The Future of DHzer0point

pr0digal jenius · Feb 16, 2005, 11:28 PM

Time to buckle down and roll out another DH zer0point set before too long. However, after much debate Drew and I have decided to let you guys decide. We personally hate the idea of optimizing drivers beyond the "ugly" threshold simply in the name of frame rates. Anyone who has tried our drivers can most likely testify to this and we are more then aware that our drivers don't always push out the impressive 3DMark scores some others do, but we're in it for the IQ.

So, we are passing the mantle of decision on to you, our users. Should we continue releasing "Performance", "Balanced", and "Quality" sets, or should we simply focus on "Quality" and leave the other areas to the other guys?

*NOTE* Focusing on quality drivers only allows for more frequent releases, as well as more time spent on adding some cool new things we have cooking up, as well as Catalyst drivers

sc3000 · Feb 16, 2005, 11:40 PM

I say quality because I have people saying, o but I lag on ut2k4 with my p3 and g-force 2, their is no point in gaming if quality sucks.

mike2h · Feb 16, 2005, 11:42 PM

well i do not like either of the choices.
my vote would be to drop 'balanced' concentrate on 'iq'. & release an occasional 'perf' when a driver set looks promising. just so people with older cards have some action along with the fps hounds

imo the 6766 is the best bet for a perf set for older cards(granted there are diminshing returns here.). you got any more room for perf tweaking with that set?
you want my opinion on working on the catalyst?

Edswor · Feb 16, 2005, 11:49 PM

Focus only on "Quality".

nitrousoxide52 · Feb 16, 2005, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sc3000

I say quality because I have people saying, o but I lag on ut2k4 with my p3 and g-force 2, their is no point in gaming if quality sucks.

bad FPS would be performance

pr0digal jenius · Feb 16, 2005, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike2h

well i do not like either of the choices.
my vote would be to drop 'balanced' concentrate on 'iq'. & release an occasional 'perf' when a driver set looks promising. just so people with older cards have some action along with the fps hounds

imo the 6766 is the best bet for a perf set for older cards(granted there are diminshing returns here.). you got any more room for perf tweaking with that set?
you want my opinion on working on the catalyst?

It really isn't too much more work to make all 3 sets then it is 2 just make the 2 is why I asked. But the 2 is a good deal more work then just 1

qweqaz5 · Feb 16, 2005, 11:59 PM

I like the idea of 'Performance and 'Quality' sets only. 'Quality' will fit nicely for those with high-end cards, where as 'Performance' would suit users with lower-end cards wanting all the latest bug fixes for their favorite games.

What'd ya think?

Jitter · Feb 17, 2005, 12:25 AM

I vote for what qweqaz5 said I think a performance and quality set would be nice. My PC/card is getting outdated, and it would be nice to see some high performance drivers to help prolong it a bit. I dont mind if somethings look "ugly"

Azetab · Feb 17, 2005, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike2h

well i do not like either of the choices.
my vote would be to drop 'balanced' concentrate on 'iq'. & release an occasional 'perf' when a driver set looks promising. just so people with older cards have some action along with the fps hounds

imo the 6766 is the best bet for a perf set for older cards(granted there are diminshing returns here.). you got any more room for perf tweaking with that set?
you want my opinion on working on the catalyst?

I agree with mike2h as to there should be a quality and performance set only. My card is very outdated and I would be grateful if you guys modded newer drivers for performance for older cards like mines.

Hellbent · Feb 17, 2005, 01:20 AM

Do the quality drivers. 10 or 20 fps doesn't matter that much to me, as long as I get around 60.

BurL · Feb 17, 2005, 01:21 AM

Quality please.

PoopyTheJ · Feb 17, 2005, 01:24 AM

The thing is we're IQ hounds at heart and though our performance releases would be better performance than our quality releases, well they'll look better than other sets because frankly 3dmark and fps for the sake of fps doesn't interest us, we feel that performance should be fine on older cards especially with turning down the IQ slider to fit your tastes but our internal performance and quality tweaks should remain... I do like mike2h's idea though, perhaps only random performance sets as a promising set comes along......

pr0digal jenius · Feb 17, 2005, 01:28 AM

yea, that's not a bad idea. Release regular Quality sets, and the occasional "Retro-card" performance set

Shadow Lady · Feb 17, 2005, 01:29 AM

Balanced here (but only auze im stuck to the Radeon 9500pro -.-)

mike2h · Feb 17, 2005, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0digal jenius

