IRAQ is On Track..

Falstaff · May 23, 2003, 05:31 AM

The United Nations has finally made a worthy decision

Now the Oil for Food program is going to be terminated, perhaps Saddam Hussiens debts can be forgiven and the United States and Britain can get IRAQ back on its feet. Perhaps there is hope for democracy and a real oppurtunity for acceleration of growth and economic stability.

~~bluelight~~ · May 23, 2003, 11:40 AM

Yep...they bought off Russia and now they have it om paper...Iraq is a colony to Usa and Great britain.

What i dont understand is how the sanctions that were made as a response to Iraq having WDM`s have been lifted witout us seeing any WDM´s??

Strange...because i remember Powell saying very very clearly that he HAD PROOF of Wdm`s..that was the actual technical reason for the war...

Well he and his government are liars prepared to do whatever it takes to have it their way.......................i guess i have to settle for that.

Finally...i saw he (Powell) had the nerve to state that France finally had take had taken.....ONE.....a step in the right direction...

Thats when i felt i wanted to puke and stopped listening.

Bluelight

Falstaff · May 23, 2003, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Topic Review (Newest First)

bluelight - Yep...they bought off Russia and now they have it om paper...Iraq is a colony to Usa and Great britain.

[COLOR=skyblue] The ARAB world has already expressed extreme disdain for this, The Germans, Russians, Chinese, French and Americans will all have an oppurtunity to contribute their resources and expertise to rebuild the oil industry[/COLOR]

What i dont understand is how the sanctions that were made as a response to Iraq having WDM`s have been lifted witout us seeing any WDM´s??

[COLOR=skyblue] That is interesting as well, but now U.N. inspectors can continue the process unhindered and with protection into the deserts of IRAQ[/COLOR]

Strange...because i remember Powell saying very very clearly that he HAD PROOF of Wdm`s..that was the actual technical reason for the war...

[COLOR=skyblue] The proof were intercepted communications, spy photographs, counter intelligence and statements from operatives imbedded within the IRAQI military and government[/COLOR]

Well he and his government are liars prepared to do whatever it takes to have it their way.......................i guess i have to settle for that.

[COLOR=skyblue]If having it his way means getting IRAQ back on it's feet, albiet under the Aegis of the Coalition, and foriegn developers then that is small price to pay. The IRAQI's have already proven recently and historically that they cannot maintain any postive control over the actions of their countryman, too many guns![/COLOR]

Finally...i saw he (Powell) had the nerve to state that France finally had take had taken.....ONE.....a step in the right direction...

[COLOR=skyblue]The French will pay for their insolence[/COLOR]

Thats when i felt i wanted to puke and stopped listening.

[COLOR=skyblue]Whether we like it or not, it is happening as we speak, I predicted this would happen, and it is, next is economic euphoria from Bush's tax reforms, and renewed confidence in Tony Blair at home. Everyone gets something from this deal, including the IRAQI's and yes even the IRANIANS who are now more forthcoming about Al Quiada operatives they allegedly detained.(previously denied).
We have to twist the arms of many countries now to get some real cooperation.[/COLOR]

Bluelight

The_Neon_Cowboy · May 23, 2003, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bluelight
Yep...they bought off Russia and now they have it om paper...Iraq is a colony to Usa and Great britain.

What i dont understand is how the sanctions that were made as a response to Iraq having WDM`s have been lifted witout us seeing any WDM´s??

Strange...because i remember Powell saying very very clearly that he HAD PROOF of Wdm`s..that was the actual technical reason for the war...

Well he and his government are liars prepared to do whatever it takes to have it their way.......................i guess i have to settle for that.

Finally...i saw he (Powell) had the nerve to state that France finally had take had taken.....ONE.....a step in the right direction...

Thats when i felt i wanted to puke and stopped listening.

Bluelight

downt forget the links to russa and iraq and a joint effort in keeping record on the current location of one OSAMA BIN LADEN ... on paper hard proof ! but i dought it will se much light the us will tuck it away for a rainy day ...

"Thats when i felt i wanted to puke"

gee thats how i feel when i read your posts sometimes

"What i dont understand is how the sanctions that were made as a response to Iraq having WDM`s have been lifted witout us seeing any WDM´s?? "

two mobile cheamial weapons labs, small training amouts of serian,tons of chemial suits,banned weapons, undeclared weapons,barrels of unenriched uranuim low grade,enough rpgs to arm every man woman and child, not to mention the machine guns etc ...

with enough following and a little help we could of had a second hitler like on our hands... yea hes far from hitler but he has the arms for it. i mean seeking wmd.. nukes stateing the instant he has one HE WILL use it

Falstaff · May 23, 2003, 02:14 PM

we are already evaluating that possibility as more than just a potentiol threat, Saddam could easily get the isotope, and russian technology will can enrich it to weapons grade fissionable material, the alarmists have awakened yet, but I believe this is happening right now.

