rastapeenor

I agree that this could have been avoided, but its war not everything works out how it should have. War sucks. And yes I want to join the military (if all goes as planned in my life I wont but its not that bad of a back up plan) and yes I am siding with the people who protect my freedoms that I have, that does not mean I will lose all sense of logic. Judas are you trying to tell me that you believe "Loose Change?" because if you DO in fact believe that it was not a terrorist attack I feel sorry for you.

OmegaRED

If you want to protect your individual freedom become a civil defense lawyer or look for a career that specializes in safeguarding the people from corporate interests. Military life is for young people who need the money or a kick in the ass to set them straight in life or people who are in it for life and want to go very high in the chain of command. It's been a very long time since the military protected anyone's freedom at home or abroad.

He does but there's a thread for that discussion if you want to wade into it. I don't.

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rastapeenor

Perhaps the root of problems like these "massacres" comes from people who join looking for a kick in the ass as you said. Just because I have the luxury of options in my life does not mean I have no personal obligation to serve the country that afforded me these luxuries. Maybe the military needs more people who aren't looking for rank or discipline but are truly intending to serve for the right reasons if we want to prevent further rash action.

To be honest if you truly believe that zero military personnel have committed any action to protect individual freedoms in a long time I feel that you're extremely naive and have no real knowledge of the military or the real world.

OmegaRED

The military probably does more good during disaster relief than any other time, which I understand is likely the National Guard's responsibility. Vietnam all the way up to Iraq and Afghanistan have not been about protecting the rights and freedoms of American citizens. Since WW2 America's military serves the function of projecting power and maintaining it; another function is securing America's financial interests through the acquisition of natural resources and the economic boost provided by the military industrial complex. I'm not saying this is a bad thing but anyone joining the military should be realistic and not idealistic.

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Judas

technically just a fyi... i don't beleive everything that loose change suggests.. but it raises damn good questions..

what i do happen to put more value in is the "architect and engineers for 911 truth" and what they have to say about it all.

But that's pretty much irrelivant to the real discussion here, remember you brought it up as some kind of valueable point which really, wasn't.

To assume that everyone in the military are either one: good or bad or devious at best would be stupid. There are good, and bad, and devious, of every kind.

However it is structured in a similare way as most huge businesses, not entirely focused on protecting the rights and freedoms or an entire country itself, initially that is what it was for, before it became a widespread career, but it's gotten overly politicalized to death, corporatised. People don't join the military for the sake of the country and what it was initially intended for anymore, they are usually slapped in like previously mentioned, to shape up, to make some serious money out of it, to feel they have authority or power over some others, any countless other reasons above and beyond that.

What is of major concern is that FACT that many of the rights and freedoms and constitutional clearly have in place specifics to protect the people from the military itself, and those are being lost in the wind somehow. There is also accountability for any ones actions, using war as an excuse for slaughting anyone be it domestic or foriegn is a total joke, unacceptable in any way, and total bullshit if anyone remotely suggests pushing it as such. It litterly takes a shit on the constitution and the human rights everyone is entitled to. And in fact it turns whomever suggests that it's just the way war works, yet feels disgust for anyone that may attack them is a total hypocrit.

The united states, it's military, and anyone that has been allied with them and followed have ilegally done so and deserve to be shot and killed for being part of invading and destroy as much as they claim they are "saving", we have no reason or right to be in iraq, afghanastan, OR remotely close to IRAN at all. We have NO right, obligation, to disrupt and in fact destroy what was already in place, and then suggest that it was for their own good anyways, no different then most would say that any other country has any right to invade ours and force a massive change down our throats. We would revolt and rebel to the best of our ability to protect our country, and yet it's only ok for us to do that? That's total hypocritical bullshit.

Bad enough that Obama and a number of other political figureheads are brow beating Iran for trying to get their nuclear power running, and so what if they manage a nuclear warhead, there is NO evidence of such attempts at a nuclear warhead at all, but if you were to beleive the media and what some of these pricks are talking about, it sounds like doom and gloom is looming over everyone. Yet it's just peachy for israel, US, Europe in general to have thousands of long range missles already available at the push of a button.

It's a joke, nothing more and nothing less.

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comp_ali

@ rastapeenor : Protecting your freedom , since when ?? When Bush allowed Phone tapping Policy ? Or the other laws that are entitled under "Counter-Terrorism" laws.

Do ou know until this moment Taliban , Alqaeda and Binladen are still out there. The majority of victims in Iraq and Afghanistan are Citizens (Unless you consider all the +1 million people killed terrorrists).

What US simply did is increasing the hate towards itself and you are iterating my point with your posts too.

Oops , forgot something , you have a point. Actually Abo Ghraib was a defence of freedom too.

rastapeenor

Omega. America and our Allies fought against the North Vietcongs not for our so called "thirst for blood" but because we believe in a world that is not ruled by one person. We wanted to defend the freedoms of the South Vietnameses people at the cost of our men and women.

Judas. Its not a war against Iraq, or Afghanistan. Its a war against terror, so you and I can live peacefully without fear in our homes. So we can watch our kids run around and play in the park knowing that we don't really have anything to worry about. War against terror has to be brought to the terrorist not to our home turf. If we fought the war on terror in America then we would have already lost. and you're probably saying that there is no point in fighting a war on terror. If you say that to yourself then you can just go ahead pull out a .38 special and blow your own head off. (Please don't because I enjoy hearing what you have to say) however if you truly don't believe there is a need to defend our freedoms and if you don't believe that our freedoms are being defended properly then ask yourself "why can I go to the grocery and have the freedom to pick my food? Why can I choose to watch hockey or football? Why can walk down the street and not get arrested for being out past a nationwide Curfew?" Its all because of our men and women who fight courageously for the Defense of the most powerful nation in the world .

