PC1066 question

Rasta Monsta · Jun 23, 2003, 07:15 PM

I cannot get my FSB over 140 (see sig for rig), even running vCore up to 1.65. I suspect that the memory is the culprit, and am considering the option of slowing down the memory in BIOS to "PC800" level (200 MHz X 2 X 2).

If this allows me to get 150-160 FSB, would that gain be offset by slower running memory? If I hit 155, say, that is a 16.5% overclock of the CPU, but would give me memory running at 932, a little over 87% of normally clocked "PC1066" (or, a 12%+ underclock).

Confused yet? Any opinions?

TIA,

rasta

p.s. Yeah, yeah, the thing is already brutally fast, but I am a tweaker, dammit!

~~Crash Override~~ · Jun 23, 2003, 10:58 PM

tried knocking down the multiplier a bit?

a cpu with a faster FSB even at the same final speed is still faster than it would be at a lower FSB

AshG · Jun 23, 2003, 11:01 PM

IMHo, and I'll try to check this out with one of my friends ont he Dark Side later, pumping up the FSB but dropping the memory clock won't result in too much of a benefit. No matter how fast the data gets to the RAM, it doesn't matter if the RAM can't turn it right back around. It might be better to stay at PC1066 and deal with the lower FSB.

Personally, I'd bench where you are right now and then compare it to yourcurrent plan. if it comes out better, cool; if not, you know what to go back to. I'll look into this a little more...

~~shai~~ · Jun 23, 2003, 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Crash Override
tried knocking down the multiplier a bit?

a cpu with a faster FSB even at the same final speed is still faster than it would be at a lower FSB

hmm hmm
you cant do that with a p4...

~~Crash Override~~ · Jun 24, 2003, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by shai
hmm hmm
you cant do that with a p4...

you cant lower the multiplier on a P4?

Kgentatszu] · Jun 24, 2003, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Crash Override
you cant lower the multiplier on a P4?

yes that's right....it is NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE to unlock a P4 processor UNLESS you have the so called "engineering" version.....

Dom · Jun 24, 2003, 07:32 AM

I don't think you can, I couldn't on my old board either.

JavaFox · Jun 24, 2003, 08:02 AM

You cannot manipulate a P4's multiplier.

mike2h · Jun 25, 2003, 06:16 PM

most 1066 rdram will run at 1200. so it is possible it is something else. does your bios allow for adjusting of the pci/agp divider? my 850 does not so that is my limitation(1500 @1650).

Kgentatszu] · Jun 25, 2003, 06:24 PM

since this tread is 'bout 1066 ram..........sorry to hijack you Rasta Monsta but i just cant help it.....ok, guys, what's the difference between pc2100, 2400, 2700, 3000, 3200, 3500, 3700 and pc800, pc1066?? which is better?? the pc800, 1066 are supposed to be better right??(cause they are a few times faster, but then why is the production stopped??

Rasta Monsta · Jun 25, 2003, 08:37 PM

Mike - no adjustment of any dividers on my MB. What type of RAM you got?

Max - I will answer RDRAM and let someone else answer DDR.

PC800 is dual channel RAM for 400 FSB chipsets supporting RDRAM. PC1066 is the same, except it is for 533 FSB chipsets (like mine). It is being phased out because of its high cost, and development of dual memory controllers for DDR (the new dual channel chipsets like i865 & i875). At the time I put together my i850e rig with PC1066, it provided by far the highest memory bandwidth available. Sadly, the new stuff I mentioned above is cheaper and faster.

rasta

mike2h · Jun 26, 2003, 06:55 AM

pc800. that could be your problem the ide & agp bus are very limited to overclocking. you are partially wrong about ddr being cheaper & faster. high quality 400+ ddr is expensive. the main reason the 865 & 875 are faster is because they are much newer tech. if you applied the same tech to a rambus 1066 or 1200 board, well just look at how old the 850 is & how long its various incarnations were the performance kings with p4.
you are positive there is no way to adjust the agp or ide ratio on that board?what brand of memory do you have? there was some overclocked pc800 being sold as pc1066. wich it will run at, just no room for overclocking.

Rasta Monsta · Jun 27, 2003, 07:26 PM

My memory is Kingston PC1066.

Crucial 'hot' ddr is $109 for 512 mb, and while 256 mb of the above RDRAM is $111.

The "much newer tech" in the i865 & i875 you refer to is dual memory controllers, like the i850e.

