NV pdf and it was really just quite sucky... I mean, yes we need a mother card but then ANY card works... Unlike SLI

Jun 1, 2005, 06:27 PM	#30
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 89 System Specs	by 'any card' i assume you mean same series but differnet manafacturer, not literally any card. __________________