Judas

Anyone getting rather infurated that these idiots are putting out thier hand and begging for money?

Worse yet that the governments seem to be "wheeling and dealing" with them at all rather then just throwing them the hell out.

SINK OR SWIM....

What's more irritating is how it seems that alot of people seem to think it's such a great idea to bail them out, either they are completely oblivious to the facts surrounding what could happen under those circumstances, or they want to eat dirt far more then if they just let it all work out without idiotic intervention.

So what are the 2 possible senarios?

Well if the bailout occurs for them, they continue to rape us... only now they have doubled the abuse, not only does that put the country.. aka the people, in further unnessary debt, but they'll continue to make horrible products, continue to manage themselves pathetically, and everything will go to shit alot longer

vs

Give em a kick in the ass, don't bail em out, 7+million people get fired, the company goes bankrupted, BMW or some other company walks in and buys them up, those 7+million people are rehired (well maybe not as many as proper management will likely come back into effect), and then the companies back in action better off then it was.

or

continued idiocy will continue until everyone is for lack of a better word..... ed

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Falstaff

the free market solution is inevitable.
All the money in world will not stop the big three from suffering from the very thing
that banks are suffering from.
Offering affordable and economical and efficient vehicles is the only way to regain the market.
America needs to wake up from decades of decadence.

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Judas

GM had something... back in 98.... called the evo1

affordable, efficient, 0 maintenence electric cars...... and what did they do? The turned them all into cubes when california changed there laws due to being pushed by the car companies and other rich bastards...

AKA bad management..

Hell there have been reports for years of nothing but bullshit spewing from there mouths..


I'm still going to convert the 1973 olds i've got into a hyrdrogen powered car... the conversion isn't all that difficult or expensive. It'll be pretty sweet.

I might do it to my 95 grand prix as well..... Just kinda sucks that can use it for winter driving....

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Falstaff

I would opt for something considerably lighter and stronger, but I get your drift.

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CDsDontBurn

you could always go into bio-diesel you know. the only downside...or is it...is that you'll be smelling like last nights gourmet food

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Falstaff

Biodiesel emissions are considerably less damaging than any petroleum based fuel.

The ozone (smog) forming potential of biodiesel hydrocarbons is less than
diesel fuel. The ozone forming potential of the speciated hydrocarbon
emissions is 50 percent less than that measured for diesel fuel.
Sulfur emissions are essentially eliminated with pure biodiesel. The
exhaust emissions of sulfur oxides and sulfates (major components of acid
rain) from biodiesel are essentially eliminated compared to diesel.
Criteria pollutants are reduced with biodiesel use. Tests show the use of
biodiesel in diesel engines results in substantial reductions of unburned
hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide, and particulate matter. Emissions of
nitrogen oxides stay the same or are slightly increased.
Carbon Monoxide -- The exhaust emissions of carbon monoxide (a
poisonous gas) from biodiesel are on average 48 percent lower than
carbon monoxide emissions from diesel.
Particulate Matter -- Breathing particulate has been shown to be a
human health hazard. The exhaust emissions of particulate matter
from biodiesel are about 47 percent lower than overall particulate
matter emissions from diesel.
Hydrocarbons -- The exhaust emissions of total hydrocarbons (a
contributing factor in the localized formation of smog and ozone) are
on average 67 percent lower for biodiesel than diesel fuel.
Nitrogen Oxides -- NOx emissions from biodiesel increase or decrease
depending on the engine family and testing procedures. NOx
emissions (a contributing factor in the localized formation of smog and
ozone) from pure (100%) biodiesel increase on average by 10 percent.
However, biodiesel’s lack of sulfur allows the use of NOx control
technologies that cannot be used with conventional diesel.
Additionally, some companies have successfully developed additives
to reduce Nox emissions in biodiesel blends.
Biodiesel reduces the health risks associated with petroleum diesel.
Biodiesel emissions show decreased levels of polycyclic aromatic
hydrocarbons (PAH) and nitrated polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons
(nPAH), which have been identified as potential cancer causing
compounds. In Health Effects testing, PAH compounds were reduced by
75 to 85 percent, with the exception of benzo(a)anthracene, which was
reduced by roughly 50 percent. Targeted nPAH compounds were also
reduced dramatically with biodiesel, with 2-nitrofluorene and 1-
nitropyrene reduced by 90 percent, and the rest of the nPAH compounds
reduced to only trace levels.

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Necrosis

Yeah & only costs about a 1000 bucks if you source the parts right. I was working on a cell site for VzW in Binghamton, NY when one of the retired site techs came to visit the tech I was working with. He had an old Dodge truck that was converted. Very cool, and it really doesn't take that long either. Of course you also need to have access to a source. I don't have any diesel engines in anything I own but there is a bio-diesel plant going up near my house. Another great alternative is natural gas, you should really look into that.

[hobo]eclipse

the biggest question that jangles my brain is this. How do the banks get close to 1 trillion dollars, if not more, with virtually no questions asked untill after the fact? Then these guys need mere pocket change compared to the banker bailout in order to keep 1/3 of the country working at already established jobs (not newly created ones) and they get grilled to the teeth about it...before they get the money.

there is a GM plant near by, less than 10 miles, and on thursday thousands of workers were laid off, many of them just recently moved here with incentive from both GM and the local communities/townships.

some folks are getting the big picture