WMD? - CIA Press Release

Maiky · Dec 2, 2003, 02:27 AM

Where are the Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction?
If you want to see another funny episode of USA government and CIA, please click here

http://www.cia.gov/cia/public_affair...r11282003.html

is legal to invent fake documents to wage a war?
has the USA government done it?

digerati · Dec 2, 2003, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maiky
Where are the Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction?
If you want to see another funny episode of USA government and CIA, please click here

http://www.cia.gov/cia/public_affair...r11282003.html

is legal to invent fake documents to wage a war?
has the USA government done it?

That site was a good read. Just goes to show how hard it is to handle so much information. But I think you've got some other topics to defend that you've started Maiky, or at least admit you were wrong on somethings before you open up another can of worms.

JavaFox · Dec 2, 2003, 07:02 AM

It's funny that anti-war types ignore the fact that al Samoud II missiles, which were illegal for Saddam's regime to possess, were found in bulk in Iraq and shown on every TV station in the world.

Falstaff · Dec 2, 2003, 07:24 AM

yes, and fully capable of carrying a useful physics package capable of 20 megatons of atomic blast energy, the ignorance of the world to the capability of Hussiens former regime is terrible, but hey, they can be ignorant and hostile like Micheal Moore...

UberLord · Dec 2, 2003, 09:40 AM

It's funny that pro-war types overlook the fact the English were told that chemical and biological warfare could be launched from Iraq in 45 minutes. Most of Tony Blairs basis for war was based on this.

Where are they?

I'm not denying that Iraq had illegal missiles, but no-one can deny that they didn't have the WMD we were told either.

BWX · Dec 2, 2003, 10:32 AM

Did anyone here see the videos of Saddam's soldiers blindfolding and pushing people off of roofs? Saddam WAS a weapon of mass destruction.

Who gives a crap if he didn't happen to have a nuke at the time, he was trying to get one, that is well known.
Don't forget the fact that we are still finding weapons caches all the time and anthrax and other bio weapons are very small, easy to hide, easily destroy, and easily made to be ready to be whipped up on short notice while disguised as "research" or legitimate uses.

Hmm, I wonder why thousands of Iraqi soldiers all had gas masks when found dead, and why there were stock piles of gas masks and bio-suits found all over the place over there. Maybe Saddam was going to launch an attack right when we struck but the command didn't go through because all the the s"hock and awe", or maybe his orders were ignored.

Maiky, tell me why you love a piece of human garbage like Saddam so much and would rather support him than defend the people that risked everything all to oust him?

UberLord · Dec 2, 2003, 11:19 AM

BMX232 - you're changing the topic. This isn't about Saddam being good or evil, it's about wether or not the public was lied to about the WMD Iraq was thought to have had and that because of this we had to go to war.

BWX · Dec 2, 2003, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by UberLord
BMX232 - you're changing the topic. This isn't about Saddam being good or evil, it's about wether or not the public was lied to about the WMD Iraq was thought to have had and that because of this we had to go to war.

Quote:

Originally posted by BWX232
Don't forget the fact that we are still finding weapons caches all the time and anthrax and other bio weapons are very small, easy to hide, easily destroy, and easily made to be ready to be whipped up on short notice while disguised as "research" or legitimate uses.

Hmm, I wonder why thousands of Iraqi soldiers all had gas masks when found dead, and why there were stock piles of gas masks and bio-suits found all over the place over there. Maybe Saddam was going to launch an attack right when we struck but the command didn't go through because all the the shock and awe", or maybe his orders were ignored.

I would say all the evidence points to Saddam having weapons of mass destruction, at least bio weapons and the ability to make/hide chemical weapons. Evil dictators with a track record like Saddam's are more likely to use anything he gets his hands on, the fact that he does things like pushing people off roofs, gas thousands of his own people, etc, etc, etc.... The examples I gave just supports that fact.
A vile of anthrax that can fit in your hand can kill thousands, something like that can be hidden or destroyed instantly.

" When the Iraq Survey Group (ISG), led by David Kay, issued its interim report in October, acknowledging that it had not found chemical or biological weapons, the inspectors had then visited only ten of the 130 major ammunition depots in Iraq; these ammunition dumps are huge, sometimes five miles by five miles on a side. Two depots alone are roughly the size of Manhattan. It is worth recalling that after Desert Storm, US forces unknowingly destroyed over 1,000 rounds of chemical-filled munitions at a facility called Al Kamissiyah. Baghdad sometimes had special markings for chemical and biological munitions and sometimes did not. In short, much remains to be done in the hunt for Iraq's WMD."

