Windows Vista

OAKsider · Oct 12, 2006, 07:49 PM

"I don't like the look of it."

Yeah, that about sums it up.

From WGA lockdown to über user-friendliness to all the negative reviews from (so-called) professionals, I'm not liking the look of Vista. I sure hope I'm wrong about it though, as I can't wait for a stable, supported 64-bit Windows and DirectX 10 gaming along with Mac-like UI improvements. I hope for the best . . .

ET3D · Oct 15, 2006, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zardon

I actually don't mind Vista however I dislike it for one reason. I know if MS wanted, DX10 could have ran on XP. Its a money making exercise.

I wrote a long reply, but the short is: it's not a money making exercise, it's a money saving one. Complaining about DX10 not being in XP is like complaining about new games not running on a GeForce4 MX. Sure, it'd be nice, but it's just a hassle for the developers. Vista is different from XP at many levels, and retrofitting XP to support it would be a waste of resources.

Of course, that's not to say that Microsoft is not money grabbing. It's just that in this case I don't think it's excessively so. It would have made no business sense to delay Vista and DX10 further, and possibly cause more work for the graphics hardware vendors, too, by making XP support it.

ET3D · Oct 15, 2006, 06:18 PM

Oh, and as for the poll, of the Vista versions I tried to install (7 of them, I think), the only one I managed to install was Beta 2, and I didn't get the sound card and networking working there (not that I tried too hard). Other than this, from what I saw, it'd take me a bit of time to get used to it, but probably not too much, and it seems to provide some benefits over XP.

So the major issue is whether it'd install. That's the thing that will prevent me from getting it. So I'm not exactly on "undecided", but more like "waiting to see how the dice fall."

studbagel9 · Oct 18, 2006, 11:43 PM

I've had problems with my RAM running vista. I read an article today in the news section here and I posted a comment about it: After Beta 2 came out I started getting blue screens like crazy every 15 minutes of uptime. That's not really acceptable to me. XP runs fine for now. I'll upgrade when I have to. I think that Vista for me though, is a lot more... step intensive than XP is. It feels like Vista was built for newbies and not power users. There's not a real fast way to do anything... at least not in the time I've spent with it so far. Hopefully it's just a matter of me not being able to find the right things... One thing I didn't like is that Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory didn't work because the OS wouldn't let the starforce software be installed. Most other games worked fine, performance was a little less than XP, not bad for completely new beta drivers I would say though. I'll get it when games start coming out that require DX10 for the total experience, and also when I can get it at a discount from my school ;p. 500 dollars for "Ultimate" doesn't seem to be a worthwhile investment to me. 500 dollars for any piece of software doesn't really seem to be a worthwhile investment to me though...

Lupine · Oct 25, 2006, 08:54 PM

I've been running Vista on my HP Pavilion dv5163cl laptop (1.6GHz Yonah, GF7400, 1Gb DDR2) from Beta2 through RC2 5744. Beta2 was terrible but the RC versions have run great. And yet, I didn't vote in the poll because I didn't see an option that reflected my opinion on the OS.

I like Vista. I really do. Starting w/ RC1 I actually prefer it to my XP Pro installs, which surprises even me. But as much as I like it, I'm not sure I want it anymore (not that I'll probably have a choice). Sure, I'll keep the free copy of Ultimate that MS is going to send me but, at this point anyway, I'm not going to spend the dough to deploy it to all of my computers (laptop, workstation, htpc - server is stuck w/ sbs2003 r2 premium). Why not?

Because of the EULA "clarifications".

I upgrade and I upgrade a lot. Probably more than I should but that's my problem, not Microsofts. During the 5yrs or so w/ XP Pro, I probably did a major upgrade on our two main computers (recently retired my wife's computer and built the HTPC and bought the laptop) four or five times during that period. And by major, I mean the type of upgrade Microsoft is trying to limit w/ the new Vista EULA. If XP had the Vista EULA this whole time, that would have meant that I'd be looking at buying my third XP license on each box right now as I prepare for the next round of upgrades (this time from AMD X2 to Intel Core2Duo). Ouch x10000.

With Vista, I'm either going to have to tone down my upgrade impulses or simply avoid the OS. Vista's "clarified" EULA allows you to transfer the license to a "new" computer one time. After that you have to get a new license. Lets think about this for a second. Who is this going to hurt? Obviously the enthusiast. But does it stop there? What about the mfgs that produce upgrade products? Microsoft considers motherboards and hard drives "major upgrades" that count as a "new computer". So both of those mfgs will be hurt. This will also trickle down the supply chain and hurt the retailers. How many HDDs and mobos does NewEgg sell to us? If I'm any example, a lot.