There are no divider adjustments on my mainboard (manual HERE if you want to see if I missed something). Even so, my current overclock is just 5%, and I have not heard of a PCI bus being that sensititive to overclocking.

james

Volvoxx · Jun 28, 2003, 01:51 AM

Rasta, I suspect that it might be due to heat. I have almost exactly the same setup as you and I had random BSOD. It came about when I tried installing the faster PC1200 16bit RDRam from OCZ. Anyway...I am now able to push my 2.4B GHz to 2.8 GHz (vCore @ 1.6, FSB @ 156MHz). Try taking off the side panels to your system...that solved my problem.

mjh8227 · Jun 30, 2003, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maxxypoos
what's the difference between pc2100, 2400, 2700, 3000, 3200, 3500, 3700

PC2100 = 266Mhz
PC2400 = 300Mhz
PC2700 = 333Mhz
PC3000 = 366Mhz
PC3200 = 400Mhz
PC3500 = 433Mhz
PC3700 = 466Mhz

I believe the naming scheme refers to the module's bandwith i.e. pc2100 = 2.1GB per second, pc3200 = 3.2GB per second, etc...
I think they named it this way (instead of PC266, PC300, ..., PC466) because Rambus was naming their modules PC600, PC700, etc. and they wanted to sound faster....very confusing though

Kgentatszu] · Jun 30, 2003, 09:12 AM

mjh8227, thankz mate, but isnt the faster the better???

JavaFox · Jun 30, 2003, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maxxypoos
mjh8227, thankz mate, but isnt the faster the better???

Generally, yes, but on the nForce2, no. Synchronous is better than asynchronous.

Kgentatszu] · Jun 30, 2003, 09:40 AM

what 'bout on intel's??? actually, which one's better?? how can i compare them against each other?? if those Rambus memory have high frequencies, then what do those DDr memory have to match against them??

JavaFox · Jun 30, 2003, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maxxypoos
what 'bout on intel's??? actually, which one's better?? how can i compare them against each other?? if those Rambus memory have high frequencies, then what do those DDr memory have to match against them??

Industry support. Rambus has been dropped by Intel. While I think this isn't the last we'll see of RMBS, for the time being, they are not being used.

Kgentatszu] · Jun 30, 2003, 11:11 AM

javafox, how do i compare them?? this may sound confusing.....like, PC1200 runs @ 1200Mhz right??, so does that mean that it is 3 times better than PC3200??

Dom · Jun 30, 2003, 11:14 AM

PC1200?

Kgentatszu] · Jun 30, 2003, 11:17 AM

hmmmm......i thought i saw that somewhere....anywhere, maybe not.......how 'bout lets make it PC1066, shall we??

Dom · Jun 30, 2003, 11:28 AM

Well, PC1066 runs at 1066Mhz and PC3200 at 200Mhz (400Mhz DDR). The difference in speed between the two is marginal. Kinda like a P4 2200Mhz CPU compared to an Athlon XP 1800Mhz CPU, performance rating thing, I guess.

Rambus is designed for P4s, no AMD CPUs use RDRAM. No matter how fast the RAM, the FSB can only take in infomation so fast, regardless of how fast it's being sent.

Kgentatszu] · Jun 30, 2003, 11:43 AM

hmmm.........thankz everyone, for answering so many questions of mine.....speaking of DDRs on Intels, should i set them to synchronous to yield the best performance?? or is it better to set them to asynchronous on intels'?? cause i'm asynchronising my setup at the moment.................. by the way, on non-dual channel Mobo, is there such thing as "put your memory on the second slot for better results"??

Rasta Monsta · Jul 4, 2003, 05:10 AM

I have finally found the answer, in an article here.

I think I will try to dial down the memory to PC800 levels, and crank the FSB as I originally thought to do

. I'll let you know how it oges.

Thanks to all who answered!!

Peace,

rasta

Jun 23, 2003, 11:01 PM	#3
AshG Gadget Life Owner Join Date: May 2002 Location: East TN Posts: 139 Rep Power: 0	IMHo, and I'll try to check this out with one of my friends ont he Dark Side later, pumping up the FSB but dropping the memory clock won't result in too much of a benefit. No matter how fast the data gets to the RAM, it doesn't matter if the RAM can't turn it right back around. It might be better to stay at PC1066 and deal with the lower FSB. Personally, I'd bench where you are right now and then compare it to yourcurrent plan. if it comes out better, cool; if not, you know what to go back to. I'll look into this a little more... __________________ [color=navy]404_Error, Signature not found[/color] [color=black][color=black]AMD AthlonXP 2500 @ 11x200[/color] - [color=navy]DFI LanParty nForce2 Ultra Rev. B[/color] - [color=black]Thermalright SLK-900A w/ Thermaltake SmartFan[/color] - [color=navy]Corsair TwinX1024 3200XLL[/color] - [color=black]FIC Radeon 9800 Pro[/color] - [color=navy]Hitachi Deskstar 7K250 SATA[/color] - [color=black]WD Raptor 36GB[/color] - [color=navy]LiteOn SOHW-832S[/color] - [color=black]PC Power and Cooling 510W Deluxe[/color] - [color=navy]CoolerMaster CMStacker Case[/color][/color]

Jun 25, 2003, 06:16 PM	#9
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	most 1066 rdram will run at 1200. so it is possible it is something else. does your bios allow for adjusting of the pci/agp divider? my 850 does not so that is my limitation(1500 @1650). __________________

