Refresh Rate Bug?

Vany7777 · Apr 7, 2005, 05:38 AM

I'm currently using my 17' Samsung 172X LCD, and there seems to be a problem with the recommended refresh rate settings laid out in the drivers dated 12/7/2003. The Samsung 172X is supposed to be able to do 75Hz at 1280x1024. And it can. However, in my display properties, I have to uncheck the "Hide modes that this monitor cannot display" box in order to get the refresh rate passed 70Hz. What gives? Is there a fix for this? A new set of monitor drivers that I'm not aware of? My own search hasn't turned up anything, but I know there are a few 172X users on this board, so that's why I'm asking.

I'm running the latest Omega drivers.

cswiger · Apr 7, 2005, 06:54 AM

I've had almost exactly the same issues with a Viewsonic VX900 (1280x1024), which can do up to 75Hz, but the driver really wants to run at 70 Hz. It hasn't been my experience that installing updated monitor info files will help. Apparently 1280x1024x70 Hz is a relatively standard VESA mode, so the ATI driver seems to prefer it.

You can force 75 Hz in the driver, and/or set the flat panel properties to "Use desktop refresh rate", but these options seem to interact with the "display image centered" versus the "scale image to panel size" options in wierd ways (ie, the scaling won't work, or will only display a tiny portion of the image magnified many times to fill the entire screen).

I hope this reply was more useful than just a "me too", but yeah, I'm seeing the same kinda thing. I hope these issues can get sorted out...

theonlybabyface · Apr 7, 2005, 06:26 PM

I wouldn't worry too much about it as LCD's don't need the higher refresh rates the way CRT's do. It doesn't work the same way as it does for CRT's.

cswiger · Apr 7, 2005, 08:51 PM

Older LCDs only ran at 60 Hz, and had such a slow response rate (70+ ms), that trying to run them faster wouldn't really help the display quality. Newer LCD's with response times less than 30-40 ms will result in a noticably better display when you run them at 70 or 75Hz rather than 60: there is less flicker and less persistence or ghosting of the last frame displayed. It's really easy to show the difference simply by scrolling a window in 2D mode, at least going from 60 to 70.

There is still some improvement going from 70 to 75, but it's not as noticeable.

The_Neon_Cowboy · Apr 8, 2005, 03:25 AM

You realise you can edit the inf's? But don't add anything it doesn't support

the drivers i found on samsungs site are here
http://org.downloadcenter.samsung.co...906_SM172X.zip

Vany7777 · Apr 8, 2005, 11:26 AM

Well, the reason I want to run my LCD at 75Hz is because a) that's what its capable of, and b) I use V-Sync with Triple Buffering (via DXTweaker) in all my games and I would like to have the highest refresh rate cap possible.

How do I edit the .inf files? Where are they located?

Vany7777 · Apr 11, 2005, 04:04 PM

Can anyone give me anymore information on this?

cswiger · Apr 11, 2005, 09:33 PM

Try downloading the .INF files for your display from the mfr's website again. Open 'em up in Wordpad, try changing the entry for 1280x1024@70 Hz to being 75Hz, and then go to Display properties, go to Advanced, go to the monitors tab, and load your changed version of the INF file there.

If that doesn't do it, you can use CCC or PowerStrip to force the display to run at a specific res & refresh rate. If using CCC, alsp try changing the D3D refresh override tab from "default" (meaning 60Hz) to "same as desktop".

HeavySnarker · Apr 17, 2005, 01:07 AM

I'm running my laptop lcd monitor at 100 Hz after I found out about this option. There doesn't seem to be any visible difference except that my mouse moves a lot faster.

Is there anything good or bad about changing the refresh rate of an lcd monitor?

