FuNsTeR

socialism is not communism my friend socialism is based on social justice .... where everyone is open to healthcare etc ... socialism has been part & parcel of european life since the end of WW2 it goes hand in hand with captialism ... you have to have a free market, but the problem with the current free market was the removing of the shackles controling it to a extent and allowing greed to take over ... and now we have (tax payers) have to bail out those greedy bassas

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"They say when you play a Microsoft CD backwards you can hear satanic messages ..... but that's nothing, if you play it forward it will install Windows"

Liqourice

Oh, I've heard many say that and actually believe it as well!

Liqourice

In all honesty I have to say that what most people refer to as communism isn't communism at all. The system's in China and the former Soviet union was not communism at all, they just claimed that it was/is.

For anyone that's actually read Karl Marx that should be quite obvious.

And just to say before anyone lashes out, I'm not a communist, not even in it's true sense. I've just had a very keen interest in political ideologies. Read and you shall lern. Just the same way as I've read both the bible and the choran... to know what the deal is.

dawgXdenta

It has failed, look around

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Today's world is of public opinion and the fates of nations are determined through its pressure. Once the tools for building public opinion are obtained, everything that you asked for can be done. --- Osama bin Laden when relating how global media has the minds of the masses.
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hob

I've read a lot of Marx's work just to become familar because in the U.S. military during the Cold War we were trained to be aware of certain communist ideology and tactics used against us while overseas. And the base ideology was pure socialism. That's why one of the S's in U.S.S.R stood for SOCIALIST. So let's not try to dupe the kiddies out there. The basis of Communism is socialism. Younger generations have been used to socialist policy all their lives, so most don't really know the difference between free market capitalism and socialism.

Under socialism, you allow the government to provide your rights and freedoms, even determine for you how many children you can have, but under capitalism, you allow the government to mind its own business while staying out of yours. The idea of Federal government by the U.S. Constitutional founders was always to be one of limited government, not the behemoth that's in place now that's still growing.

The first settlers at Jamestown in America practiced socialist policy the first year, where everyone received the same regardless of how hard one worked. Many starved that first year. But the next year the policy changed to if you didn't work you didn't eat, and whatever abundance you worked for you got to keep for trade. None starved that next year (The Foundation of American Constitutional Government, compiled by Robert D. Gorgoglione).

The nationalization of banks and corporations is a practice of socialism. In a communist system the corporations are owned by the state apparatus. That is never, never, never supposed to occur in a free market capitalist society. The government can be given power to help regulate, but not actually take part in free market competition.

Socialism is just like the old adage, "An equal amount of poverty for all." It doesn't work, and has never worked, especially since the communist countries have always needed western capitalism's help to keep afloat.

What many fail to see is how there is an attempt to join western capitalism with eastern socialism today, to produce a third condition, the joining of East and West. The ultimate plan is that of a "one world government", so that's why those in power have the need to join East and West. Western leaders are involved in that plan.

Rhodes Scholarship Program:

The Rhodes scholar program was founded by the students of Cecil B. Rhodes. He was a British socialist who made his fortune in South Africa, and he had the dream of a one world socialist government system. His students carried those ideas forward after his death, and that's what the training of a Rhodes scholar is really about. As revealed in Georgetown history professor Carroll Quigley's book Tragedy and Hope, another offshoot of that was the founding of the British Round Table Group, which also created an American branch in the 1920's called the Council On Foreign Relations. Those involved are not trained in American free market capitalism, but in world socialism and internationalism. (also see Fabian socialism). Those western socialists are working together with communism per what Quigely said in his work.

So if you live in Europe under the European Union, get ready, because its financial market system is going to change again once the Americas sector is balanced with it. And then both the Americas and Europe will have to be balanced with the eastern sector economies, all in order to establish a true one-world financial monetary system (i.e., a one-world currency).

dawgXdenta

I'm not one for the current capitalism or any ism for that matter, just good livin in exchange for an ism

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Today's world is of public opinion and the fates of nations are determined through its pressure. Once the tools for building public opinion are obtained, everything that you asked for can be done. --- Osama bin Laden when relating how global media has the minds of the masses.
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Kazeko

The irony, is that Andrew Russo (the author/producer of the Zeitgeist movie) is making bank on your buy-in. It's how he makes money. I mean... seriously, the irony is just STAGGERING.

A quip from the Denver Daily News, during the DNC, August 2008.

"Walking with a group carrying signs that read, "No Hope in Capitalism," several protesters appeared to be wearing brand new T-Shirts, what with the shirts being related to the Democratic National Convention. The DDN asked one of the protesters where the shirts came from. He responded, "The vendors in Civic Center are selling them for $20." But the DDN responded, "Isn't that capitalism?" The protester scratched his head, looked back and said, "But this is for a good cause.""