Comp_ali: Abo Ghraib was a "drop in the bucket" please if you actually dont think that those terrorist had it coming for them then you are sadly mistaken, besides why do they care? they get to have sex with 72 virgins in heaven. Oops, forgot something. Dailymotion - Nick Berg Beheading Video - a News & Politics video

Those are the people you are defending

comp_ali

So Abo Gharib prisoners were all terrorists ? Even if I assume you are right , you have no problem in humiliating prisoners. Have you heard about human rights ?
Your video shows nothing but some propaganda speakers with no facts or proof.

Back to the main topic. Do you believe that those wars was good for your country and your peace ?. Let's "act" like we forgot about people and civilians who died. there are billions spent on those wars , what did you get in return? I fail to see your point.

And please if you believe in freedom of choice and you really fought for Vietnamese/Afghan/Iraqis people freedom, you should have asked them before declaring a war to choose and not just act like a volunteering freedom advocator.

rastapeenor

Haha in Vietnam South Vietnam begged for our help. Ofcourse Iraq couldnt have asked for our help because Saddam was in power so in-order to restore the people their freedom of choice Saddam had to be eliminated.

Judas

Sadly, you cannot have a war on terror because essentially everyone is a possible terrorist.. and more and more people are being labeled terrorist...

the whole issue with war on terror is the fact that it's a war that cannot be won, it's to broad based, and intead of preserve privacy and freedoms, it's ripping it away, i don't know what you've been paying attention, but the last time i looked at the so called patriot act, it did nothing to protect the rights and freedoms, it severaly hit it, and further admendments have continues to hammer those nasty nails into the so called constitution and human rights coffin.

Also, the whole thing is entirely counter productive, people are walking around more affraid and in fear then before, and it's totally ilogical, the entire "war on terror" was started with no factual evidence and based on theory, motivated by a backlash with no accountability.

To put into as few words as possible, the united states got a kick to the head from behind, by whom no one is clear on, and instead of asking real questions, the united states has open fired on anyone that even remotely looks suspicious without actually doing any manner on it. The united states government, by any way of really looking at it, weren't doing their job, they were acting in a manner of either paranoid schizophrenia, or alternative agendas gaud knows for what (and this isn't conspiracy theorist speak, this is documented and repeatedly proveable).

Either way, at the rate the bullshit keeps flying, our children aren't going to have the freedoms you speak about, your clearly blinded by you faith in a corrupt and being idealistic and optimistic isn't entirely a bad thing, but like all things, to much and to little of anything is a disaster, and right now, the "new world order" essentially is going way the hell overboard to the point of turning into that which everyone was trying to do everything in their power to prevent.

At this point in time reading this, you've already shut your mind off from such "non sense, that would never happen" .... when in reality, if you do indeed end up doing that, you are in itself, part of the cause of the very problems i stated above.

And like the romans and countless other civilizations and societies, it will all oventually fall, IF it doesn't get ran like a tyranic dictatorship before then.

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dawgXdenta

Well its real simple folks "in war there are no good guys " just those who are dumb enough to enlist in the army and those who are selfish and heartless enough to send these poor boys and girls to their death, so that they can have more gold watches and drive Bentleys. If you don't believe this then look at the 5000 or so years of written history of mankind
nothing has changed only that we have advanced materially with science but not mentally and spiritually/morally.
We have to push the spiritual/moral education with the help of psychologist and philosophy and or religious literature(NOT DOGMA) combined to form a new culture, art of music dance poetry and movies that will inspire the coming a new age worthy of our scientific advances.(Picture Star Trek culture)

Without this change in culture we or at least our children are doomed to even greater disasters and a cataclysm so dark and unparalleled it would make the dark ages bright as the noon day sun, will consume this world as it is yet slowly creeping forth.

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Today's world is of public opinion and the fates of nations are determined through its pressure. Once the tools for building public opinion are obtained, everything that you asked for can be done. --- Osama bin Laden when relating how global media has the minds of the masses.
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http://dawgxdenta.deviantart.com/gallery/

Callandor

Watch this and you'll understand the state of things in the world right now.

Quantum Communication | Watch Free Documentary Online

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Judas

that is another excellent video

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Callandor

Thanks man.

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Imran_T

LOL Baghdad's in Iraq not Afghanistan.

comp_ali

This is how it works

OmegaRED

Maybe it's perverse but I'm excited to see the next leaked video which is supposed to be even more shocking. The more the Pentagon wants to stop us from seeing it the more I want to check it out

WikiLeaks Preparing to Release Video of Alleged U.S. Massacre in Afghanistan - ABC News

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Judas

keep it coming..

while i am no fan of death and distruction at all... knowing it is occuring due to ally stupidity or just insanity should be made a requirement.


It is no different then a child or a pet getting it's face pushed into the crap it left on the rug and told to smart the hell up.

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anonemus

Testimony of the soldier who rescued the two children shot down

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kelmEZe8whI

iPlayer

If you don't feel like logging in or registering:

http://www.youtube.com/v/kelmEZe8whI