"finding physically small but extraordinarily lethal weapons in a country that is larger than the state of California would be a daunting task even under far more hospitable......"-- it's not over yet, so you can't accuse anyone of lying.

Also, if intelligence is given to a person, and that person believes and reports that intelligence, that is not a lie.

is legal to invent fake documents to wage a war?
has the USA government done it?

No, and no.
-as of now the answers are no.

edit- spelling

UberLord · Dec 2, 2003, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BWX232
it's not over yet, so you can't accuse anyone of lying.

But how long will it take? They can't say "we'll find the evidence sooner or later". They've been looking for longer months. Is this going to take year? Will it be in my lifetime? What's your timescale? They've been trying to find this stuff for years. Now they've got total access and they still can't find anything many months later doesn't really bode all that well now does it.

Quote:

Also, if intelligence is given to a person, and that person believes and reports that intelligence, that is not a lie.

It becomes a lie when they keep on spouting what they said at first and there's evidence to the contrary. In this case there is NO HARD evidence to support the origonal claims.

Quote:

is legal to invent fake documents to wage a war?
has the USA government done it?

No, and no.
-as of now the answers are no.

I can't speak for the USA, but here in the UK there was a great out cry about a certain document (you know that 45 minute thing I mentioned earlier) being "sexed up". What it boiled down to was that PR said "we need that 45 minute bit in". The researchers had pulled that bit a long time ago as they didn't have enough evidence to support it. But PR had their way as it would scare the public into accepting war more readily. Ministers lost their jobs over this and Tony Blair almost lost his.

Faked? Sexed up? You be the judge. But as far as the UK's concerened imho yes they lied and yes they faked documents.

BWX · Dec 2, 2003, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by UberLord
But how long will it take? They can't say "we'll find the evidence sooner or later". They've been looking for longer months. Is this going to take year? Will it be in my lifetime?

Yeah, I'd say give them a year or so, more than 300 soldiers have died since the "end" of the war, so it's hardly like they have free reign of the country side to search.

My cousin who lived next door to my my entire life might be one of those soldiers, hopefully not. He came hme from Iraq last week and all of the sudden started having major symtoms, including loss of feeling in his legs and the inability to walk.. Hmmm, over 20 years and no health problems, go to Iraq and strange nervouse system problems. Sounds like maybe he got a wiff os some chemical or virus over there- who knows. here is the e-mail we got.
------------------------------ ----------------------- --------------------------- --------------
>Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 9:41 PM
>Subject: David is ill

> David has been taken very sick. He is in a Navy Hospital in Florida ..
> It is a long story how this happened. He could have died , and we
> thanked God for over seeing him.
>
> He is in the ICU there and they finally got him in stable condition ,for
> now . He can't move his legs ,has an unknown rash ( like broken blood
> vessels all over) Still running a fever over 101 . Witch was much higher
> for a longer time. He is having difficulty breathing and so much
> more wrong, take to long to tell. The doctors told us it would be good
> to come and be with him now, so we will be leaving in AM. on an emergency <--(from NY to Florida)
> flight. Gordy and Dad and I will be going together. He has improved
> alittle since he was admitted, but new problems keep coming up. They do
> not know what is wrong ???? It could be from his time in Iraq.
> There are many doctors on his case and watching him closely.
> If he get worse again ,they will send him to a
> bigger hospital . Please pray for him , they said he is very very sick,
---------------------------------------------- -------------------------- ------------------------

I would like to know where the original info came from and what evidence they thought they had at the time before I start calling people liars. We know for a fact that Saddam was a big fat liar though and we know he murdered his own people with WMD in the recent past.

UberLord · Dec 2, 2003, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BWX232
My cousin who lived next door to my my entire life might be one of those soldiers, hopefully not. He came hme from Iraq last week and all of the sudden started having major symtoms, including loss of feeling in his legs and the inability to walk.. Hmmm, over 20 years and no health problems, go to Iraq and strange nervouse system problems. Sounds like maybe he got a wiff os some chemical or virus over there- who knows. here is the e-mail we got.

Sounds like ........ Gulf War Syndrome.
Very big in the UK with ex soldiers from the 1st Gulf War.
A lot of the blame went with the MOD for drugs they were forced to take and equipment they were forced to handle. Little blame went to any chemical or biological weapons that may have been used by the Iraqis.

Quote:

I would like to know where the original info came from and what evidence they thought they had at the time before I start calling people liars. We know for a fact that Saddam was a big fat liar though and we know he murdered his own people with WMD in the recent past.