~~bluelight~~ · May 23, 2003, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Neon_Cowboy
downt forget the links to russa and iraq and a joint effort in keeping record on the current location of one OSAMA BIN LADEN ... on paper hard proof ! but i dought it will se much light the us will tuck it away for a rainy day ...

"Thats when i felt i wanted to puke"

gee thats how i feel when i read your posts sometimes

"What i dont understand is how the sanctions that were made as a response to Iraq having WDM`s have been lifted witout us seeing any WDM´s?? "

two mobile cheamial weapons labs, small training amouts of serian,tons of chemial suits,banned weapons, undeclared weapons,barrels of unenriched uranuim low grade,enough rpgs to arm every man woman and child, not to mention the machine guns etc ...

with enough following and a little help we could of had a second hitler like on our hands... yea hes far from hitler but he has the arms for it. i mean seeking wmd.. nukes stateing the instant he has one HE WILL use it

Your government has not...presented any proof of WDM´s to the UN or anyone else.

Your government has not presented any...valid links between Al Quaida and Iraq or Iran for that matter to the international community...NONE....

If they have i want to see you post evidence of that .....

But.... you cant....

Because there ios no such evidence..

Your government ar has lied..and continues to lie.

Period.

So chew it ....

And i suggest...unless you have a relevant answer to the topic.....dont bother to reply.

Bluelight

digerati · May 23, 2003, 05:43 PM

If they "did" find a link between Al Quaida, Iraq, and Russia, could that have been used as a sort of blackmail to get Russia to sign up?

~~bluelight~~ · May 23, 2003, 05:52 PM

No Russia signed because they have been promised that their older contracts will be considered as still valid...so they will get they money Iraq oughs them.

So...everybodys making money...

And no...they have no..links between Al quaida Iran..or Iraq....

They just talk..

And by now...we know what that is worth.

France main reason for voting yes is that Usa has de3clared that they`d be punished if they did not fall into the line.

Order restored .

Bluelight

digerati · May 23, 2003, 09:17 PM

I just had a thought. What if what we're all debating means nothing?

What if American did find WDM's and found with a note like "Hugs & Kisses! France & Russia <3" and is now using the information to get what it wants. What if there is a whole other thing that we all don't know about? Something so political that the general public of each country would be overly shocked?

~~bluelight~~ · May 23, 2003, 09:38 PM

Yeah ...what if we have no clue about what they are doing........

Blue

digerati · May 23, 2003, 09:55 PM

Weird, that site doesn't say anything about helping Iran. Mine said both.

Falstaff · May 24, 2003, 01:16 AM

your just happen to hit it right on the money.....nuff said...your getting close to the truth /\ ___/\

digerati · May 24, 2003, 02:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fallang_jeff
your just happen to hit it right on the money.....nuff said...your getting close to the truth /\ ___/\

Does this mean I get a cookie?

Falstaff · May 24, 2003, 04:27 AM

One of my theories is that there is more going on to cover up western involvement in WMD now that there has ever been. We have evidence, but the implications are staggering, because we might well find out our own allies participated in a "deception" before and during and even after the War..

digerati · May 24, 2003, 07:11 AM

I agree but then again this leads to the horridness of the what-if theorie extravaganza. Cause what-ifs lead anywhere.

Falstaff · May 24, 2003, 07:49 AM

Saudia Arabia, with a dsyfunctional government of royal family members and cronies is steadily beginning to admit under pressure from the united states, of sustained support for terrorist organizations. Paying the United States lip service and allowing us build bases there and defeat Saddam Hussien. Never openly admitting colusion, they have however began to reveal all the layers of support for know terrorists.

Remember, the 9/11 suicide pilots were Saudi Arabian. And they cooperated with Hussien before his eventual overthrow, walking a tightrope and suppresing open unrest in their own country by allowing terrorists to exist, they achieve some balance of power. When we overthrew Hussien, Americans were concerned about the supply of oil interrupted until it started flowing again right...Well, we oil dependent SUV driving consumers didn't realize that Saudi Arabia could be considered the real culprit behind oil concerns in IRAQ.

America has been accused of political schizophrenia, but other nations can equally share that accusation. It is unrealistic to assume that we cannot support a dictatorial regime because we disagree with their politics when they are our strongest trade partners in terms of petroleum production. I believe if we had been more dependent on IRAQ vs Saudi Arabia, things would have remarkably different.

