I hate intelligent design

Falstaff

fine then...we are ordering pizza!

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Maddogg6

But YOU ARE part of the same gene pool. (how unfortunate for us ape relatives)

And SO typical of one who looses ground in a debate - resorting to name calling.... How childish.

sixscrews

Some random observations:

If there's stupid design why can't there be intelligent design?

'Intelligent Design' sounds like 'Best Practices' - practice is something you do because you didn't get it right the first time, so design is something you do because the first time wasn't planned.

Why does God/Dog have to be intelligent?

ss

YAYitsAndrew

Tell your teachers we're not all like that

__________________
"It is because the resistance to paying for copyrighted material, although often characterized as arising from a supposed technical burden or principled concern for the public interest, arises rather from exactly the same segment of the brain that is dominant in shoplifters."
- Mark Helprin, Digital Barbarism
In other words, it's never okay to steal even if you think you have a good reason!

www.yayitsandrew.com

YAYitsAndrew

There was a good article in an issue of discover recently about our relationship with monkeys that was very thought provoking. I'll see if it's publically accessible and get you a link if it is.

edit: here it is, but you need to be a subscriber.
http://www.discover.com/issues/apr-0.../chimp-genome/

__________________
"It is because the resistance to paying for copyrighted material, although often characterized as arising from a supposed technical burden or principled concern for the public interest, arises rather from exactly the same segment of the brain that is dominant in shoplifters."
- Mark Helprin, Digital Barbarism
In other words, it's never okay to steal even if you think you have a good reason!

www.yayitsandrew.com

Falstaff

then I am not special?......
oh god...

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BWX

Actually I was just trying to give you guys a bit of comic relief after I single handedly and totally trumped any and all of your collective arguments and/or "so called proof" of macro evolution as a "scientific fact"..

It is funny that you guys have no response to that...


Hey- and when did I call you names?
What names did I call you? Relatives of monkeys? That's what you are rabidly trying to prove! LOL


Poor Sandok said at least 3 times he is done with this thread but keeps coming back for more intellectual punishment.. hahaha..

You monkey descendant types really crack me up!

You are direct descendants of monkeys right? Isn't that what you are saying?

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Maddogg6

first off - I wasn't trying to prove we evolved from anything - just that evolving makes MORE sense than ID. NOTHING has been proven eitherway.

Did I claim the evolutionary theory was perffect - NO! will it probably change and grow as new discoveries are made YES!
Has ANY such growth been realized with the ID theory - Only to the point to get most of the religious leaders to agree upon it.

So, MY POINT is: my money is on science - who has the track record of debunking religious notions (the origin of I.D. IS religious in nature AND NOT science.)

So, in response to this:
1) ANY IDEA is a valid theory until proven either way - to say it doesn't 'qualify' is non-sense.
2) EVERY theory requires some level of faith - until its proven (then its considered fact) - or otherwise dis-proven. I ONLY have true faith in facts - otherwise its JUST belief.

- dont flatter yourself.
You have yet to respond to MANY points made - you simply choose to ignore them and claim victory. ???

For instance. you have indicated that its ID you side with..
I responded with with...
And I see you STILL havent produce proof of A&E existance. You ignored this.
At least with ANY aspect of the evolution theory - the ideas are put in front of the masses to scrutinize and debate - But with the I.D. theory, It's based ONLY a story passed down from religious writings - and THATS IT. Not even logic supports the I.D. notion. And to debate it publicly with the ones that sumbit such theories - ends in a 'gods will' equivelent remark or a threat of balsphemy from some religious leader.

Quote me where I said this...

Nevermind - your blinders are glued on too well - I have better things to do. And to debate with someone who puts words in my mouth and ignores counter-arguments is pointless.

So to avoid further debate with you... Ok - you win - I now believe in adam and eve. Or what ever you say. [*bahahahaha*]

Pompey

Evidence for Macroevolution

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One's inability to find an answer to a question does not imply that the question has no answer.

merry

and also:

http://www.talkorigins.org/origins/postmonth/mar06.html

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There is a war between the ones who say there is a war
and the ones who say there isn't.
~~Leonard Cohen

Nacht

Evolution doesn't claim we evolved from apes. Look at the chart posted a few pages back.

Modern Humans and Modern Apes evolved from a common ancestor, not one from the other. Big difference.

SFOSOK

So where is that pizza?

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*Warning* - Explicit Content Preceeding



METAL!!

Sandok

And also if you don't believe in evolution hwo do you explain we have over 90% of the same DNA? I mean, did god mess up and make hairy stupid humans along with us? ...

BWX

The fact the we have 90% or whatever same DNA and are so vastly different proves to me that the differences are more important that the similarities.

We also share much of the same DNA with a banana... but that doesn't mean anything.

So you guys think you came from a monkey-like ancestor? Not monkeys? What about where that ancestor came from? It all goes back to some very dumb animal or even some very simple plant.. Life didn't start with complex mammals in your theory.. it started with simple 1 celled organisms.

Maddogg6 you need to read my posts.. I never said I could prove anything for the 5th time.. You guys are the group saying you can prove macro evolution- you can't.. those links posted don't either. Again I'm not the one saying I hate a theory or idea... I just don't blindly believe macro evolution like you guys because it cannot be proven.

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Zelig

Sure it does, it shows us all life originates from the same source.