I'd like to know that as well.
But I bet you pounds to peanuts that if no more evidence is found, neither Bush or Blair will say they were wrong and they didn't lie.

PoopyTheJ · Dec 2, 2003, 04:23 PM

I'm sorry to hear that BWX. I really do hope things turn around for him, however I think you may want to read this. http://washingtontimes.com/upi-break...5156-7401r.htm
"An estimated 84 percent of the personnel who had anthrax vaccine shots ... reported having side effects or reactions," says Bingaman's resolution, a copy of which was obtained by United Press International.

Maiky · Dec 2, 2003, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BWX232
Did anyone here see the videos of Saddam's soldiers blindfolding and pushing people off of roofs? Saddam WAS a weapon of mass destruction. Who gives a crap if he didn't happen to have a nuke at the time, he was trying to get one, that is well known.
Don't forget the fact that we are still finding weapons caches all the time and anthrax and other bio weapons are very small, easy to hide, easily destroy, and easily made to be ready to be whipped up on short notice while disguised as "research" or legitimate uses.

Hmm, I wonder why thousands of Iraqi soldiers all had gas masks when found dead, and why there were stock piles of gas masks and bio-suits found all over the place over there. Maybe Saddam was going to launch an attack right when we struck but the command didn't go through because all the the s"hock and awe", or maybe his orders were ignored.

Maiky, tell me why you love a piece of human garbage like Saddam so much and would rather support him than defend the people that risked everything all to oust him?

I hate this piece of shit, believe me BWX232, but i think that anyone can destroy a government of any country even they are this kind of shit. There are many ways to change it and war is not one.

BWX · Dec 2, 2003, 06:15 PM

Well about 5 minutes ago I responded to the last couple of posts, press "submit reply", and thought it went through. I guess it didn't, I'll have to respond later.

The_Neon_Cowboy · Dec 2, 2003, 06:22 PM

I like to take amoment to mention somwthing.

The fact that the country was armed to the teeth. with enough RPG's found in early discoverys to arm every man , woman, and child with a RPGs alone.

the most recent weapons caches with weapons found more the 300 tons of ordanence, 0% for the us but intel form all over the world. Spain being one of them named! what do you have to say about that? Why was your counrty arming iraq?

Maiky · Dec 2, 2003, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Neon_Cowboy
I like to take amoment to mention somwthing.

The fact that the country was armed to the teeth. with enough RPG's found in early discoverys to arm every man , woman, and child with a RPGs alone.

the most recent weapons caches with weapons found more the 300 tons of ordanence, 0% for the us but intel form all over the world. Spain being one of them named! what do you have to say about that? Why was your counrty arming iraq?

I dont like my government, im disagree with them with many opinions like to be in favour of war with USA and UK or do more for private education than pulic one... but if it is real, i have another reason to say that my goverment is crap.

I really didnt know anything about it. Please The_Neon_Cowboy if is posible show me it.

digerati · Dec 2, 2003, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maiky
I hate this piece of shit, believe me BWX232, but i think that anyone can destroy a government of any country even they are this kind of shit. There are many ways to change it and war is not one.

You don't want war, which is good. We shouldn't have to live in a world with wars. But the hard truth is, if someone had a difference of opinion over there, they were tortured or killed, sometimes their families too. If your wife was raped by Saddam's people and then shot because you didn't support the Bath party, I think you'd give anything to see him removed and killed.

UberLord · Dec 3, 2003, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Neon_Cowboy
I like to take amoment to mention somwthing.

The fact that the country was armed to the teeth. with enough RPG's found in early discoverys to arm every man , woman, and child with a RPGs alone.

the most recent weapons caches with weapons found more the 300 tons of ordanence, 0% for the us but intel form all over the world. Spain being one of them named! what do you have to say about that? Why was your counrty arming iraq?

Ahem

http://www.prisonplanet.com/analysis...0703_iraq.html

USA and UK were doing it as well.

The_Neon_Cowboy · Dec 3, 2003, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maiky
I dont like my government, im disagree with them with many opinions like to be in favour of war with USA and UK or do more for private education than pulic one... but if it is real, i have another reason to say that my goverment is crap.

I really didnt know anything about it. Please The_Neon_Cowboy if is posible show me it.