Now Iraq is on track, U.N. inspectors will return and find evidence and quietly bury that information after all the evidence has been uncovered, assuming we can find it all. I know that we are finding more soviet and French influence in IRAQ during the Hussien regime, the recent thefts of anchient artifacts coordinated with Europeans and criminals within IRAQ shows that the influence has not diminsihed, just dormant,

There is a fifth column effort underway and it isn't religious fundamentalists, I believe that the Baath Party will reinvent itself, and return, Soviet and French interests will reemerge in new form...

I say look to IRAN and look to Syria. I think the Coalition is in way over their heads now..Just instilling a sense of freedom and pointing IRAQ on the right path is the very best we can do...

The further we diminish our dependence on oil and combustion burning powerplants the better off we will be, until then, the middle east will continue to be a battleground.

~~bluelight~~ · May 24, 2003, 09:09 AM

According to a very credible conservative American on another board...a large number of relatives to Bin Ladin were residing in Usa
on sept 11.

Although restrictions to enter or leave the Usa after 9/11 were very very hard...all of then were given safe passes to leave at once.

Might that be because the extensive businees contracts that exists between Bush Senior,James Baker and the Saudi royal family??

(Connections that has been
presented at that board by that same conservative american and that has been published and discussed openly in Usa)

Well...who knows.

Who knows...

And democracy in Saudi Arabia???

Hardly because if you were to hold democratical elections....then movements labeled "radical" by Usa would win .Usa knows this just as they know this is a very large risk in Iraq...so...."real" democracy...is nothing we will see in any od these nations.

Bluelight

Falstaff · May 24, 2003, 04:06 PM

According to a very credible conservative American on another board...a large number of relatives to Bin Ladin were residing in Usa
on sept 11.

[COLOR=skyblue]Absolutely true, they are being monitored as we speak, their movements observed and recorded, and any communication via satellite intercepted. [/COLOR]

Although restrictions to enter or leave the Usa after 9/11 were very very hard...all of then were given safe passes to leave at once.

[COLOR=skyblue]They were difficult for some men meeting a certain criteria according to their ethnic profile and age and affiliation, but many people were allowed to leave, unless they were detained for some reason.[/COLOR]

Might that be because the extensive businees contracts that exists between Bush Senior,James Baker and the Saudi royal family??

[COLOR=skyblue]If you are referring to the Bush family, prominent in the energy business in Texas, that might be probable, because if it flows from Saudi Arabia and is shipped here, many prominent Americans have contracts with Saudi partners within OPEC.[/COLOR]

(Connections that has been presented at that board by that same conservative american and that has been published and discussed openly in Usa)
[COLOR=skyblue]
I think you are referring to the vice president perhaps, but politicians who invest in oil cross party lines, both democrat or republican equally conservative in nature, have invested in petroleum, this is nothing new say for even millions of americans. As long as Saudi Oil keeps flowing, we all benefit in a philosphical way. The only real victems here are all the living organisms on the planet, that must deal with hydrocarbons from combustable fuels. The clock is ticking in my opinion. If IRAQ is exploited, which many people believe, we will also benefit, I am not condoning this activity. But IRAQ has been spoiled by Hussien, perhaps we can inject new life into their government and get them back on their feet.
IRAQ is not Hawaii, IRAQ is not Alaska, IRAQ is not Puerto Rico, IRAQ is a nation first subdued by Hussien and then liberated by us from his iron hand. IRAQ has a chance to rebuild, the process will be long and ardous, with many more problems and political knots to untie. [/COLOR]

Well...who knows.
Who knows...
And democracy in Saudi Arabia???
Hardly because if you were to hold democratical elections....then movements labeled "radical" by Usa would win .Usa knows this just as they know this is a very large risk in Iraq...so...."real" democracy...is nothing we will see in any od these nations.

[COLOR=skyblue]Excellent point, the same process would have to occur. These royal families have been doing business with european capitalist for a long time, and they know what we want and can give it to us in spoonfuls or barrels, and we pay dearly. You can criticize American for Political Schizophrenia but the Saudi's are masters at this game.[/COLOR]

~~bluelight~~ · May 24, 2003, 05:37 PM

And ...the headlines in New york times today read......Kurds will be allowed to keep their heavy arms....

The Shiites (the very same ones that was abandoned last war when they made an uprising.....will be disarmed.

Might that be because of their religious connections with Iran?? and might it be that they were abandoned last time...for the very same reason??

Maybe.