And it hurts me financially too. Upgrading customers is part of what I do as a computer consultant. Its almost laughable. I attend the MS/AMD tech tour every year and this year the MS reps were raving about all the new functionality brought to the table w/ Vista and Office 2007, and about how it was going to be $$$ in our pockets since people would be upgrading their hardware in order to take advantage of all the new candy. So one hand Vista simply eats up upgrades - the more power the better. Yet on the other hand it penalizes people for doing just that. Craziness.

Microsoft, in its fear of piracy, continues to do more and more to criminalize our activities. I have never pirated a copy of Windows yet I pay for piracy every time I get on the phone to reactivate XP. But now MS wants to take my $$$ as well as my time, and I'm about done. I'm tired of the being treated like a crook when I'm not one, and having my usage further restricted (the EULA, DRM, etc etc). Enough.

/rant

HawgsHead · Oct 25, 2006, 10:40 PM

Well.I guess we are all gonna have too get it and get used too it cause we are all gonna have too bite the bullett and buy it here pretty soon.

pigdog · Oct 26, 2006, 02:13 PM

I admit that I am an "upgrade junkie", and as much as I'm looking forward to exploring Vista's new "horizons" (sorry

), if this EULA from M$ is rigidly applied as it now stands, then I too will be forced to adjust my spending habits regarding hardware upgrades.

This situation could have a far reaching affect on PC hardware developers, particularly the graphics, hard-drive and sound card industries.

As for us; We may well find ourselves in a situation where we have to add the cost of buying a new Vista licence to the upgrade cost of our systems simply because we are trying to get the best performance that we can out of the latest hardware and graphics/soundcard etc, technological advances.

I can't help but think of the possible ramifications this could hold for the PC gaming industry, and therefore, the PC gamer.

For many people, the motive to upgrade their hardware comes from their desire to experience the latest games to the highest level of detail.

So in the not too distant future, to get the most out of "Fear 2-The little bitch gets nailed", I may face the situation of not only having to buy 2 new ATI X2650XT Crossfire (full steroid edition with free AMD/ATI/Valve Tshirt) grahics add-in sub-PC systems, but a new OS as well.

Meh!

Oct 12, 2006, 07:49 PM	#61
OAKsider DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boat, Gulf Posts: 59 Rep Power: 0	"I don't like the look of it." Yeah, that about sums it up. From WGA lockdown to über user-friendliness to all the negative reviews from (so-called) professionals, I'm not liking the look of Vista. I sure hope I'm wrong about it though, as I can't wait for a stable, supported 64-bit Windows and DirectX 10 gaming along with Mac-like UI improvements. I hope for the best . . . __________________ [COLOR=gray][COLOR=gray] [/COLOR][/COLOR]

Oct 18, 2006, 11:43 PM	#64
studbagel9 Rolling the Hard Six Join Date: May 2003 Location: Lock Haven, PA Posts: 767 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	I've had problems with my RAM running vista. I read an article today in the news section here and I posted a comment about it: After Beta 2 came out I started getting blue screens like crazy every 15 minutes of uptime. That's not really acceptable to me. XP runs fine for now. I'll upgrade when I have to. I think that Vista for me though, is a lot more... step intensive than XP is. It feels like Vista was built for newbies and not power users. There's not a real fast way to do anything... at least not in the time I've spent with it so far. Hopefully it's just a matter of me not being able to find the right things... One thing I didn't like is that Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory didn't work because the OS wouldn't let the starforce software be installed. Most other games worked fine, performance was a little less than XP, not bad for completely new beta drivers I would say though. I'll get it when games start coming out that require DX10 for the total experience, and also when I can get it at a discount from my school ;p. 500 dollars for "Ultimate" doesn't seem to be a worthwhile investment to me. 500 dollars for any piece of software doesn't really seem to be a worthwhile investment to me though... __________________

Oct 25, 2006, 10:40 PM	#66
HawgsHead Rest In Peace Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Danville Virginia.The United States of America"In the God of Abraham,Isaac and Jacob We Trust" Posts: 2,012 Rep Power: 0	Well.I guess we are all gonna have too get it and get used too it cause we are all gonna have too bite the bullett and buy it here pretty soon. __________________ Rig specs to the left in the boxes....X-Box 360 w/Hitachi 42" HDTV....If Darwins theory of evolution is true then why are monkeys still monkeys?It takes much more faith to believe in Darwin's theory over the Genesis account of creation.