Is there an inate problem with believing that?

Nobody's trying to prove evolution, people are simply proving that evolution has far more evidence than anything else out there.
Claiming that we blindly believe something isn't productive, it's about as useful as me claiming someone blindly refuses to believe something, with no evidence to support my claim.

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Sandok

I thought I'd rez this with some cool info I found...



Seems that the US is really a god loving country... Just Poland and Phillipines... Poor countries Interesting to see the results nonetheless!

And I found this argument for god and intelligent design that just made me laugh like hell

[color=#222222] Where is the proof of God? If we're willing to open our eyes, we'll see the fingerprints of God all around us and all throughout us. Our very existence proves the existence of a Creator God.


[/color]

BWX

- it proves nothing of the sort..


Hey, if you want to believe a monkey was your great great etc... grand father.. that's fine.



Blindly believing Macro evolution because there is no evidence that supports it at all.

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Sandok

And if you believe that we all orginated from incest and Adam and Eve in a gorgeous garden with animals humping each other, be my guest...

Just interesting to see that the YOUNGEST country from my chart is the country that believes the LEAST in evolution... Far from coincidence.

SFOSOK

Its funny that being the youngest country we don't follow the trends we set them.

Evolution is bogus, tell me what you can prove. With Christianity we can prove there was a jesus, moses, and writings in other texts of accounts listed in the bible. Both require a blind faith.

That means your all wrong, and no one is right.






We all live through faith

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*Warning* - Explicit Content Preceeding



METAL!!

Sandok

I love your proof... It was in the bible thus it HAD to be true... The youngest is the most immature and the usually the annoying who refuses to listen to wise men. Come on, we Europeans who MADE YOUR RELIGIONS know that evolution exists so why don't you guys just give it a break?

Blind Faith... That's the best thing I've read on this forum. It's sooooo true you need BLIND faith. You actually have to shut down your brain and just believe what your told. Come on

BWX

The Bible is at least a written account.. you refuse to believe the Bible was written?

No written account for macro evolution BTW..

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Zelig

What do you mean?

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Pompey

There are written accounts of myths and legends from all over the world, the fact that something is written has no bearing on the facts.

Was the bible written at the time of the earths 'creation'? No - even according to Christian beliefs it happened more than 2000 years ago.

Was the theory of evolution 'written' at the time of the earths creation? No! The difference is Evolution is supported by the facts we have at hand.

Even if you don’t believe evolution, we can PROVE that the mechanisms required for evolution exist so at least it is a valid possibility. Can you prove there is a god?

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One's inability to find an answer to a question does not imply that the question has no answer.

Sandok

Hahahaha!!! Wow so anyone who wrote the bible means they knew what the hell they were saying? Come on, the stories in that are even less credible than in the Lion King!

I honstly laugh when people name THEIR religous book as "proof"

And no pompey, nobody can proove god... The only proof I've come accross is this:

[color=#222222] Where is the proof of God? If we're willing to open our eyes, we'll see the fingerprints of God all around us and all throughout us. Our very existence proves the existence of a Creator God.

[/color] What a load of bull... And none the less, nobody answered my magnificent find about only americans who refuse to believe in evolution Even philipinos believe! And hell, they come from a poor and wasted country

Nacht

Even though I'm on your side, I have to say; What the hell are you talking about?

These are two of the most generalizing and ignorant sentences I have ever read. Europeans didn't "make" any religions, unless you count classical/medieval mythologies like the roman dieties and the norse beliefs. Judeo/Christian religion was spawned in the middle east.

What the hell are you talking about only Americans refuse to believe in evolution?

Sandok, think before you type. I'm tired of your euro-elitism.

Sandok

Welll let's see most of the US is Catholic and not Protestant... Am I right or are all my sources just wrong? And thus, wasn't the catholic church made in italy? Or again, am I just wrong with everything? And if my geography is even half as good as I think it is, I think (not sure though) that italy is in europe...



Seems you don't read my posts... I'm tired of you not reading the thread before you bash someone.

Pompey

The pope is based in Italy, and the reformation (leading to the many protestant factions) did originate in Europe, But Christianity is an eastern religion. Jesus preached in the Middle East and later Christianity spread to Europe. Some sects do originate in Europe, but the basic Christian faith does not.

And its not only americans that dont believe evolution.
Lets take Northern Ireland as an example. 51.5% believe evolution according to your statistics. Therefore, 48.5% of the population of N. Ireland DONT believe evolution. This clearly shows that some people outside america dont believe evolution.

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One's inability to find an answer to a question does not imply that the question has no answer.

Sandok

True the main form of the religion christianity did come from the middle east but catholiscm didn't....

And accord to the survey I found, you are the guys who believe the LEAST in evolution. Less than 35% so compared to that, NI loves evolution.

Pompey

Huh?
Dude, im in NZ. You know, the place with lots of sheep and cows...you guys bought the americas cup off us!

It doesn’t matter what country im from, or how two countries compare. You said "only Americans who refuse to believe in evolution" and I proved you wrong.

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One's inability to find an answer to a question does not imply that the question has no answer.

Sandok

Oh come on mate, if you are going to be THAT nick picky, you might as well not read a thing I said since on a forum, I don't even type proper english.

And I know you're from NZ mate... It's in your Location