Bluelight

Falstaff · May 24, 2003, 05:54 PM

And ...the headlines in New york times today read......Kurds will be allowed to keep their heavy arms....
[COLOR=skyblue]A political wildcard, we wont let them set up their own state within IRAQ (for now) but we allow them to defend themselves. right now we are ejecting them from homes and land occupied after the overthrow of Saddam, and we are very very unpopular with Turkey.[/COLOR]
The Shiites (the very same ones that was abandoned last war when they made an uprising.....will be disarmed.
[COLOR=skyblue]I think we want to disarm everyone, fleeing dissolved members of the Baath party and disenfranchised IRAQI army soldiers would like to set up their own power base. I know you hear alot about theocratic rule and the Iranians stirring things up, but he who has the biggest guns will no doubt be in charge.[/COLOR]
Might that be because of their religious connections with Iran?? and might it be that they were abandoned last time...for the very same reason??
[COLOR=skyblue]Religious connections not withstanding, it is more primitive and tribal, I don't understand the Arab mind, but there is some hiearchy that existed within the muslim factions and they have been trying to wrest control from each other for some time. I am more concerned about the Godless and mindless soldiers of IRAQ that fled and changed clothes only to dissolve into the crowds confronting coaliton peacekeepers now. [/COLOR]
Maybe.

rafter109 · May 28, 2003, 03:46 AM

President Bush is a great man in one aspect - he had the balls to tell the middle east "if you mess with us again, we will kick all of your asses". Basically the Iraqi campaign is a precursor for things to come. The arab nations of the middle east will most likely either collapse under the weight of their bloated illigitimate dictatorships disguised as democracies, theocracies, and monarchies or they will fall under the international policing force that we call the United States of America. You may ask, "why USA and not UN?". My answer is simple. The UN is run by a bunch of nitwits!! What freakin idiot approved of the Lybians becoming head of the human rights council? Not the United States! Lybia has a horrible horrible human rights record. Furthermore, why is Mr. Blix and Mr. ElBaradei still doing the WMD inspections? If memory serves me right, several years ago the IAEA concluded that there were no nuclear weapons capabilities in iraq. Mr. ElBaradei later reniged his statement and said that Iraq DID have nuclear weapons capabilities. It was also proven several times before that Mr. Blix has failed to achieve his goals as weapons inspector in iraq and a few other countries.

By the way, France has little to no military, political, or economic influence on the rest of the world. Why in the hell are they holding veto powers in the UN? The same goes for russia, what do they have to offer other than illegal weapons, the red mafia, and smuggled nukes?

Falstaff · May 28, 2003, 04:29 AM

than you might expect, they have their fingers in every pie, and exercise great economic power in Europe, they trade with as many countries if not more than we do. And yes, they trade weapons and fix soviet aircraft too...

~~bluelight~~ · May 28, 2003, 07:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rafter109
President Bush is a great man in one aspect - he had the balls to tell the middle east "if you mess with us again, we will kick all of your asses". Basically the Iraqi campaign is a precursor for things to come. The arab nations of the middle east will most likely either collapse under the weight of their bloated illigitimate dictatorships disguised as democracies, theocracies, and monarchies or they will fall under the international policing force that we call the United States of America. You may ask, "why USA and not UN?". My answer is simple. The UN is run by a bunch of nitwits!! What freakin idiot approved of the Lybians becoming head of the human rights council? Not the United States! Lybia has a horrible horrible human rights record. Furthermore, why is Mr. Blix and Mr. ElBaradei still doing the WMD inspections? If memory serves me right, several years ago the IAEA concluded that there were no nuclear weapons capabilities in iraq. Mr. ElBaradei later reniged his statement and said that Iraq DID have nuclear weapons capabilities. It was also proven several times before that Mr. Blix has failed to achieve his goals as weapons inspector in iraq and a few other countries.

By the way, France has little to no military, political, or economic influence on the rest of the world. Why in the hell are they holding veto powers in the UN? The same goes for russia, what do they have to offer other than illegal weapons, the red mafia, and smuggled nukes?

Mr Blix is not doing any weaponinsections.You are.

And you arent finding anything.

Sand.Dust.NOTHING DO YOU HEAR?

Because Blix alreready dug everything up.HE achieved his goal...yes..or more right the UN achieved teir goal.

They did that so good that the last Iraq effort took you three weeks ansd not 6 months.

Last Gulf war took you 3 months.

After that Iraq has been under UN sanctions.

Sanctions and inspections that has crushed any possible strength they mihght have had.

Ok?

So the reason your glorious campaign was so fast is based on that....and nothing else.

So....please continue puking on Blix and ..the UN as your nation has done the last twelwe months.

Shows how utterly well informed about reality some of you are .

Please go ahead an puke..........

Bluelight

~~bluelight~~ · May 28, 2003, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fallang_jeff
than you might expect, they have their fingers in every pie, and exercise great economic power in Europe, they trade with as many countries if not more than we do. And yes, they trade weapons and fix soviet aircraft too...

And that makes them any different to you?

And Russia...whats your problem wityh Russia??

