Wolfdale/Yorkfield overclocking thread...

Discussion in 'Overclocking, Benching & Modding' started by Lowfat, Jan 28, 2008.

  1. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    well, the room temp is getting even high and it's like a room with 35C or more right now.

    [​IMG]

    this overclock setting has been testing by myself for sometime now, i can either use a more lower vcore setting with an increase on the other voltage setting, or i can use a high vcore setting like this one.

    anyways, let me talk a little about what i think on the CPU's core temp (as i've been seeing some were having some questions about it),
    when running a test on your system don't relay on the core temp that are reading by any programs (likes core temp, real temp, speedfan, etc), instead, check and monitor the temp before the TJ Max.

    the CPU's core temp reading on the programs is all upto you. if you are using a cool room for your computer system, then you may want to set a lower TJ Max value like 85-90C, or if your computer room is a very warm room, then you might want to set a more higher TJ Max value, likes 95C-105C. so when the system is in idle you may get a more accurate temp reading.


    for an example, if i believe this correct, here's the core temp value during the system (with the 462 FSB overclocked setting above) is in idle.

    real temp, core temp and everest shows the same CPU's core temps (when the same TJMax value is in use on all 3 programs).

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2008
  2. swimtech

    swimtech Well-Known Member

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    I think lowering the TJ Max setting might be dangerous in that the program would be badly underreporting temps at load - which is what most folks will think to read if they are not remembering to pay close attention. I don't understand why the program would report idle temps better though either, because the TJ Max setting doesn't actually change the lack of sensor accuracy at low temps. The difference in idle temp figures between cores is because of that lack of accuracy, and calibration is just supposed to equalize the inaccuracy across the differing core sensors at idle, isn't it?

    It would take some retraining for most folks, I think, to ignore the temp figures and look instead at the Difference to TJ Max figure.

    Do you think this is more accurate than going through the calibration procedure? I did that recently btw...
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2008
  3. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    oh i didn't try to stop people to monitor their core temp reading.
    what is your Intel officially TJMax value for your CPU anyway?

    [​IMG]
     
  4. swimtech

    swimtech Well-Known Member

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    Oh, of course - I know you're just doing your thing - it's neat to see too.

    About the TJMax for the Q6600 - no one knows for sure and Intel hasn't yet published that figure for my processor. I use the TJMax figure that the author of RealTemp suggests because it seems he's done a decent analysis of what it likely is - he's tried very hard to be accurate. I use the 95C figure.

    I've gone through the calibration procedure he outlines with a thermometer, and I have the advantage of having a stable room temperature of 23C (give or take just 1C). Note below that applying the calibration factors changes the Distance to TJ Max figures when, by my understanding, it really shouldn't. However, the idle temps shown are now evened out, and stay within one or two degrees of one another when the cores are evenly loaded during stress testing.

    [​IMG]

    And, at all times, I just look to keep the max temp below 71C - even during stress testing - as outlined by Intel. Actually haven't ever exceeded 64C or so at any time so far as reported by RealTemp.
     
  5. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    after i've already finished all the overclocking i don't really care about the core temp thing since i don't what CPU's core temp value i should be using either.

    i think, this particular Q9300 system will be set at 462x7.5 since it doesn't use much voltage or gives much heat to the room at all.
    when i actually use the system duing the days it's far more cooler, i never have any problem with system over heating, i'll probably reduce the case fans to a minimum.

    here's some of abit more info about the TJMax and DTS...
    TSK's Crazy Theory on TJmax and the DTS - Overclock.net - Overclocking.net
     
  6. swimtech

    swimtech Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, crazy - not. Nice read...

    It really doesn't make sense from all I've learned and seen for the past 35 years that there would be much difference in Tcase and Tcore at idle. The IHS is designed to conduct heat very well and does its job, no doubt, otherwise Intel would be living in recall city!

    About the descrepancy in Distance to TJmax in my screenshot, well, looks like unclewebb just hasn't gotten around to adjusting that displayed figure in his software with repsect to the entered calibration factors is all. TJmax should not change, it is a practical absolute for each processor stepping (well, withing manufacturing tolerances, which are extremely tight I would think...).

    That was why I was wondering about why you were moving the TJmax figure around so much - I thought you might have found something but just didn't explain it yet...