All I know is in an interview with a genral in iraq, it was mention the origans of the arms they are finding among the list also germany, france, russia,. Speaking of just these tree now it was also mentioned that these arms were aparently sold on credit meaning with out being paid for yet. giveing yet another reason for thier opposition to the war . they wanted paid for thier countless weapons they sold on credit.There are demoltions teams destorying weapons cacthes as we speek.

Quote:

Originally posted by UberLord
Ahem

http://www.prisonplanet.com/analysis...0703_iraq.html

USA and UK were doing it as well.

Quote:

By pure coincidence, the Americans seized the document before it could be passed on to the U.N. Security Council. They edited out 8,000 pages, more than two-thirds of the entire dossier, citing its contents as ‘risky’. CFR henchman Kofi Annan made noticeably little fuss, describing the theft as ‘unfortunate,’ but angry U.N. diplomats did see that the original contents were leaked to a German media source. U.S. war hawks pounced on the ‘gaps’ that they had personally created, citing them as a material breach of U.N. resolutions,

ok if this was true how would this guy know about it? hmm? he wouln't

Do I find a single thing that site says creditable?
NO. are their statements based on 100% provable fact no.
all I see is anti us propaganda when i see site like that.

The sites basic just is consericy thery and america ploting for world domiation. Sayting thiat the govemats planing to delcare matial law orver the constution.

did the usa suppy weapons far in the past it's a fact... But i was speaking of a weopns cache of like 300,000 tons of oranance (largest found so far )... 0% was usa made. that was my point.....

The_Neon_Cowboy · Dec 3, 2003, 01:27 PM

ok this take a close look @ this guy you link 2's sites etc... there ubber. I mean no dis respect the the site you linked 2 is trash.

http://www.infowars.com/
http://PRISONPLANET.COM

his mission statement?

Alex Jones Presents Infowars.com to Fight the New World Order (the united states)

hes stsed everything thing form that the US has declred martail law. and i totally ignoreing the constitution .. etc.... tyhis guy shovels more crap then a horse stable. he's another michael moore .

"We Want War"

when he bases his new stories he uses site that are total trash like http://www.guardian.co.uk/
saysting the us troops run around a shooting at random and killing civvialns, exagorating stories etc...

he makes book and movies... really the simuaitrys between this guy an michal moore are scary.

"The New World Order elite has big plans for Arnold"

"United States Military or New World Order Police Force?"

so acording to this guy you'd think bush is HITLER and the US people and the goverment are the nazis and were all trying to take over the world.

he cuts and trusts truths/half truths/lies to how he sees fit. his site is no more that Anti us propaganda

UberLord · Dec 3, 2003, 01:34 PM

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2002Dec29.html

How about the Washington Post?

The_Neon_Cowboy · Dec 3, 2003, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by UberLord
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2002Dec29.html

How about the Washington Post?

like i said i know they did in the past. coulnt help but bash that terrable site. The post is'n the best of sources eather lol

what i like to mention 2 is the was a shipment of weapons (tons of mortors) cought in i think it was itally... w/ false papers and seized.

belived to be on thier way on thier way to iraq during the main attack to be uses against us troops.
Or another possablity? on their their way to some where else from iraq?

It was also rumored on the battle field. As stated by the genral in charge of our forces. that france helped iraq hide eveidence of WMD before thier arrival.

BluntmaN · Dec 7, 2003, 05:44 AM

Quote:

It was also rumored on the battle field. As stated by the genral in charge of our forces. that france helped iraq hide eveidence of WMD before thier arrival.

You mean the reciepts saying United Stated of America? They where doing you a favor.

digerati · Dec 7, 2003, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BluntmaN
You mean the reciepts saying United Stated of America? They where doing you a favor.

It's well known we sold Iraq weapons during the Iran - Iraq war. None of us are trying to claim otherwise. But at least our dealins are well known, which should scare the French because it shows they have no idea what their country is doing.

BluntmaN · Dec 9, 2003, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ^_^
It's well known we sold Iraq weapons during the Iran - Iraq war. None of us are trying to claim otherwise. But at least our dealins are well known, which should scare the French because it shows they have no idea what their country is doing.

Not just weapons according to US sources you sold them biological and chemical weapons. What are yoy talking about the French care for some sources or a bit more explaining?