Russia is the way you wanted it.It is a ultra capitalist state.

Exactly as you wished.

The make busines on the holy market.

Just like you.

Hardly

Bluelight

rafter109 · Jun 1, 2003, 07:29 AM

Russia is a screwed up excuse of a country. Their president is an ex-KGB agent, all of the major corporations and political arenas are dominated by the russian mafia. Russia's greatest export is weapons, and its usually to stupid ass radicals in third world countries that have absolutely no value for human life. Why is russia now a capitalist nation? Not because of us foriegn policy, but because communism does not work for one simple reason - It is human nature to strive to gain more money and power. Why in the hell does Russia's opinion make a difference if they have no positive political, economical, or military influence? The same with France and ...oh yes, SWEDEN, the country that gives untraceable bank accounts to every known criminal in the world! And for what reason!? Blix didnt do his job. Neither did the UN. If you havent heard, the U.S. has confirmed that it has found mobile bio/chem weapons labs. Oh and by the way, didn't iraq fire scud missiles at u.s. and british troops? I belive they did! And isn't iraq banned from having scuds? Yes it is!!! Why in the hell didnt blix find any then? Please tell me Mr. I'mSweedishSoIKnowMoreThanYou!

Falstaff · Jun 1, 2003, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Russia is a screwed up excuse of a country. Their president is an ex-KGB agent, all of the major corporations and political arenas are dominated by the russian mafia. Russia's greatest export is weapons, and its usually to stupid ass radicals in third world countries that have absolutely no value for human life. Why is russia now a capitalist nation? Not because of us foriegn policy, but because communism does not work for one simple reason - It is human nature to strive to gain more money and power. Why in the hell does Russia's opinion make a difference if they have no positive political, economical, or military influence? The same with France and ...oh yes, SWEDEN, the country that gives untraceable bank accounts to every known criminal in the world! And for what reason!? Blix didnt do his job. Neither did the UN. If you havent heard, the U.S. has confirmed that it has found mobile bio/chem weapons labs. Oh and by the way, didn't iraq fire scud missiles at u.s. and british troops? I belive they did! And isn't iraq banned from having scuds? Yes it is!!! Why in the hell didnt blix find any then? Please tell me Mr. I'mSweedishSoIKnowMoreThanYou!

oh god....this is gonna get interesting...

~~bluelight~~ · Jun 1, 2003, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rafter109
Russia is a screwed up excuse of a country. Their president is an ex-KGB agent, all of the major corporations and political arenas are dominated by the russian mafia. Russia's greatest export is weapons, and its usually to stupid ass radicals in third world countries that have absolutely no value for human life. Why is russia now a capitalist nation? Not because of us foriegn policy, but because communism does not work for one simple reason - It is human nature to strive to gain more money and power. Why in the hell does Russia's opinion make a difference if they have no positive political, economical, or military influence? The same with France and ...oh yes, SWEDEN, the country that gives untraceable bank accounts to every known criminal in the world! And for what reason!? Blix didnt do his job. Neither did the UN. If you havent heard, the U.S. has confirmed that it has found mobile bio/chem weapons labs. Oh and by the way, didn't iraq fire scud missiles at u.s. and british troops? I belive they did! And isn't iraq banned from having scuds? Yes it is!!! Why in the hell didnt blix find any then? Please tell me Mr. I'mSweedishSoIKnowMoreThanYou!

JavaFox · Jun 1, 2003, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rafter109
Oh and by the way, didn't iraq fire scud missiles at u.s. and british troops? I belive they did! And isn't iraq banned from having scuds? Yes it is!!! Why in the hell didnt blix find any then?

This is absolutely true. Iraq did indeed fire SCUD missiles during Operation Iraqi Freedom, and SCUD missiles are indeed a banned weapon. So are the al Samoud II missiles.

But these anti-war zealots really don't care about that; I honest believe that. Even if clear evidence of WMD is found, they would still fault the US. They would just say something like "The inspectors should have been given the chance to find those weapons!"

~~bluelight~~ · Jun 1, 2003, 08:43 AM

I dont know ..since it is one of the more ignorant posts i have seen here im not sure if im gonna waste time on it.

He has not got one......single.......fact straight.

I can dismiss ...every...single statement he makes as bollocks....and back it up with facts....

But then...why should i waste time and money for my 56 connection to do so??

Being ignorant..is his problem ..not mine.

Bluelight

~~bluelight~~ · Jun 1, 2003, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JavaFox
This is absolutely true. Iraq did indeed fire SCUD missiles during Operation Iraqi Freedom, and SCUD missiles are indeed a banned weapon. So are the al Samoud II missiles.

But these anti-war zealots really don't care about that; I honest believe that. Even if clear evidence of WMD is found, they would still fault the US. They would just say something like "The inspectors should have been given the chance to find those weapons!"