Oh, and btw, the law that makes taxation legal, is Title 26 of the United States Code. It's only news to those who haven't looked hard enough, and actors that played in Russo's fantasy that helps put food on his table.



Capitalism hasn't failed, many countries have failed capitalism. We aren't moving to socialist ideas to prevent economic collapse, we've been heading there for a while, based largely on the notion of entitlement that many have developed - entitled to health care, a living wage, etc. It also has to do with an unfortunate lack of understanding on the part of people who don't understand the axiom that money and capitalism rests on.


Edit, Gruntled... In the past 10 years, there have been no overt increases in taxation in the United States. In fact, there was a decrease, in 2006, under the GW Administration. (Which, with no unknown reasons, produced an INCREASE in tax revenue collected over the next two years. Perhaps if we tax less, less money gets sheltered.) Also, recent changes for the sake of stimulus decreased tax revenues even further, such as the 2008 stimulus act, which provided more than just 300 or 600 in your pocket, also provided tax breaks for new home buyers, small businesses, and more. Now, the American Reinvestment and Recovery Act (ARRA) adds a credit for higher education, expands the first time home buyer credit (from $7500 to $8000 USD, if you buy a home this year... do more research before buying a house based on that though) and actually decreases the tax brackets (and your federal withholding) for the rest of the year.

Judas

Give me a break...

that's like expecting to get food out of a system that's already put into place without any way of going about doing it differently against our will out of thin air.... Which is only available to the elite.

How LONG do you think you can manage without money completely in our current soiciaty... i do the best i can with what i've got... giving away anything i can give away.. at no cost... or at as low a cost as possible.

Don't be an idiot.... specially with the while making a clear out accusation like it's a 100% pure fact that the creator of zeitgeist himself has been busy raping anyone he can sucker into his nest.

That's a double standard... it's pure evil and bad or outright wrong for a single citizen to basically cover the base cost of their time invested and for what he can distribute at no cost to him or us, does freelly and actually suggests it, but something that is tangeable and due to the restrictions imposed on us due to the massive circle jerk that we at this point can't avoid.

YET

Companies are selling products.. major corporations such as wal-mart and the likes not only are having their way with you in a far worse way, they intend to continue it even when your 6 feet under. And this is called Capitalism..

"Just good Business"

I'm sorry, the system is screwed, the political system has been turned around and made into a business system.

Everything business oriented is no longer bound to ethical means and leaves that up to a number of filled with loop hole laws, and the people that make them.

The people that are willingly able to try to do their best to help everyone out is called an idiot, and shunned, and never able to expand beyond what he's got which in the end is actually a good thing. Meanwhile the REAL salesmen are expanding at unfathomable rate, completely ignored and overinflating anything they can, purposely creating supply and demand cercumstances.

BTW, i suggest you read even further into your TITLE 26..... how it was prepared, how it was implemented and also it's stated rules... it's relations to other amendments.

You don't have to go very far to realize the creators of title 26 is created by the CFR which should explain it all in itself.

There so much interconnected bullshit.. no one can get anything straight anymore.... it needs a house cleaning....

and lastly, where are you getting your figures from in relation to the stimulus..... that's all short term related figures... what does the long term suggest... where is that money coming from.. how is it being repaid?... what about the interest on all of that. How in the HELL is the US going to pay off nearly 70 trillion dollars worth the debts that the interest alone is no longer payable on a yearly bases..

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Kazeko

Oookay, too far.

First off, it's not accusation. It's just what it is. I'm sorry if you like the guy, but that's how he gets by, conspiracy media. He's got a number of videos. That's like getting pissed that someone demonizes Microsoft for making a profit. It's what they are in business to do.

Second off, watch your terms. I never said he was raping anyone. The very concept of rape indicates an unwilling victim. The people who endorse his products do so of their own volition. Ever hear the saying "you can't rape the willing?" I'm not saying he's screwing anyone, so please, don't drop the context of this discussion, it doesn't help anyone.

Third. The wound up bullshit is the conspiracy non-sense. Do you realize that "CFR" stands for Code of Federal Regulations, and NOT Council on Foreign Relations? (Which, btw, isn't even a government function?) Moreover, they didn't "CREATE" it, they printed it. CFR is part of the Government Printing Office. Congress actually created it, which, by the way, they have constitutional right to do. There's nothing in the constitution about zero taxation what so ever. Just taxation without representation, and you're represented, in congress, by senators that YOU elect. This is how a representative republic works.