Nexus7even · Dec 10, 2003, 12:01 AM

Does anyone remember any of Bush's speeches leading up to the war? This war was predicated on the "fact" that Saddam had in his posession large quantities of nuclear payload and nasty chemical weapons delivery systems. I don't even care about the fact that we have yet to find anything useful in proving these "facts." What concerns me most is that he has since shifted the reason that we went in to Iraq to something along the lines of, "Well, Saddam was a bad man, and he killed lots of people with firing squads, torture sessions, and starvation." Erm, well, I can think of about a dozen other places in the world where this kind of mass killing idiocy has occurred for the past 20 years and continues to occur to this day. Will we be going into places like Rwanda next? I'm all for helping people, but do we really need to spend the lives of our young men and women to help a group of people that don't want our help? It doesn't make any sense to me. This war was started because of an apparent "imminent" risk to the lives of American citizens, and we have yet to discover actual evidence of that risk. That does not bode well for our international reputation or for my and many other citizens' confidence in our government.

Markius · Dec 10, 2003, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Maiky

is legal to invent fake documents to wage a war?
has the USA government done it?

Myth #1: The Estimate favored going to war: Intelligence judgments, including NIEs, are policy neutral. We do not propose policies and the Estimate in no way sought to sway policymakers toward a particular course of action. We described what we judged were Saddam's WMD programs and capabilities and how and when he might use them and left it to policymakers, as we always do, to determine the appropriate course of action.

did you read that bit?

BluntmaN · Dec 12, 2003, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Markius
Myth #1: The Estimate favored going to war: Intelligence judgments, including NIEs, are policy neutral. We do not propose policies and the Estimate in no way sought to sway policymakers toward a particular course of action. We described what we judged were Saddam's WMD programs and capabilities and how and when he might use them and left it to policymakers, as we always do, to determine the appropriate course of action.

did you read that bit?

Inteligence reports are meant to help decision makers to form policies and take appropriate course of action. In Iraq's case the inteligence reports were not possitive on the WMD but that didnt stop a goverment to lie about them to the rest of the world. The intelligence reports prove nothing and were never meant to prove anything but Bush used them to prove a point he could not prove otherwise. The "he was a bad boy" story is nice though does it mean that americans will stop supporting totalitarian goverments?

Dec 2, 2003, 07:24 AM	#4
Falstaff Old Codger Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: USAFA Posts: 19,048 Rep Power: 207	yes, and fully capable of carrying a useful physics package capable of 20 megatons of atomic blast energy, the ignorance of the world to the capability of Hussiens former regime is terrible, but hey, they can be ignorant and hostile like Micheal Moore... __________________ "Inspiration is always a surprising visitor."

Dec 2, 2003, 09:40 AM	#5
UberLord A Legend in Underwear Join Date: May 2002 Location: Unknown Posts: 5,255 Rep Power: 0	It's funny that pro-war types overlook the fact the English were told that chemical and biological warfare could be launched from Iraq in 45 minutes. Most of Tony Blairs basis for war was based on this. Where are they? I'm not denying that Iraq had illegal missiles, but no-one can deny that they didn't have the WMD we were told either. __________________ Gentoo Linux - Developer (baselayout) Read my blog "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." Stephen Roberts

Dec 2, 2003, 10:32 AM	#6
BWX unplugged Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: USNY Posts: 19,669 Rep Power: 110 System Specs	Did anyone here see the videos of Saddam's soldiers blindfolding and pushing people off of roofs? Saddam WAS a weapon of mass destruction. Who gives a crap if he didn't happen to have a nuke at the time, he was trying to get one, that is well known. Don't forget the fact that we are still finding weapons caches all the time and anthrax and other bio weapons are very small, easy to hide, easily destroy, and easily made to be ready to be whipped up on short notice while disguised as "research" or legitimate uses. Hmm, I wonder why thousands of Iraqi soldiers all had gas masks when found dead, and why there were stock piles of gas masks and bio-suits found all over the place over there. Maybe Saddam was going to launch an attack right when we struck but the command didn't go through because all the the s"hock and awe", or maybe his orders were ignored. Maiky, tell me why you love a piece of human garbage like Saddam so much and would rather support him than defend the people that risked everything all to oust him? __________________

Dec 2, 2003, 11:19 AM	#7
UberLord A Legend in Underwear Join Date: May 2002 Location: Unknown Posts: 5,255 Rep Power: 0	BMX232 - you're changing the topic. This isn't about Saddam being good or evil, it's about wether or not the public was lied to about the WMD Iraq was thought to have had and that because of this we had to go to war. __________________ Gentoo Linux - Developer (baselayout) Read my blog "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." Stephen Roberts