And no....Iraq DID not fire Scud missiles.

The firedf other missiles and it was trumpeted out ..Scuds Scuds....Kuwait has been attacked by Scuds!!!

Well they were not...and that was confirmed just days after the general hysteria.By...your own authoroties.

May 23, 2003, 05:31 AM	#1
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	IRAQ is On Track.. The United Nations has finally made a worthy decision Now the Oil for Food program is going to be terminated, perhaps Saddam Hussiens debts can be forgiven and the United States and Britain can get IRAQ back on its feet. Perhaps there is hope for democracy and a real oppurtunity for acceleration of growth and economic stability. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 23, 2003, 02:14 PM	Thread Starter #5
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	I believe whether the media catchs on or not we are already evaluating that possibility as more than just a potentiol threat, Saddam could easily get the isotope, and russian technology will can enrich it to weapons grade fissionable material, the alarmists have awakened yet, but I believe this is happening right now. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 24, 2003, 01:16 AM	Thread Starter #12
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	What if...... your just happen to hit it right on the money.....nuff said...your getting close to the truth /\ ___/\ __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 24, 2003, 04:27 AM	Thread Starter #14
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	Mmmmmmm Cookie.... One of my theories is that there is more going on to cover up western involvement in WMD now that there has ever been. We have evidence, but the implications are staggering, because we might well find out our own allies participated in a "deception" before and during and even after the War.. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 24, 2003, 07:49 AM	Thread Starter #16
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	I know the what ifs are legion but... Saudia Arabia, with a dsyfunctional government of royal family members and cronies is steadily beginning to admit under pressure from the united states, of sustained support for terrorist organizations. Paying the United States lip service and allowing us build bases there and defeat Saddam Hussien. Never openly admitting colusion, they have however began to reveal all the layers of support for know terrorists. Remember, the 9/11 suicide pilots were Saudi Arabian. And they cooperated with Hussien before his eventual overthrow, walking a tightrope and suppresing open unrest in their own country by allowing terrorists to exist, they achieve some balance of power. When we overthrew Hussien, Americans were concerned about the supply of oil interrupted until it started flowing again right...Well, we oil dependent SUV driving consumers didn't realize that Saudi Arabia could be considered the real culprit behind oil concerns in IRAQ. America has been accused of political schizophrenia, but other nations can equally share that accusation. It is unrealistic to assume that we cannot support a dictatorial regime because we disagree with their politics when they are our strongest trade partners in terms of petroleum production. I believe if we had been more dependent on IRAQ vs Saudi Arabia, things would have remarkably different. Now Iraq is on track, U.N. inspectors will return and find evidence and quietly bury that information after all the evidence has been uncovered, assuming we can find it all. I know that we are finding more soviet and French influence in IRAQ during the Hussien regime, the recent thefts of anchient artifacts coordinated with Europeans and criminals within IRAQ shows that the influence has not diminsihed, just dormant, There is a fifth column effort underway and it isn't religious fundamentalists, I believe that the Baath Party will reinvent itself, and return, Soviet and French interests will reemerge in new form... I say look to IRAN and look to Syria. I think the Coalition is in way over their heads now..Just instilling a sense of freedom and pointing IRAQ on the right path is the very best we can do... The further we diminish our dependence on oil and combustion burning powerplants the better off we will be, until then, the middle east will continue to be a battleground. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 23, 2003, 11:40 AM	#2
~~bluelight~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,328 Rep Power: 0	Yep...they bought off Russia and now they have it om paper...Iraq is a colony to Usa and Great britain. What i dont understand is how the sanctions that were made as a response to Iraq having WDM`s have been lifted witout us seeing any WDM´s?? Strange...because i remember Powell saying very very clearly that he HAD PROOF of Wdm`s..that was the actual technical reason for the war... Well he and his government are liars prepared to do whatever it takes to have it their way.......................i guess i have to settle for that. Finally...i saw he (Powell) had the nerve to state that France finally had take had taken.....ONE.....a step in the right direction... Thats when i felt i wanted to puke and stopped listening. Bluelight

May 23, 2003, 05:43 PM	#7
digerati Everyones life has worth Join Date: May 2003 Location: My Yellow Bug Posts: 3,779 Rep Power: 0	If they "did" find a link between Al Quaida, Iraq, and Russia, could that have been used as a sort of blackmail to get Russia to sign up?