ChoGGi · Apr 17, 2005, 02:19 AM

http://www.dansdata.com/gz021.htm

Quote:

LCDs don't have a refresh rate, in the CRT sense. They've got pixel response time (often slow enough that high-frame-rate video, especially games, will blur somewhat; that's another great LCD feature right there), but they don't flicker at all. The response time tells you how quickly pixels can change colour, not how often the whole screen's refreshed.

edit: the article is a bit old as pixel response time has improved

Apr 7, 2005, 05:38 AM	#1
Vany7777 DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	Refresh Rate Bug? I'm currently using my 17' Samsung 172X LCD, and there seems to be a problem with the recommended refresh rate settings laid out in the drivers dated 12/7/2003. The Samsung 172X is supposed to be able to do 75Hz at 1280x1024. And it can. However, in my display properties, I have to uncheck the "Hide modes that this monitor cannot display" box in order to get the refresh rate passed 70Hz. What gives? Is there a fix for this? A new set of monitor drivers that I'm not aware of? My own search hasn't turned up anything, but I know there are a few 172X users on this board, so that's why I'm asking. I'm running the latest Omega drivers. __________________ [color=Black] -\~{[/color][color=Red]My Own, Personal Rig[/color][color=Black]}[/color][color=Black]~/-[/color] [color=SeaGreen]Lian Li PC60B Plus Mid-Tower Case[/color] [color=SeaGreen] AMD Athlon 64 3200+ @ 2.4 GHz ("Winchester") Zalman CNPS7700-CU[/color][color=SeaGreen] 2 GB of OCZ Platinum EL PC-3200 (2-3-2-5, 1T[/color][color=SeaGreen]) DFI "LAN Party" UT nF4 Ultra-D Motherboard ATI Radeon X800 XL @ 450/1,080 MHz AC ATI Silencer 5 (Rev. 2) Creative Labs SB Audigy 2 ZS Samsung 120GB SATA HDD Ultra X-Connect 500W PSU Samsung 172X 17" LCD Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX[/color]

Apr 7, 2005, 06:54 AM	#2
cswiger DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 233 Rep Power: 0	I've had almost exactly the same issues with a Viewsonic VX900 (1280x1024), which can do up to 75Hz, but the driver really wants to run at 70 Hz. It hasn't been my experience that installing updated monitor info files will help. Apparently 1280x1024x70 Hz is a relatively standard VESA mode, so the ATI driver seems to prefer it. You can force 75 Hz in the driver, and/or set the flat panel properties to "Use desktop refresh rate", but these options seem to interact with the "display image centered" versus the "scale image to panel size" options in wierd ways (ie, the scaling won't work, or will only display a tiny portion of the image magnified many times to fill the entire screen). I hope this reply was more useful than just a "me too", but yeah, I'm seeing the same kinda thing. I hope these issues can get sorted out... __________________ Do you remember Shalebridge Cradle? Beware! The Cradle doesn't forget.... AMD Opteron 185 @ 2.6GHz/200HTT \| 2GB G.Skill DDR3200 @ 2-3-2-5/1T \| 512MB eVGA 8800GT @ 600/1800 \| SB Audigy 2ZS eX, Outlaw 1050 6.1ch amp, Paradigm speakers \| MSI K8N Diamond Plus mainboard \| black Lian-Li USB68 case + Foxconn FX600-GLN 600W PSU \| 2xWDC3200AAKS (RAID1) \| Sony GDM-F500R CRT, BENQ G2400W LCD

Apr 7, 2005, 08:51 PM	#4
cswiger DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 233 Rep Power: 0	Older LCDs only ran at 60 Hz, and had such a slow response rate (70+ ms), that trying to run them faster wouldn't really help the display quality. Newer LCD's with response times less than 30-40 ms will result in a noticably better display when you run them at 70 or 75Hz rather than 60: there is less flicker and less persistence or ghosting of the last frame displayed. It's really easy to show the difference simply by scrolling a window in 2D mode, at least going from 60 to 70. There is still some improvement going from 70 to 75, but it's not as noticeable. __________________ Do you remember Shalebridge Cradle? Beware! The Cradle doesn't forget.... AMD Opteron 185 @ 2.6GHz/200HTT \| 2GB G.Skill DDR3200 @ 2-3-2-5/1T \| 512MB eVGA 8800GT @ 600/1800 \| SB Audigy 2ZS eX, Outlaw 1050 6.1ch amp, Paradigm speakers \| MSI K8N Diamond Plus mainboard \| black Lian-Li USB68 case + Foxconn FX600-GLN 600W PSU \| 2xWDC3200AAKS (RAID1) \| Sony GDM-F500R CRT, BENQ G2400W LCD

Apr 8, 2005, 03:25 AM	#5
The_Neon_Cowboy HardwareHeaven Extreme Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: U.S.A. Posts: 16,009 Rep Power: 92 System Specs	You realise you can edit the inf's? But don't add anything it doesn't support the drivers i found on samsungs site are here http://org.downloadcenter.samsung.co...906_SM172X.zip __________________