Jun 26, 2003, 06:55 AM	#12
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	Rasta Monsta pc800. that could be your problem the ide & agp bus are very limited to overclocking. you are partially wrong about ddr being cheaper & faster. high quality 400+ ddr is expensive. the main reason the 865 & 875 are faster is because they are much newer tech. if you applied the same tech to a rambus 1066 or 1200 board, well just look at how old the 850 is & how long its various incarnations were the performance kings with p4. you are positive there is no way to adjust the agp or ide ratio on that board?what brand of memory do you have? there was some overclocked pc800 being sold as pc1066. wich it will run at, just no room for overclocking. __________________

Jun 28, 2003, 01:51 AM	#14
Volvoxx DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 2 Rep Power: 0	Rasta, I suspect that it might be due to heat. I have almost exactly the same setup as you and I had random BSOD. It came about when I tried installing the faster PC1200 16bit RDRam from OCZ. Anyway...I am now able to push my 2.4B GHz to 2.8 GHz (vCore @ 1.6, FSB @ 156MHz). Try taking off the side panels to your system...that solved my problem. __________________ \| Gigabyte 8IHXP - Bios Version F8 \| Intel P4 2.4B GHz (@2.8GHz) \| 512MB PC1200 RDRam - OCZ 256MB x2 \| \| 120GB (2x WD600JB) in RAID0 \| 1x 60GB IBM/Hitachi Deskstar 7200RPM (Backup) \| \| Radeon 9700 Pro 128MB (@ 325/310Stock) \| SB Audigy Platinum \| \| Sony M51 15" Flatscreen Monitor \| Cambridge Soundworks 5.1 DTT3500 \|

Jun 23, 2003, 10:58 PM	#2
~~Crash Override~~ Banned Join Date: May 2002 Location: Olympia, WA Posts: 2,448 Rep Power: 0	tried knocking down the multiplier a bit? a cpu with a faster FSB even at the same final speed is still faster than it would be at a lower FSB

Jun 24, 2003, 07:32 AM	#7
Dom DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 12,940 Rep Power: 0	I don't think you can, I couldn't on my old board either.

Jun 24, 2003, 08:02 AM	#8
JavaFox E Pluribus Unum Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 3,203 Rep Power: 0	You cannot manipulate a P4's multiplier.

Jun 25, 2003, 06:24 PM	#10
Kgentatszu] DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,802 Rep Power: 0	since this tread is 'bout 1066 ram..........sorry to hijack you Rasta Monsta but i just cant help it.....ok, guys, what's the difference between pc2100, 2400, 2700, 3000, 3200, 3500, 3700 and pc800, pc1066?? which is better?? the pc800, 1066 are supposed to be better right??(cause they are a few times faster, but then why is the production stopped??

Jun 30, 2003, 09:12 AM	#16
Kgentatszu] DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,802 Rep Power: 0	mjh8227, thankz mate, but isnt the faster the better???

Jun 30, 2003, 09:40 AM	#18
Kgentatszu] DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,802 Rep Power: 0	what 'bout on intel's??? actually, which one's better?? how can i compare them against each other?? if those Rambus memory have high frequencies, then what do those DDr memory have to match against them??

Jun 30, 2003, 11:11 AM	#20
Kgentatszu] DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,802 Rep Power: 0	javafox, how do i compare them?? this may sound confusing.....like, PC1200 runs @ 1200Mhz right??, so does that mean that it is 3 times better than PC3200??

Jun 30, 2003, 11:14 AM	#21
Dom DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 12,940 Rep Power: 0	PC1200?

Jun 30, 2003, 11:17 AM	#22
Kgentatszu] DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,802 Rep Power: 0	hmmmm......i thought i saw that somewhere....anywhere, maybe not.......how 'bout lets make it PC1066, shall we??

Jun 30, 2003, 11:28 AM	#23
Dom DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 12,940 Rep Power: 0	Well, PC1066 runs at 1066Mhz and PC3200 at 200Mhz (400Mhz DDR). The difference in speed between the two is marginal. Kinda like a P4 2200Mhz CPU compared to an Athlon XP 1800Mhz CPU, performance rating thing, I guess. Rambus is designed for P4s, no AMD CPUs use RDRAM. No matter how fast the RAM, the FSB can only take in infomation so fast, regardless of how fast it's being sent.

Jun 30, 2003, 11:43 AM	#24
Kgentatszu] DriverHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 1,802 Rep Power: 0	hmmm.........thankz everyone, for answering so many questions of mine.....speaking of DDRs on Intels, should i set them to synchronous to yield the best performance?? or is it better to set them to asynchronous on intels'?? cause i'm asynchronising my setup at the moment.................. by the way, on non-dual channel Mobo, is there such thing as "put your memory on the second slot for better results"??