Dec 2, 2003, 04:23 PM	#12
PoopyTheJ DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,588 Rep Power: 66	I'm sorry to hear that BWX. I really do hope things turn around for him, however I think you may want to read this. http://washingtontimes.com/upi-break...5156-7401r.htm "An estimated 84 percent of the personnel who had anthrax vaccine shots ... reported having side effects or reactions," says Bingaman's resolution, a copy of which was obtained by United Press International. __________________ [COLOR=Blue]“Alright boys, let’s start her up and see why she doesn’t work.” - John Fritz "I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds ATI Catalyst Beta Tester[/COLOR]

Dec 2, 2003, 02:27 AM	#1
Maiky REDRUM "237" Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Alicante (Spain) Posts: 550 Rep Power: 0	WMD? - CIA Press Release Where are the Iraq's Weapons of Mass Destruction? If you want to see another funny episode of USA government and CIA, please click here http://www.cia.gov/cia/public_affair...r11282003.html is legal to invent fake documents to wage a war? has the USA government done it? __________________ All Work and no play makes Jack a dull boy. JACK TORRANCE

Dec 2, 2003, 07:02 AM	#3
JavaFox E Pluribus Unum Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 3,203 Rep Power: 0	It's funny that anti-war types ignore the fact that al Samoud II missiles, which were illegal for Saddam's regime to possess, were found in bulk in Iraq and shown on every TV station in the world.

Dec 2, 2003, 06:15 PM	#14
BWX unplugged Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: USNY Posts: 19,669 Rep Power: 110 System Specs	Well about 5 minutes ago I responded to the last couple of posts, press "submit reply", and thought it went through. I guess it didn't, I'll have to respond later. __________________

Dec 2, 2003, 06:22 PM	#15
The_Neon_Cowboy HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 16,009 Rep Power: 92 System Specs	I like to take amoment to mention somwthing. The fact that the country was armed to the teeth. with enough RPG's found in early discoverys to arm every man , woman, and child with a RPGs alone. the most recent weapons caches with weapons found more the 300 tons of ordanence, 0% for the us but intel form all over the world. Spain being one of them named! what do you have to say about that? Why was your counrty arming iraq? __________________

Dec 3, 2003, 01:27 PM	#20
The_Neon_Cowboy HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 16,009 Rep Power: 92 System Specs	ok this take a close look @ this guy you link 2's sites etc... there ubber. I mean no dis respect the the site you linked 2 is trash. http://www.infowars.com/ http://PRISONPLANET.COM his mission statement? Alex Jones Presents Infowars.com to Fight the New World Order (the united states) hes stsed everything thing form that the US has declred martail law. and i totally ignoreing the constitution .. etc.... tyhis guy shovels more crap then a horse stable. he's another michael moore . "We Want War" when he bases his new stories he uses site that are total trash like http://www.guardian.co.uk/ saysting the us troops run around a shooting at random and killing civvialns, exagorating stories etc... he makes book and movies... really the simuaitrys between this guy an michal moore are scary. "The New World Order elite has big plans for Arnold" "United States Military or New World Order Police Force?" so acording to this guy you'd think bush is HITLER and the US people and the goverment are the nazis and were all trying to take over the world. he cuts and trusts truths/half truths/lies to how he sees fit. his site is no more that Anti us propaganda Last edited by The_Neon_Cowboy; Dec 3, 2003 at 01:33 PM.

Dec 3, 2003, 01:34 PM	#21
UberLord A Legend in Underwear Join Date: May 2002 Location: Unknown Posts: 5,255 Rep Power: 0	http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...2002Dec29.html How about the Washington Post? __________________ Gentoo Linux - Developer (baselayout) Read my blog "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." Stephen Roberts

Dec 10, 2003, 12:01 AM	#26
Nexus7even DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 17 Rep Power: 0	Does anyone remember any of Bush's speeches leading up to the war? This war was predicated on the "fact" that Saddam had in his posession large quantities of nuclear payload and nasty chemical weapons delivery systems. I don't even care about the fact that we have yet to find anything useful in proving these "facts." What concerns me most is that he has since shifted the reason that we went in to Iraq to something along the lines of, "Well, Saddam was a bad man, and he killed lots of people with firing squads, torture sessions, and starvation." Erm, well, I can think of about a dozen other places in the world where this kind of mass killing idiocy has occurred for the past 20 years and continues to occur to this day. Will we be going into places like Rwanda next? I'm all for helping people, but do we really need to spend the lives of our young men and women to help a group of people that don't want our help? It doesn't make any sense to me. This war was started because of an apparent "imminent" risk to the lives of American citizens, and we have yet to discover actual evidence of that risk. That does not bode well for our international reputation or for my and many other citizens' confidence in our government.