    Edit: And with the cooling you have available in that case of yours now your 3.465Ghz overclock looks like where I would settle too, and your volts - that's a fast system for sure!
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2008
  7. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    so far the 462x7.5 is my favorite overclocking on this system, it give a good performance on both CPU/RAM.
    475-480x7.5 (3.56-3.6GHz) didn’t seem to give much of a more CPU/RAM performance and the overclocking will require me having to use quite a bit more volts on the system, as well as, this can also means more heat that i have to control them.

    right now the motherboard's DIMM slots are right beneath CPU cooler and i don't like that i'm not able to go into the DIMM slots without openning the whole front or top section of my computer case.
    so i plan to replace the CPU cooler to something that is much smaller and i will do this when i decide to put in a new RAM kit in this system (these 2 RAM kits is needed for my P35-DS4 based board computer). i can't remove the whole board and rebulid the system with a new CPU cooler and RAM at this time around, i haven't gotten out to check on some new computer parts yet.

    about the core temp, i just noticed that whether you like to believe and set any TJMax values on the software program, the Distance to TJmax were moving the same. as far as i know, there are users out there don't understand why the core temp figure on their CPU during idle are much higher than (or in some cases, lower than) the room temperature, i mean they already checked all the things, case fans, CPU's heatsinkfans, no overclock, and all.
    so it's like the OP's post in that forum (on the very first post), he seems to believe the TJMax value for his CPU was more like 75C (not 85C or 95C). the lower TJMax values you set the lower core temp is reported by the software programs.
     
  8. swimtech

    swimtech Well-Known Member

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    Oh sure, I see you can set the TJmax and read the program's displayed Distance to TJmax that way - it's definitely consistent and relative.

    I think, from that thread and unclewebb's input and all, what I got from it was that TJMax is really Tcase + 20 or 25c (I need to read it again, and the Intel specs, to be more accurate though...) for the desktop processors for which Intel doesn't publish the figure for.

    You've found your sweet spot along the same criteria that I found mine. It was about real performance balanced against power usage/stress on the system for both of us I think. After a point, performance reaches a point of diminishing returns versus power usage. I'm thinking it would look like a so-called J curve when plotted on a graph. The key is finding the spot just before the plot turns upward exponentially.

    We've found ours, and I noticed your voltage is almost .05v less than mine - which is almost exactly the same as the difference between Intel's own rated maximum voltages for our respective processors. Yours is 1.45v, mine is 1.50. How 'bout that!
     
  9. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    i think just like the real temp owner has mentiond, that the Dts should not be use to report idle temperature,
    and since i don't know for sure about the TJmax value on my CPU's i will have to use program like core temp and real temp as an overclocking tool only.
     
  10. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    just succeeded in overclock Q9300 to 450 FSB using 4x1GB D9 based RAM modules and at a low vdimm voltage.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    Intel Will Disclose DTS Specs At IDF - Tom's Hardware





    Intel Developer Forum (IDF) 2008 to Include Presentation on 45nm Core 2 DTS Specification (Link: AnandTech )

     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2008
  12. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    The Wolfdale Vtt ( FSB Termination ) game.Place your bet! - XtremeSystems Forums

     
  13. Lowfat

    Lowfat Xtreme

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    I won't think it will die personally.
     
  14. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    i don't know, but it's interesting to me to know little bit about those overclock voltage settings.
    i used to had my first Wolfdale E8200 to every volts on P35 and 965P DS4's boards on both vNB and vFSB, and vCore upto 1.7V, on several overclock attemps, i thought it was survive, also thought the CPU was unbelievable cool.


     
  15. RoyBatty

    RoyBatty Well-Known Member

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    Hi PangingJr, I come from the Show your rig off thread :)
    I tried to overclock my Q9450 and watched the temps. The overclock was done by simply upping the FSB to 400 MHz, not touching anything else (I think that the vCore set by the MB is quite high...).
    These temps were measured with opened case and the air temperature inside the case was slightly over 28°C.

    [​IMG]

    And I'm going to email Noctua support and ask about the cooler base flatness...
     
  16. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    imageshack doesn't seem to working at all at my end right now, so i'll need to check back on your post again later.
     
  17. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    True Black 120 2x 1200rmp fans + MX-2
    [​IMG]

    room 24C, computer case was fully closed.
    [​IMG]


    compared to previous cooler, GeminII 2x 1500rmp fans
    [​IMG]


    ============================


    a quick test of using vCore at 1.30V, 458 FSB, room 26C.
    (True Black 120 2x 1200rmp fans + MX-2)

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2008
  18. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    test running vCore at 1.36V and Q9300 running at 3.6GHz (480 FSB).
    (True Black 120 2x 1200rmp fans + MX-2)

    [​IMG]
     
  19. PangingJr

    PangingJr Member

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    could you post a pic of the CPU cooler base and its mounting kit or point me to the product web page that has a pic of them?

    and btw, do you have any problem with your overclocking? in the case that you want any info from me, please just ask me, or in PM is okay too.
     
  20. RoyBatty

    RoyBatty Well-Known Member

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    Here is a review with good pics: Noctua NH-U12P Heatsink

    And thanks, right now I don't need to overclock, but when I do I will ask :)
     

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