Oct 26, 2006, 02:13 PM	#67
pigdog HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 471 Rep Power: 55 System Specs	I admit that I am an "upgrade junkie", and as much as I'm looking forward to exploring Vista's new "horizons" (sorry ), if this EULA from M$ is rigidly applied as it now stands, then I too will be forced to adjust my spending habits regarding hardware upgrades. This situation could have a far reaching affect on PC hardware developers, particularly the graphics, hard-drive and sound card industries. As for us; We may well find ourselves in a situation where we have to add the cost of buying a new Vista licence to the upgrade cost of our systems simply because we are trying to get the best performance that we can out of the latest hardware and graphics/soundcard etc, technological advances. I can't help but think of the possible ramifications this could hold for the PC gaming industry, and therefore, the PC gamer. For many people, the motive to upgrade their hardware comes from their desire to experience the latest games to the highest level of detail. So in the not too distant future, to get the most out of "Fear 2-The little bitch gets nailed", I may face the situation of not only having to buy 2 new ATI X2650XT Crossfire (full steroid edition with free AMD/ATI/Valve Tshirt) grahics add-in sub-PC systems, but a new OS as well. Meh! __________________

Oct 15, 2006, 06:18 PM	#63
ET3D Hopeless Dreamer Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Dreamland, near the pool of infinite graphics cards Posts: 3,055 Rep Power: 103 System Specs	Oh, and as for the poll, of the Vista versions I tried to install (7 of them, I think), the only one I managed to install was Beta 2, and I didn't get the sound card and networking working there (not that I tried too hard). Other than this, from what I saw, it'd take me a bit of time to get used to it, but probably not too much, and it seems to provide some benefits over XP. So the major issue is whether it'd install. That's the thing that will prevent me from getting it. So I'm not exactly on "undecided", but more like "waiting to see how the dice fall."

Oct 25, 2006, 08:54 PM	#65
Lupine DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3 Rep Power: 0	I've been running Vista on my HP Pavilion dv5163cl laptop (1.6GHz Yonah, GF7400, 1Gb DDR2) from Beta2 through RC2 5744. Beta2 was terrible but the RC versions have run great. And yet, I didn't vote in the poll because I didn't see an option that reflected my opinion on the OS. I like Vista. I really do. Starting w/ RC1 I actually prefer it to my XP Pro installs, which surprises even me. But as much as I like it, I'm not sure I want it anymore (not that I'll probably have a choice). Sure, I'll keep the free copy of Ultimate that MS is going to send me but, at this point anyway, I'm not going to spend the dough to deploy it to all of my computers (laptop, workstation, htpc - server is stuck w/ sbs2003 r2 premium). Why not? Because of the EULA "clarifications". I upgrade and I upgrade a lot. Probably more than I should but that's my problem, not Microsofts. During the 5yrs or so w/ XP Pro, I probably did a major upgrade on our two main computers (recently retired my wife's computer and built the HTPC and bought the laptop) four or five times during that period. And by major, I mean the type of upgrade Microsoft is trying to limit w/ the new Vista EULA. If XP had the Vista EULA this whole time, that would have meant that I'd be looking at buying my third XP license on each box right now as I prepare for the next round of upgrades (this time from AMD X2 to Intel Core2Duo). Ouch x10000. With Vista, I'm either going to have to tone down my upgrade impulses or simply avoid the OS. Vista's "clarified" EULA allows you to transfer the license to a "new" computer one time. After that you have to get a new license. Lets think about this for a second. Who is this going to hurt? Obviously the enthusiast. But does it stop there? What about the mfgs that produce upgrade products? Microsoft considers motherboards and hard drives "major upgrades" that count as a "new computer". So both of those mfgs will be hurt. This will also trickle down the supply chain and hurt the retailers. How many HDDs and mobos does NewEgg sell to us? If I'm any example, a lot. And it hurts me financially too. Upgrading customers is part of what I do as a computer consultant. Its almost laughable. I attend the MS/AMD tech tour every year and this year the MS reps were raving about all the new functionality brought to the table w/ Vista and Office 2007, and about how it was going to be $$$ in our pockets since people would be upgrading their hardware in order to take advantage of all the new candy. So one hand Vista simply eats up upgrades - the more power the better. Yet on the other hand it penalizes people for doing just that. Craziness. Microsoft, in its fear of piracy, continues to do more and more to criminalize our activities. I have never pirated a copy of Windows yet I pay for piracy every time I get on the phone to reactivate XP. But now MS wants to take my $$$ as well as my time, and I'm about done. I'm tired of the being treated like a crook when I'm not one, and having my usage further restricted (the EULA, DRM, etc etc). Enough. /rant