May 23, 2003, 05:52 PM	#8
~~bluelight~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,328 Rep Power: 0	No Russia signed because they have been promised that their older contracts will be considered as still valid...so they will get they money Iraq oughs them. So...everybodys making money... And no...they have no..links between Al quaida Iran..or Iraq.... They just talk.. And by now...we know what that is worth. France main reason for voting yes is that Usa has de3clared that they`d be punished if they did not fall into the line. Order restored . Bluelight

May 23, 2003, 09:17 PM	#9
digerati Everyones life has worth Join Date: May 2003 Location: My Yellow Bug Posts: 3,779 Rep Power: 0	I just had a thought. What if what we're all debating means nothing? What if American did find WDM's and found with a note like "Hugs & Kisses! France & Russia <3" and is now using the information to get what it wants. What if there is a whole other thing that we all don't know about? Something so political that the general public of each country would be overly shocked?

May 23, 2003, 09:38 PM	#10
~~bluelight~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,328 Rep Power: 0	Yeah ...what if we have no clue about what they are doing........ Blue

May 23, 2003, 09:55 PM	#11
digerati Everyones life has worth Join Date: May 2003 Location: My Yellow Bug Posts: 3,779 Rep Power: 0	Weird, that site doesn't say anything about helping Iran. Mine said both.

May 24, 2003, 07:11 AM	#15
digerati Everyones life has worth Join Date: May 2003 Location: My Yellow Bug Posts: 3,779 Rep Power: 0	I agree but then again this leads to the horridness of the what-if theorie extravaganza. Cause what-ifs lead anywhere.

May 24, 2003, 09:09 AM	#17
~~bluelight~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,328 Rep Power: 0	According to a very credible conservative American on another board...a large number of relatives to Bin Ladin were residing in Usa on sept 11. Although restrictions to enter or leave the Usa after 9/11 were very very hard...all of then were given safe passes to leave at once. Might that be because the extensive businees contracts that exists between Bush Senior,James Baker and the Saudi royal family?? (Connections that has been presented at that board by that same conservative american and that has been published and discussed openly in Usa) Well...who knows. Who knows... And democracy in Saudi Arabia??? Hardly because if you were to hold democratical elections....then movements labeled "radical" by Usa would win .Usa knows this just as they know this is a very large risk in Iraq...so...."real" democracy...is nothing we will see in any od these nations. Bluelight

May 24, 2003, 04:06 PM	Thread Starter #18
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	According to a very credible conservative American on another board...a large number of relatives to Bin Ladin were residing in Usa on sept 11. [COLOR=skyblue]Absolutely true, they are being monitored as we speak, their movements observed and recorded, and any communication via satellite intercepted. [/COLOR] Although restrictions to enter or leave the Usa after 9/11 were very very hard...all of then were given safe passes to leave at once. [COLOR=skyblue]They were difficult for some men meeting a certain criteria according to their ethnic profile and age and affiliation, but many people were allowed to leave, unless they were detained for some reason.[/COLOR] Might that be because the extensive businees contracts that exists between Bush Senior,James Baker and the Saudi royal family?? [COLOR=skyblue]If you are referring to the Bush family, prominent in the energy business in Texas, that might be probable, because if it flows from Saudi Arabia and is shipped here, many prominent Americans have contracts with Saudi partners within OPEC.[/COLOR] (Connections that has been presented at that board by that same conservative american and that has been published and discussed openly in Usa) [COLOR=skyblue] I think you are referring to the vice president perhaps, but politicians who invest in oil cross party lines, both democrat or republican equally conservative in nature, have invested in petroleum, this is nothing new say for even millions of americans. As long as Saudi Oil keeps flowing, we all benefit in a philosphical way. The only real victems here are all the living organisms on the planet, that must deal with hydrocarbons from combustable fuels. The clock is ticking in my opinion. If IRAQ is exploited, which many people believe, we will also benefit, I am not condoning this activity. But IRAQ has been spoiled by Hussien, perhaps we can inject new life into their government and get them back on their feet. IRAQ is not Hawaii, IRAQ is not Alaska, IRAQ is not Puerto Rico, IRAQ is a nation first subdued by Hussien and then liberated by us from his iron hand. IRAQ has a chance to rebuild, the process will be long and ardous, with many more problems and political knots to untie. [/COLOR] Well...who knows. Who knows... And democracy in Saudi Arabia??? Hardly because if you were to hold democratical elections....then movements labeled "radical" by Usa would win .Usa knows this just as they know this is a very large risk in Iraq...so...."real" democracy...is nothing we will see in any od these nations. [COLOR=skyblue]Excellent point, the same process would have to occur. These royal families have been doing business with european capitalist for a long time, and they know what we want and can give it to us in spoonfuls or barrels, and we pay dearly. You can criticize American for Political Schizophrenia but the Saudi's are masters at this game.[/COLOR] __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 24, 2003, 05:37 PM	#19
~~bluelight~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,328 Rep Power: 0	And ...the headlines in New york times today read......Kurds will be allowed to keep their heavy arms.... The Shiites (the very same ones that was abandoned last war when they made an uprising.....will be disarmed. Might that be because of their religious connections with Iran?? and might it be that they were abandoned last time...for the very same reason?? Maybe. Bluelight