Apr 8, 2005, 11:26 AM	Thread Starter #6
Vany7777 DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	Well, the reason I want to run my LCD at 75Hz is because a) that's what its capable of, and b) I use V-Sync with Triple Buffering (via DXTweaker) in all my games and I would like to have the highest refresh rate cap possible. How do I edit the .inf files? Where are they located? __________________ [color=Black] -\~{[/color][color=Red]My Own, Personal Rig[/color][color=Black]}[/color][color=Black]~/-[/color] [color=SeaGreen]Lian Li PC60B Plus Mid-Tower Case[/color] [color=SeaGreen] AMD Athlon 64 3200+ @ 2.4 GHz ("Winchester") Zalman CNPS7700-CU[/color][color=SeaGreen] 2 GB of OCZ Platinum EL PC-3200 (2-3-2-5, 1T[/color][color=SeaGreen]) DFI "LAN Party" UT nF4 Ultra-D Motherboard ATI Radeon X800 XL @ 450/1,080 MHz AC ATI Silencer 5 (Rev. 2) Creative Labs SB Audigy 2 ZS Samsung 120GB SATA HDD Ultra X-Connect 500W PSU Samsung 172X 17" LCD Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX[/color]

Apr 7, 2005, 06:26 PM	#3
theonlybabyface GO CANUCKS GO!!! Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 129 Rep Power: 0	I wouldn't worry too much about it as LCD's don't need the higher refresh rates the way CRT's do. It doesn't work the same way as it does for CRT's.

Apr 11, 2005, 04:04 PM	Thread Starter #7
Vany7777 DriverHeaven Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 37 Rep Power: 0	Can anyone give me anymore information on this? __________________ [color=Black] -\~{[/color][color=Red]My Own, Personal Rig[/color][color=Black]}[/color][color=Black]~/-[/color] [color=SeaGreen]Lian Li PC60B Plus Mid-Tower Case[/color] [color=SeaGreen] AMD Athlon 64 3200+ @ 2.4 GHz ("Winchester") Zalman CNPS7700-CU[/color][color=SeaGreen] 2 GB of OCZ Platinum EL PC-3200 (2-3-2-5, 1T[/color][color=SeaGreen]) DFI "LAN Party" UT nF4 Ultra-D Motherboard ATI Radeon X800 XL @ 450/1,080 MHz AC ATI Silencer 5 (Rev. 2) Creative Labs SB Audigy 2 ZS Samsung 120GB SATA HDD Ultra X-Connect 500W PSU Samsung 172X 17" LCD Klipsch ProMedia 2.1 THX[/color]

Apr 11, 2005, 09:33 PM	#8
cswiger DriverHeaven Addict Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 233 Rep Power: 0	Try downloading the .INF files for your display from the mfr's website again. Open 'em up in Wordpad, try changing the entry for 1280x1024@70 Hz to being 75Hz, and then go to Display properties, go to Advanced, go to the monitors tab, and load your changed version of the INF file there. If that doesn't do it, you can use CCC or PowerStrip to force the display to run at a specific res & refresh rate. If using CCC, alsp try changing the D3D refresh override tab from "default" (meaning 60Hz) to "same as desktop". __________________ Do you remember Shalebridge Cradle? Beware! The Cradle doesn't forget.... AMD Opteron 185 @ 2.6GHz/200HTT \| 2GB G.Skill DDR3200 @ 2-3-2-5/1T \| 512MB eVGA 8800GT @ 600/1800 \| SB Audigy 2ZS eX, Outlaw 1050 6.1ch amp, Paradigm speakers \| MSI K8N Diamond Plus mainboard \| black Lian-Li USB68 case + Foxconn FX600-GLN 600W PSU \| 2xWDC3200AAKS (RAID1) \| Sony GDM-F500R CRT, BENQ G2400W LCD

Apr 17, 2005, 01:07 AM	#9
HeavySnarker DriverHeaven Newbie Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 11 Rep Power: 0	I'm running my laptop lcd monitor at 100 Hz after I found out about this option. There doesn't seem to be any visible difference except that my mouse moves a lot faster. Is there anything good or bad about changing the refresh rate of an lcd monitor?