And btw. I'm QUITE familiar with Title 26 of the United States Code, a.k.a. The Internal Revenue Code. I have to be. It's my job. Would you like an explanation of how things get made into law, and the three types of law?


The Stimulus information is all available via the Freedom of Information Act, and can be found just about anywhere. The recent is the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act.

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-...id=f:h1enr.pdf

There's the whole act, in PDF format.


Now, I never said ANYTHING about repayment for a purpose. We've been spending on a defecit basis for decades, that's not news, and not even the topic of discussion. Want something to pursue there, you might want to find out what "HSBC" means in HSBC Bank's name.

The dollar figures are slated in there, if you want more on the first time homebuyer credit, go to irs.gov and type in "Form 5405" in the search box on the top right. More info on the tax withholding adjustments can be found on the same website by typing in "Making Work Pay Credit" in the same search box.

If you get a really wild hair, type in "SOI" in that box, and you'll find that the IRS keeps Statistics of Income, which outlays all kinds of public information. What % of the population has what level of income, what amount of tax did they pay, etc. etc. Alternately, you can contact ANY government agency and request information on ANY document under the Freedom of Information Act (a.k.a. FOIA.) - This is enforcable in court.

U.S. Department of State Freedom of Information Act (FOIA)

People do get things straight, and the kind of conspiracy that's conveyed by Russo, is the kind of crap that would be blown up by the media so fast, he'd have no chance to (pardon the pun) capitalize on the situation. It's also the element that makes things so convoluted for many people.


I didn't mean to offend, just stating the obvious and publically available. Welcome to the world of catallactic accountability. There's more than just you that would blow these things up. It hasn't happened, not because people wouldn't believe, but because it's fallable, and the theory has holes.

Fact is - I don't endorse taxation outside a voluntary system. I don't endorse big governments. But it's not illegal. It's not bullshit, it's not false, fake or a conspiracy. If it was, with a tool as powerful as the internet, cellphones and what have you, this stuff would be blown up in seconds. There's plenty of examples to pine over.

I'm done with this conversation. Was hoping a little more rational argument be returned, but as is always the case - internet forums are not the place for such.

[hobo]eclipse

Aaron Russo

Aaron Russo (February 14, 1943 – August 24, 2007) was an American entertainment businessman, 9/11 conspiracy theorist,[1] trader, film maker, and political activist.

Russo died of bladder cancer at Cedars-Sinai Medical Center in Los Angeles, California on August 24, 2007, at age 64,[11][12] following a six year battle with the disease.[13]

Shortly before his passing, in 2007, Russo founded RestoreTheRepublic.com to fulfill the political ambitions laid out in his final film. America: Freedom to Fascism - Director's Authorized Version

He had nothing to do with zietgiest. Clips of his film where used, along with many others folks work in the movie.

Andrew Russo neither

Kazeko

Sorry, "Aaron Russo" not "Andrew Russo."

My mistake.

The idea I'm trying to convey is still there, with or without Aaron Russo.

Tinkerhell

Don't dispair Kazeko. It's not everyone on DH. Mostly just Judas. He's our resident "crazy guy that most of us like and are amused with". Read a few other posts in the politics & religion forums. I've tried to rationally argue with him from time to time. Doesn't do much good. It's ok. He just like to wear his tin foil hats and after you get used to it you can have a fun time replying to some of his posts knowing that others will your's and his and get a bit of a chuckle from one and maybe some rational info from the other.

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Darwin for Sainthood!!

dawgXdenta

Mmmmmhhh? Kazeko since you seem to have a greater understanding than I do, explain if by creating more capital by increasing debt is a good thing?

To me on the outset sounds like a problem; when is a debt ever good when you withdraw more than what you can pay back? (I didnt do economics at college so i wont be as well versed as you)

And is it not that those who control the printing process(the voted congress who we choose) control the debt and also who inherits the debt.

To me it seems that the more debt you have in an economy the more unaffordable tangible assets(real things) become because the debt(printed money) has stolen value from the money representing the tangible assets(real money/non debt money), apparently also this debt has never been paid back
what do you say about that?

__________________
Today's world is of public opinion and the fates of nations are determined through its pressure. Once the tools for building public opinion are obtained, everything that you asked for can be done. --- Osama bin Laden when relating how global media has the minds of the masses.
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Judas

no offense intended in my orginal post..

interesting bits of information non the less.

What happened to the orginal "taxation" laws where it states that income tax is a voluntary tax


btw

there is rape where the victim isn't aware of the decision they are making or has been kept obviously of the results of it intentionally..

it's like offering something without giving any clear value on it and then putting the big dollar signs on it which causes the purchasers jaw to drop.

while research is all fine and dandy, a number of cases today it's getting beyond words complicated, and intentially non-simplified

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