It really isn't too much more work to make all 3 sets then it is 2 just make the 2 is why I asked. But the 2 is a good deal more work then just 1

which is why i said an occasional perf.
this is your guys call. i want you to do whatever makes you happy(not talking about the whip this time or 'the horn' for that matter

). as long as you guys are happy you will continue your excellent work. when your not, you will stop.
so do whatever you want so this continues to be an enjoyable experience for both of you.

pr0digal jenius · Feb 17, 2005, 02:01 AM

it's enjoyable either way, it's our turn to ask which is more enjoyable for yall though. MORE quality sets, or LESS sets designed for a wider array of stuff

TJ- · Feb 17, 2005, 02:02 AM

make it a mix of both, with a slight increase in quallity.... just dont skimp on performance!

mike2h · Feb 17, 2005, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pr0digal jenius

it's enjoyable either way, it's our turn to ask which is more enjoyable for yall though. MORE quality sets, or LESS sets designed for a wider array of stuff

well, i gave you my opinion. now as to what is enjoyable for me...

if you want to help i could send you a pm.

AMD4Life · Feb 17, 2005, 03:25 AM

Quality all the way! Just as long as I don't have to blame my getting killed in CS: S was due to bad fps.

pr0digal jenius · Feb 17, 2005, 03:35 AM

We'll add that into the EULA just for you AMD4Life

"We are not to blame for sudden decrease in kill ratio due to increased quality of image and a sudden distinct fasination with bump mapped walls"

AMD4Life · Feb 17, 2005, 03:43 AM

Awesome!

nitrousoxide52 · Feb 17, 2005, 03:45 AM

Haha thats great

ColdPenguin · Feb 17, 2005, 04:03 AM

Just focus on quality. Because quality is performance. Because if the image quality is good you will not have to turn on Anti-Aliasing and Anistropic Filtering. Therefore quality=performance.

Now if you make a driver that produces the same image quality on 0x AF as a normal driver with 2x AF BUT it runs slower, then that it is not an IQ improvement but instead a step backward, simply because the normal driver in that circumstance would have the same IQ (assuming the user had the insight to enable 2x AF) at a faster frame rate. Basically true image quality should be defined as quality divided by frame rate if you get my drift. Well it makes perfect sense to me.

Shaga · Feb 17, 2005, 05:54 AM

I have a new 3dcard, and I didn't buy this to see games as I saw them with my old ati radeon 9200se. I like to see excellent quality without non-playable fps. I like the idea of releasing retrosets at times.

So quality sets would be your goal but when nvidia releases some drivers with bad quality and excellent performance especially with older cards, you could start making retro set of it. I even like the word 'retro' so it could be included in the driver sets name

Now time to get my ass back to work.

Shaga · Feb 17, 2005, 05:56 AM

And one point to add, quality means stability as well

PoopyTheJ · Feb 17, 2005, 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaga

And one point to add, quality means stability as well

Agreed...

PoopyTheJ · Feb 17, 2005, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shaga

I have a new 3dcard, and I didn't buy this to see games as I saw them with my old ati radeon 9200se. I like to see excellent quality without non-playable fps. I like the idea of releasing retrosets at times.

So quality sets would be your goal but when nvidia releases some drivers with bad quality and excellent performance especially with older cards, you could start making retro set of it. I even like the word 'retro' so it could be included in the driver sets name

Now time to get my ass back to work.

Maybe we'll call them the "DHzer0point Shaga's Retro Set"

BWX · Feb 17, 2005, 08:21 AM

When are these DHzeropoint Cats coming out? Will they incorporate the CCC or not?

Shaga · Feb 17, 2005, 09:06 AM

Retro forever!

I miss my "retro computer", now it's too hard to get linux up and running..

starfury6 · Feb 17, 2005, 09:12 AM

Quality with the occasional Perf set would be cool

Feb 16, 2005, 11:28 PM	#1
pr0digal jenius Delete Me Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 14,648 Rep Power: 0	The Future of DHzer0point Time to buckle down and roll out another DH zer0point set before too long. However, after much debate Drew and I have decided to let you guys decide. We personally hate the idea of optimizing drivers beyond the "ugly" threshold simply in the name of frame rates. Anyone who has tried our drivers can most likely testify to this and we are more then aware that our drivers don't always push out the impressive 3DMark scores some others do, but we're in it for the IQ. So, we are passing the mantle of decision on to you, our users. Should we continue releasing "Performance", "Balanced", and "Quality" sets, or should we simply focus on "Quality" and leave the other areas to the other guys? NOTE Focusing on quality drivers only allows for more frequent releases, as well as more time spent on adding some cool new things we have cooking up, as well as Catalyst drivers