May 24, 2003, 05:54 PM	Thread Starter #20
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	Rise of the Reinvented Baath party And ...the headlines in New york times today read......Kurds will be allowed to keep their heavy arms.... [COLOR=skyblue]A political wildcard, we wont let them set up their own state within IRAQ (for now) but we allow them to defend themselves. right now we are ejecting them from homes and land occupied after the overthrow of Saddam, and we are very very unpopular with Turkey.[/COLOR] The Shiites (the very same ones that was abandoned last war when they made an uprising.....will be disarmed. [COLOR=skyblue]I think we want to disarm everyone, fleeing dissolved members of the Baath party and disenfranchised IRAQI army soldiers would like to set up their own power base. I know you hear alot about theocratic rule and the Iranians stirring things up, but he who has the biggest guns will no doubt be in charge.[/COLOR] Might that be because of their religious connections with Iran?? and might it be that they were abandoned last time...for the very same reason?? [COLOR=skyblue]Religious connections not withstanding, it is more primitive and tribal, I don't understand the Arab mind, but there is some hiearchy that existed within the muslim factions and they have been trying to wrest control from each other for some time. I am more concerned about the Godless and mindless soldiers of IRAQ that fled and changed clothes only to dissolve into the crowds confronting coaliton peacekeepers now. [/COLOR] Maybe. __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

May 28, 2003, 03:46 AM	#21
rafter109 DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 6 Rep Power: 0	President Bush is a great man in one aspect - he had the balls to tell the middle east "if you mess with us again, we will kick all of your asses". Basically the Iraqi campaign is a precursor for things to come. The arab nations of the middle east will most likely either collapse under the weight of their bloated illigitimate dictatorships disguised as democracies, theocracies, and monarchies or they will fall under the international policing force that we call the United States of America. You may ask, "why USA and not UN?". My answer is simple. The UN is run by a bunch of nitwits!! What freakin idiot approved of the Lybians becoming head of the human rights council? Not the United States! Lybia has a horrible horrible human rights record. Furthermore, why is Mr. Blix and Mr. ElBaradei still doing the WMD inspections? If memory serves me right, several years ago the IAEA concluded that there were no nuclear weapons capabilities in iraq. Mr. ElBaradei later reniged his statement and said that Iraq DID have nuclear weapons capabilities. It was also proven several times before that Mr. Blix has failed to achieve his goals as weapons inspector in iraq and a few other countries. By the way, France has little to no military, political, or economic influence on the rest of the world. Why in the hell are they holding veto powers in the UN? The same goes for russia, what do they have to offer other than illegal weapons, the red mafia, and smuggled nukes?

May 28, 2003, 04:29 AM	Thread Starter #22
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	France is more powerful than you might expect, they have their fingers in every pie, and exercise great economic power in Europe, they trade with as many countries if not more than we do. And yes, they trade weapons and fix soviet aircraft too... __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Jun 1, 2003, 07:29 AM	#25
rafter109 DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 6 Rep Power: 0	Russia is a screwed up excuse of a country. Their president is an ex-KGB agent, all of the major corporations and political arenas are dominated by the russian mafia. Russia's greatest export is weapons, and its usually to stupid ass radicals in third world countries that have absolutely no value for human life. Why is russia now a capitalist nation? Not because of us foriegn policy, but because communism does not work for one simple reason - It is human nature to strive to gain more money and power. Why in the hell does Russia's opinion make a difference if they have no positive political, economical, or military influence? The same with France and ...oh yes, SWEDEN, the country that gives untraceable bank accounts to every known criminal in the world! And for what reason!? Blix didnt do his job. Neither did the UN. If you havent heard, the U.S. has confirmed that it has found mobile bio/chem weapons labs. Oh and by the way, didn't iraq fire scud missiles at u.s. and british troops? I belive they did! And isn't iraq banned from having scuds? Yes it is!!! Why in the hell didnt blix find any then? Please tell me Mr. I'mSweedishSoIKnowMoreThanYou!

Jun 1, 2003, 08:43 AM	#29
~~bluelight~~ Banned Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 1,328 Rep Power: 0	I dont know ..since it is one of the more ignorant posts i have seen here im not sure if im gonna waste time on it. He has not got one......single.......fact straight. I can dismiss ...every...single statement he makes as bollocks....and back it up with facts.... But then...why should i waste time and money for my 56 connection to do so?? Being ignorant..is his problem ..not mine. Bluelight