Feb 16, 2005, 11:42 PM	#3
mike2h DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: norcal Posts: 6,483 Rep Power: 91 System Specs	well i do not like either of the choices. my vote would be to drop 'balanced' concentrate on 'iq'. & release an occasional 'perf' when a driver set looks promising. just so people with older cards have some action along with the fps hounds imo the 6766 is the best bet for a perf set for older cards(granted there are diminshing returns here.). you got any more room for perf tweaking with that set? you want my opinion on working on the catalyst? __________________

Feb 16, 2005, 11:49 PM	#4
Edswor DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6 Rep Power: 0	Focus only on "Quality". __________________ Neverwinter Nights y Warcraft III en Español: http://www.iespana.es/edswor e-mail: edswor@hotmail.com

Feb 17, 2005, 12:25 AM	#8
Jitter HardwareHeaven Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 534 Rep Power: 0	I vote for what qweqaz5 said I think a performance and quality set would be nice. My PC/card is getting outdated, and it would be nice to see some high performance drivers to help prolong it a bit. I dont mind if somethings look "ugly" __________________ Sony Vaio PCV-RX670 P4 1.8ghz XP Pro SP2 1 GB PC2100 RAM ATI All in Wonder 9700 pro Audigy 2 ZS Aquamark ~29,500 3dMark03 ~ 5,000

Feb 17, 2005, 01:21 AM	#11
BurL Liver SUCKS!!!! Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 228 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Quality please. __________________ If I had a bean burrito I would smash it all over my chest.

Feb 16, 2005, 11:40 PM	#2
sc3000 DriverHeaven Lover Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New York Posts: 225 Rep Power: 0	I say quality because I have people saying, o but I lag on ut2k4 with my p3 and g-force 2, their is no point in gaming if quality sucks.

Feb 16, 2005, 11:59 PM	#7
qweqaz5 DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 88 Rep Power: 0	I like the idea of 'Performance and 'Quality' sets only. 'Quality' will fit nicely for those with high-end cards, where as 'Performance' would suit users with lower-end cards wanting all the latest bug fixes for their favorite games. What'd ya think?

Feb 17, 2005, 01:20 AM	#10
Hellbent DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 48 Rep Power: 0	Do the quality drivers. 10 or 20 fps doesn't matter that much to me, as long as I get around 60.

Feb 17, 2005, 01:24 AM	#12
PoopyTheJ DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,588 Rep Power: 66	The thing is we're IQ hounds at heart and though our performance releases would be better performance than our quality releases, well they'll look better than other sets because frankly 3dmark and fps for the sake of fps doesn't interest us, we feel that performance should be fine on older cards especially with turning down the IQ slider to fit your tastes but our internal performance and quality tweaks should remain... I do like mike2h's idea though, perhaps only random performance sets as a promising set comes along...... __________________ [COLOR=Blue]“Alright boys, let’s start her up and see why she doesn’t work.” - John Fritz "I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds ATI Catalyst Beta Tester[/COLOR]

Feb 17, 2005, 01:28 AM	Thread Starter #13
pr0digal jenius Delete Me Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 14,648 Rep Power: 0	yea, that's not a bad idea. Release regular Quality sets, and the occasional "Retro-card" performance set

Feb 17, 2005, 01:29 AM	#14
Shadow Lady Avril Fan Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: somewhere in colombia, okok, bogotá city :p Posts: 1,262 Rep Power: 0	Balanced here (but only auze im stuck to the Radeon 9500pro -.-) __________________ Oblivion ftw

Feb 17, 2005, 02:01 AM	Thread Starter #16
pr0digal jenius Delete Me Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 14,648 Rep Power: 0	it's enjoyable either way, it's our turn to ask which is more enjoyable for yall though. MORE quality sets, or LESS sets designed for a wider array of stuff

Feb 17, 2005, 02:02 AM	#17
TJ- DriverHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Infinity Posts: 3,679 Rep Power: 0	make it a mix of both, with a slight increase in quallity.... just dont skimp on performance! __________________ new sig comming soon

Feb 17, 2005, 03:25 AM	#19
AMD4Life -=[DHzer0point Team]=- Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 107 Rep Power: 0	Quality all the way! Just as long as I don't have to blame my getting killed in CS: S was due to bad fps. __________________ [color=green]-=[My Machine]=-[/color] [color=black]DFI LanParty UT nF3 250Gb Socket 754 Motherboard[/color] [color=black]AMD Athlon 64 3400+ @ 2.52GHz W/ Zalman CNPS7000b-Cu CPU Cooler[/color] [color=black]1GB Corsair Value PC3200 (512mb x 2, 2.5-3-3-8 1T)[/color] [color=black]eVGA e-GeForce 6800GT AGP @ 370/1100 W/ Zalman VF700-Cu VGA Cooler[/color] [color=black]Western Digital Caviar SE 80GB SATA HDD [/color] [color=black]Creative Audigy 2 ZS Sound Card[/color] [color=black]Rosewill RE502 500W Power Supply[/color]

Feb 17, 2005, 03:35 AM	Thread Starter #20
pr0digal jenius Delete Me Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 14,648 Rep Power: 0	We'll add that into the EULA just for you AMD4Life "We are not to blame for sudden decrease in kill ratio due to increased quality of image and a sudden distinct fasination with bump mapped walls"

Feb 17, 2005, 03:45 AM	#22
nitrousoxide52 Driverheaven.com err .net Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,719 Rep Power: 0	Haha thats great __________________ AMD Athlon64 X2 3800+ XFX Geforce 7800GT ABIT AN8-SLI BFG Tech 650w

Feb 17, 2005, 03:43 AM	#21
AMD4Life -=[DHzer0point Team]=- Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 107 Rep Power: 0	Awesome! __________________ [color=green]-=[My Machine]=-[/color] [color=black]DFI LanParty UT nF3 250Gb Socket 754 Motherboard[/color] [color=black]AMD Athlon 64 3400+ @ 2.52GHz W/ Zalman CNPS7000b-Cu CPU Cooler[/color] [color=black]1GB Corsair Value PC3200 (512mb x 2, 2.5-3-3-8 1T)[/color] [color=black]eVGA e-GeForce 6800GT AGP @ 370/1100 W/ Zalman VF700-Cu VGA Cooler[/color] [color=black]Western Digital Caviar SE 80GB SATA HDD [/color] [color=black]Creative Audigy 2 ZS Sound Card[/color] [color=black]Rosewill RE502 500W Power Supply[/color]

Feb 17, 2005, 04:03 AM	#23
ColdPenguin ***** goon Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 110 Rep Power: 0	Just focus on quality. Because quality is performance. Because if the image quality is good you will not have to turn on Anti-Aliasing and Anistropic Filtering. Therefore quality=performance. Now if you make a driver that produces the same image quality on 0x AF as a normal driver with 2x AF BUT it runs slower, then that it is not an IQ improvement but instead a step backward, simply because the normal driver in that circumstance would have the same IQ (assuming the user had the insight to enable 2x AF) at a faster frame rate. Basically true image quality should be defined as quality divided by frame rate if you get my drift. Well it makes perfect sense to me. __________________

Feb 17, 2005, 05:54 AM	#24
Shaga Intelligent Life Form Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Nordic Region Posts: 383 Rep Power: 48 System Specs	I have a new 3dcard, and I didn't buy this to see games as I saw them with my old ati radeon 9200se. I like to see excellent quality without non-playable fps. I like the idea of releasing retrosets at times. So quality sets would be your goal but when nvidia releases some drivers with bad quality and excellent performance especially with older cards, you could start making retro set of it. I even like the word 'retro' so it could be included in the driver sets name Now time to get my ass back to work. __________________ Server: Currently Offline

Feb 17, 2005, 05:56 AM	#25
Shaga Intelligent Life Form Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Nordic Region Posts: 383 Rep Power: 48 System Specs	And one point to add, quality means stability as well __________________ Server: Currently Offline

Feb 17, 2005, 08:21 AM	#28
BWX unplugged Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: USNY Posts: 19,669 Rep Power: 110 System Specs	When are these DHzeropoint Cats coming out? Will they incorporate the CCC or not? __________________

Feb 17, 2005, 09:06 AM	#29
Shaga Intelligent Life Form Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Nordic Region Posts: 383 Rep Power: 48 System Specs	Retro forever! I miss my "retro computer", now it's too hard to get linux up and running.. __________________ Server: Currently Offline

Feb 17, 2005, 09:12 AM	#30
starfury6 Dark Jedi Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Essex, England Posts: 334 Rep Power: 0 System Specs	Quality with the occasional Perf set would be cool __________________ [color=DeepSkyBlue][/color] [color=DeepSkyBlue] Intel Q6600 / Dual 8800 GTS 512/ Asus Striker II Formula OCZ 4GB DDR2 1066 / Scythe Ninja / Hyper 880w 3 x Maxtor 750GB total SATAII / LG Multi Blu[/color]